IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2008-07-16
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01:52:32 <dvdb> i am looking for a trainset which railroad cars have a high passenger capacity
01:53:01 <dvdb> the standard passenger car has a capacity of 40 passengers.
02:03:08 <ArmEagle> well, you can download one and use the grfcodec to change the capacity yourself :)
02:04:35 <dvdb> ArmEagle: my english is to bad to read tutorials and I went on Friday in holyday. so i hoped that there exists something
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07:32:02 <Yorick> wtf...the ai built me a signalled trainline without 90-deg turns
07:33:04 <Noldo> what are the odds of that!
07:36:55 <Rubidium> Yorick: but there is a 90 degree turn
07:37:08 <Yorick> shh, only because it made signals
07:37:12 <Rubidium> there are actually 2
07:37:44 <Yorick> I haven't seen it making junctions before, so I'm proud of it :)
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07:43:00 <Yorick> it's got 43 trains now
07:43:39 <Ammler> Yorick: you should make a ai for noai which behaves like the original ai... :-)
07:45:25 <Yorick> it is if I want any support
07:45:41 <Yorick> hmm, is that original ai supposed to be learning?
07:46:39 <Yorick> or is it my imagination that thinks it's making train junctions
07:48:51 <Yorick> I'll make a giant screenshot
07:50:25 <Ammler> but host it on faster server, please.
07:55:01 <SpComb> bah, too hard to get to the file
07:56:05 <SpComb> shouldn't everyone have their own hosting in some form or another these days?
07:56:28 <Yorick> I don't like paying for that
07:57:17 <SpComb> Yorick: then buy some cheap VPS or something
07:57:58 <Yorick> then I still need a domain
08:00:05 <SpComb> well, domains do have some kind of value
08:01:14 <SpComb> and you can get sensible subdomains for free, e.g. eu.org
08:11:29 <Celestar> I've overloaded one of my hubs
08:15:10 <Rubidium> you can only make an AI like the original AI when it cheats like hell and doesn't pay for terraforming
08:15:38 <Rubidium> which is IMO one of the bad things of the current AI
08:32:30 <Kommer> Yorick: a domain costs 15 euro's a year.. thats not much? or host it on your own computer :)
08:34:53 * fmauNeko pays his domain around 6 euros a year :p
08:43:34 <Celestar> Rubidium: 420000 delivered cargo. I'm getting there :P
08:43:48 <Rubidium> how big is your map?
08:44:57 <Celestar> but it's only a single cargo type
08:48:12 <Rubidium> so you should get to 500,000*64/11 ;)
08:49:46 <Celestar> is this a challenge? :P
08:50:21 <Rubidium> if you're up to it ;)
08:50:38 <Celestar> dunno if I have enough houses to produce that number of passengers
08:51:11 <Rubidium> you only need 7 times as many passengers to transport
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08:52:05 <Celestar> I've not yet connected every hamlet on the map
08:53:40 <Celestar> I'm already at 25% CPU load :P
08:54:56 <Celestar> want me to profile it?
08:55:02 <peter1138> hmm, 1k is typical?
08:55:11 * peter1138 usually plays at 256
08:55:13 <Celestar> most play that size meanwhile :P
08:57:39 <Noldo> with yapp-patch but without using yapp features might be the interesting to profile
08:59:02 <Yorick> it's around 10% slower
08:59:34 <Celestar> Yorick: where's the loss of speed?
08:59:49 <Yorick> at least on fast-forward ;)
09:00:17 <Ammler> Did you ever think about special extensions for the tar files?
09:00:31 <peter1138> It wasn't 10% slower for me.
09:00:36 <Ammler> .tar for grfs and noai will confuse people...
09:01:28 <Yorick> the .tar for 32bpp and noai
09:01:39 <Yorick> they have the same format, I'll confuse
09:02:32 <Celestar> does multistop work with drive through stop?s
09:02:34 <Ammler> something like trg and tai or so :-)
09:04:06 <peter1138> What does you mean by the same format?
09:04:29 <Ammler> Celestar: do you use trunk head?
09:05:06 <Yorick> they would both look the same
09:05:19 <peter1138> Should we not use zip for noai or something then?
09:05:34 <peter1138> Silly keyboard, typing words I don't want.
09:05:49 <Noldo> windows doesn't have problems with that kind of filename?
09:05:56 <Rubidium> Yorick: you can do that, right?
09:06:12 <planetmaker> I prefer yorick's destinction of different tar files - helps to keep an overview
09:06:38 <Ammler> tar files should also show, if they already have the grf inside :-)
09:06:40 <Rubidium> yeah, placing AIs in another directory than the graphics does too
09:06:57 <peter1138> tar is a standard archive format...
09:06:58 <planetmaker> myfancy.grf.tar mydominating.ai.tar :P
09:07:04 <Celestar> peter1138: gotta disappoint you
09:07:12 <Yorick> but that does not work at download
09:07:46 <planetmaker> Yorick: what doesn't work for download? filenames with several '.' ?
09:07:56 <peter1138> Celestar: What's that supposed to be?
09:08:09 <Rubidium> and several dots in filenames doesn't work on DOS ;)
09:08:20 <Yorick> planetmaker: no, when stuff is downloaded, users can't actually know if it's an ai or a grf
09:08:29 <Celestar> peter1138: no . right profile. That'S a 150-train game with yapp :D
09:08:30 <Yorick> Rubidium: we don't use DOS, do we?
09:08:44 <Ammler> Rubidium: shouldn't you name files like they are no directories?
09:08:46 <Rubidium> orudge made a POC DOS binary not long ago
09:08:48 <peter1138> Yorick: Surely if you're downloading it... you know what it is?
09:08:59 <peter1138> Celestar: Right, but a profile on its own means nothing.
09:09:21 <Yorick> peter1138: some people are just stupid
09:09:26 <peter1138> Yorick: Yes, you are.
09:09:43 <Celestar> peter1138: true, but yet the blitter takes most of the effort
09:10:01 * orudge never quite got around to finishing the video driver however, as it was being a pain
09:10:10 <Yorick> but I mean the "hmm, where does that file go...hey, a bin! *drags to recycle bin*"-kind
09:10:10 <peter1138> Celestar: So what am I being disappointed about?
09:10:20 <planetmaker> Celestar: I think the point is to make a differential profiling analysis - and compare the impact :)
09:10:24 <Rubidium> add .console.exe for Windows console applications, and ..netcrap.exe for .NET crap and such too?
09:10:33 <Rubidium> and .gui.exe if it contains a GUI?
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09:10:51 <Celestar> peter1138: about yapp eating all my CPU :P
09:11:09 <Rubidium> maybe .application.zip for zips containing applications and .graphics.zip when it contains graphics?
09:11:09 <Yorick> ok, other example...what if you find a directory full of tars
09:11:18 <planetmaker> especially for a game where yapp is not used, but compiled in the binary compared to the same game, but yapp not compiled to the binary
09:11:21 <Yorick> and you want to use them all
09:11:44 <peter1138> Celestar: Ah, well, I wasn't the one who profiled it as using up to 10% more.
09:12:11 <Yorick> that would be rubidium, I think
09:13:45 <Rubidium> Yorick: the filename should be descriptive enough, anything else is just pointless complexification of making the tar and loading it
09:14:15 <Yorick> what did you think I was suggesting...
09:14:32 <Yorick> "the filename should be descriptive enough"
09:15:09 <Rubidium> you were suggesting forcing .tai or whatever variation thereof (i.e. an extension) to be the way to tell it what it is
09:15:20 <Rubidium> and now what does Windows do by default?
09:15:47 <planetmaker> [11:02] <Ammler> something like trg and tai or so :-)
09:16:10 <planetmaker> [11:05] <Yorick> better .ai.tar
09:16:18 <Rubidium> that's also an extension
09:16:23 <Vikthor> Yorick: I think best would be to leave it to authors of said files
09:16:29 <Yorick> but it will show the .ai
09:16:53 <Vikthor> it's the same as in adding w to windows palette grf's
09:17:05 <Vikthor> you are not required to do so, but everybody does
09:17:11 <blathijs> Vikthor: Having a recommendation for authors improves consistency, which is not bad
09:17:29 <Rubidium> but forcing someone to use a specific format is bad
09:17:33 * Celestar goes installing KDE4.1rc1
09:17:42 <Ammler> Vikthor: but it needs suggested, that why I am asking
09:18:00 <Yorick> rubidium: forcing someone to not use a specific format is even worse
09:18:02 <planetmaker> yeah, but changing the file extension is bad imo
09:18:10 <Ammler> because currently nobody does. Either 32bpp authors and AI devs.
09:18:11 <Rubidium> MyAIThingy.ai.tar <- why the extra ai?
09:18:14 <planetmaker> having a convention for filenames is good, though
09:18:15 <blathijs> Rubidium: Unless you want to do some filtering based on filename/extension, but it's probably enough to simply assume that everything in some directory is of the right kind
09:19:00 <Rubidium> it is in distinctly different directories (unless someone starts playing with (sym)links)
09:19:06 <planetmaker> Rubidium: it indeed enhances readability of the dir contents
09:19:38 <Rubidium> planetmaker: what directory?
09:19:39 <planetmaker> or, if you find a file posted and just download it now - and have a badly sorted download dir :P - a typical user error :D
09:22:25 <planetmaker> well... it doesn't hurt no one to name files according to their usage.
09:23:03 <planetmaker> but then I'm a person who found a tar bug with too long file names for multiple-file archives :P
09:23:08 <Rubidium> the why aren't the newgrfs in your ottdcoop pack?
09:24:03 <planetmaker> Rubidium: the grf pack is just putting the files as they are provided... we have no right to modify :)
09:24:05 <Rubidium> ecswood.industry.windows.grf ukrs.trains.windows.grf etc.
09:24:08 <Ammler> [11:18] <Rubidium> MyAIThingy.ai.tar <- why the extra ai? <-- convoy.tar
09:24:39 <planetmaker> Rubidium: indeed I like the naming scheme sketched by you more :)
09:24:45 <planetmaker> makes clear what the file does
09:24:58 <Rubidium> so forcing something just for the case when someone failed to make it clear it was an AI
09:25:19 <Ammler> canset.trains.indusytry.snowline.etc.grf
09:25:26 <planetmaker> Rubidium: it's not forcing as it works without. But it's about recommending
09:25:52 <peter1138> Open the tar and you shall see...
09:26:14 <Ammler> yeah, I fear you need to do that 1. time.
09:26:27 <Ammler> specially to check if the grf is inside too.
09:27:30 <planetmaker> like it's a good idea to have a current virus scanner - but you're not required to
09:29:26 <Yorick> how to set custom fonts on openttd?
09:29:59 <Yorick> "open your configurationfile and add a desired font for small/medium/-and large_font" but there is no large_font, small_font or medium_font
09:30:22 <Rubidium> then your openttd doesn't support it
09:30:47 <Rubidium> build without freetype support and such
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09:53:42 <Yorick> ld: cannot find -lintl
09:54:33 <fmauNeko> Yorick: gettext-devel ?
09:54:56 <dih> where is the difference between PlayerByte and PlayerID ?
09:55:03 <fmauNeko> Yorick: libintl is in gettext :p
09:55:31 <Yorick> dih: probably in player_type.h
09:55:51 <Yorick> fmauNeko: and why does it want gettext
09:55:56 <dih> i did not ask WHERE it is i asked where the DIFFERENCE is
09:57:18 <Yorick> playerID is type Owner
09:57:30 <Noldo> dih: one is TineEnumT<Owner> other
09:58:42 <Noldo> What is that TinyEnumT<> anyway?
09:58:43 <dih> but then the Player struct holds 'index' which is PlayerByte
10:01:10 <Rubidium> PlayerID is an enum of undefined size, PlayerByte is a 'wrapper' for that enum with defined size
10:01:33 <Rubidium> and the defined size is needed if one wants to use OTTD's savegame mechanism
10:03:09 <dih> what is it's size Rubidium ?
10:07:59 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r13708 /branches/0.6/ (12 files in 2 dirs):
10:08:01 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: [0.6] -Backport from trunk:
10:08:01 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: - Fix: Possible buffer overflow in string truncation code (r13700)
10:08:03 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: - Fix: Handle SETX(Y) properly when truncating a string instead of ignoring it and returning a too long string (r13699)
10:08:03 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: - Fix: In some cases the (sound) mixer could overflow causing artefacts in the sound [FS#2120] (r13695)
10:08:05 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: - Fix: Do not rely on .tar files always ending with a block of zeros (r13693)
10:08:05 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: - Fix: Make sure a command is ran in the context of autoreplace or not (r13691)
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10:14:02 <Yorick> you should not only do r13693, but also the fix to it ;)
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10:18:57 <Rubidium> there is no fix for 13693
10:20:16 <Rubidium> but it's totally pointless to add that to the 0.6.2-RC1 changelog
10:20:44 <peter1138> I didn't realise Yorick was our project manager now.
10:21:27 * Yorick pays celestar a cookie
10:21:40 <ln> Gekz: do you know someone whose nick begins with Y that is not a project manager?
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10:23:59 <Gekz> New Caledonia kicked ass btw.
10:24:21 <Gekz> My French speaking is now +1.
10:25:00 <Celestar> when is 0.6.2RC1 planned for release?
10:25:14 <Rubidium> somewhere in the future?
10:26:05 <Celestar> are we measuring it in microseconds? :P
10:26:38 <dih> if you want to watch numbers change all the time for weeks, you can if you like
10:27:33 <Yorick> we are measuring it in square pieces of Rubidium
10:29:08 * Celestar pulls off his sock and stuffs it into Yorick's trap :P
10:32:13 <Rubidium> Celestar: if you want to count in µs: going to take at least millions of them ;)
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10:35:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> err... where did that come from?
10:35:21 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r13709 /branches/0.6/src/lang/ (20 files): [0.6] -Backport from trunk: language updates.
10:37:19 <Celestar> do we still support NO_DEBUG_MESSAGES?
10:38:00 <Celestar> because it fails compiling :D
10:40:01 <Celestar> Rubidium: we have direct reference to _debug_SOMETHING_level in .cpp files. with NO_DEBUG_MESSAGES, they don'T exist. the question is whether just to do an #ifndef NO_DEBUG_MESSAGES around those parts of the code
10:41:33 <TiberiusTeng> Rubidium, I hava a little question about that PNG loading stuff in spritecache.cpp
10:41:53 <Rubidium> and you're asking me? :)
10:41:55 <Celestar> Rubidium: and no, SmatZ broke it, not me :P
10:42:16 <TiberiusTeng> why isn't the PNG being loaded at the same time with GRF sprite, but before any non-sprite checking/loading stuff ?
10:42:30 <TiberiusTeng> because you commited that fix in trunk, r13692 :p
10:42:53 <Celestar> SmatZ: yeah, for example (we have other places too)
10:43:00 <Rubidium> Celestar: like where?
10:43:11 <Celestar> Rubidium: like gamelog.cpp:120,324
10:43:28 <Rubidium> npf is guarded by ifdef
10:43:34 <Rubidium> and openttd.cpp is also gamelog
10:43:45 <TiberiusTeng> IMO if the PNG is used to replace some GRF sprites, it should be loaded when we actually try to load the GRF sprite ...
10:43:55 <TiberiusTeng> so I was wondering why spritecache.cpp doing that
10:43:59 <Celestar> Rubidium: good point :D
10:44:14 <TiberiusTeng> and I'm not really sure who to consult about these sprite stuff, actually.
10:44:16 <peter1138> yeah, the npf one is already guarded
10:44:30 <Rubidium> TiberiusTeng: I have no idea; I just forgot to set a variable in one exit case, don't know more about it than that I did forget it
10:44:39 <peter1138> so yes, it's safe to just ifndef them out
10:44:39 <Celestar> we also get a good buncho warnings (mostly empty if) with that flag.
10:44:58 <Celestar> k. want me to do this?
10:45:09 <Celestar> it'd feel good to make a commit :P
10:45:45 <peter1138> TiberiusTeng: Isn't the sprite only loaded the first time it is used, for both PNG and GRF sprites?
10:46:52 <Celestar> why isn't just DEBUG(gamelog,0) something being used there is the question ...
10:46:59 <TiberiusTeng> peter1138, yes, but seems if someone try to use a sprite as a non-sprite or vice versa, it'll get reloaded ...
10:47:22 <TiberiusTeng> and that fix by Rubidium really fixed it, yes
10:47:51 <TiberiusTeng> (I was moving the entire PNG loading stuff below, above the place actually loading GRF sprite, and that worked too)
10:57:26 <SmatZ> Celestar: you can #ifdef whole GamelogPrintDebugProc and GamelogPrintDebug
10:57:50 <Celestar> SmatZ: why not using DEBUG(gamelog,.. )=
10:58:03 <SmatZ> Celestar: it prints only one line
10:59:25 <SmatZ> GamelogPrintDebug() prints to debug output
11:00:50 <Celestar> SmatZ: does it print any message?
11:04:09 <SmatZ> current solution saves calls to GamelogPrint when debug level is too low
11:04:32 <SmatZ> it can be changed to work in a different way
11:04:48 <SmatZ> so it is called every time with different debug level somewhere in a static variable
11:05:26 <SmatZ> no need to profile, the performance impact is near to zero
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11:21:58 <SmatZ> Celestar, are you here?
11:24:08 <Celestar> SmatZ: what does the diff change?
11:25:20 <SmatZ> Celestar: it doesn't use _debug_gamelog_level anymore
11:25:48 <Celestar> well then, go for it? ;)
11:26:00 <SmatZ> mmm but it calls whole printing stuff
11:26:06 <SmatZ> with only muted output :-x
11:26:38 <Celestar> methinks you should use DEBUG() :P
11:27:08 <SmatZ> methinks you are right :-P
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12:59:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> my RMB is broken :(
13:06:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> very logical conclusion ;)
14:06:04 <Ammler> peter1138's nice patch repo isn't available anymore :-(
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14:07:16 <peter1138> you've had weeks to get at it
14:08:41 <SpComb> I set up my own hg repo, and have my friends clone from it whenever we play together
14:09:02 <SpComb> (assuming windows users are not my friends)
14:09:54 <Yexo> SpComb: hg works perfectly fine here under cygwin (and thus windows) :p
14:10:08 <SpComb> compiling is probably the main issue
14:10:16 <SpComb> or does BuildOTTD somehow solve that problem?
14:10:16 <Ammler> peter1138: just wanted someone to show your grf presets patch...
14:10:52 <Yexo> BuildOTTD will not work with a hg repo, but gcc is available under cygwin, so compiling isn't a problem
14:13:04 <Ammler> Yexo: gcc is availabe with BOTTD
14:14:05 <Yexo> well, then compiling shouldn't be a problem at all (assuming your friends are not afraid of the command line :p )
14:14:46 <SpComb> installing cygwin is a bit of a pain
14:15:58 <Yexo> true, but after the installation I have access to most common unix commandline tools under windows
14:17:39 <fmauNeko> somebody can explain me the work around mercurial and svn ?
14:18:31 <Yexo> what do you want to do with it?
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14:41:01 <Bloody> Where I can find OpenTTD for windows mobile 6.0?
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16:06:39 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r13710 /branches/0.6/ (6 files in 4 dirs): [0.6] -Prepare: for 0.6.2-RC1.
16:13:36 <ArmEagle> man.. making your own catenary (32bpp zoom) takes a lot of fiddling around..
16:15:30 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r13711 /tags/0.6.2-RC1/ (5 files in 3 dirs): -Release: 0.6.2-RC1.
16:20:03 <fjb> Did something change in the way the sounds get played? I'm getting distorted sounds sometimes and some sounds are not played at all.
16:20:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> making a catenary is easy: plot(cosh(x))
16:21:05 <ArmEagle> at least i have a script that does transformations on the base 3 images.
16:21:27 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: Commit by frosch :: r13706 trunk/src/mixer.cpp (2008-07-15 17:13:50 UTC)
16:21:28 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: -Fix (r13695): Small typo.
16:21:46 <planetmaker> ^ that should have fixed something with the sound if I understand correctly...
16:22:50 <fjb> planetmaker: Thank you. I'm using r13704... Time to make an upgrade...
16:25:46 <fjb> I know that site, but didn't look at it today.
16:27:16 <fjb> Next problem is that something eats the depot orders sometimes. Is that the autoupgrade of the vehicles?
16:30:16 <Eddi|zuHause2> i have that behaviour sometimes, i never figured out why
16:30:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> do you have servicing disabled?
16:31:20 <fjb> No, service and breakdowns are enabled.
16:36:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> the behaviour i noticed was: when i send a train to the depot manually, it sometimes would cancel that depot order and head its usual way
16:36:46 <fjb> planetmaker: Sounds much better now.
16:36:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> is your problem something similar?
16:38:21 <fjb> No, I hat especially roadvecles which dind't stay in the depot after sending them there. And I noticed depot orders of road vehicles and trains becoming invalid orders.
16:38:56 <fjb> And service at depot orders tend to send the vehicles allways to the depot.
16:39:26 <fjb> I'm using the latest yapp patch. But that things usually happen to road vehicles too.
16:41:38 <fjb> Hm, sound is still not allways playing...
16:43:43 <dih> i see DEF_UDP_RECEIVE_COMMAND(Server, PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_DETAIL_INFO)
16:43:52 <dih> but i seem to fail to find where the client receives it
16:45:04 <Rubidium> it receives it exactly there
16:45:38 <dih> no - that is where the server receives the packet and then sends Packet packet(PACKET_UDP_SERVER_DETAIL_INFO);
16:45:58 <dih> and the client needs to receive that packet
16:47:27 <dih> sorry - i did not express that properly above
16:47:42 <dih> i cannot fine where the client receives PACKET_UDP_SERVER_DETAIL_INFO
16:48:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> you're still making no sense :p
16:49:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's not even what i meant ;)
16:49:23 <dih> what's not to understand? :-P
16:49:35 <dih> client sends PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_DETAIL_INFO to the server
16:49:45 <dih> server replies with PACKET_UDP_SERVER_DETAIL_INFO
16:50:13 <dih> yet i cannot fine the piece of code where the client actually receives that PACKET_UPD_SERVER_DETAIL_INFO
16:50:16 <Rubidium> actually... PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_DETAIL_INFO isn't send
16:50:51 <dih> how else will the client request the details?
16:51:16 <dih> in the multiplayer window?
16:51:41 <dih> well - openttdlib sends a PACKET_UDP_CLIENT_DETAIL_INFO :-P
16:52:09 <dih> and PACKET_UDP_SERVER_DETAIL_INFO is the one that overflows when more than 11 clients are on a game
16:53:42 <Rubidium> I guess you need to unify the TCP and UDP packets; so if it works over TCP is also works over UDP
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16:56:59 <dih> why on earth does that packet actually then exist?
16:57:10 <dih> i mean - i am happy - it means openttdlib can get more details
16:57:20 <dih> but if the game actually does not use it?
16:57:32 <Rubidium> because someone had much more plans for the server list
16:57:43 <Rubidium> but it never got actually implemented in the website
16:58:05 <dih> the master server code is also publicly available in the svn tree right?
16:58:25 <dih> then let's skip that here and get back to it another time ;-D
16:59:45 <dih> thank you for shedding light on that :-)
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21:19:00 * glx hates Yexo (if it's host says what I think it does)
21:19:27 * Yexo hates his wireless connection :(
21:20:19 <Yexo> ah, that part is true :)
21:21:06 <Yexo> well, the router is in the basement, and I'm on the second floor
21:21:35 <Yexo> my connection flips every few hours (or more) :(
21:22:02 <glx> it's always possible to use a cable (not aesthetic sometimes)
21:22:40 <Yexo> we had cables in here, but the house-owner wanted us to remove them because the fire-brigade said so
21:22:44 <Yexo> so that's not really an option
21:23:31 <Yexo> (ok, the cables were all over the stairs :p)
21:24:56 <ArmEagle> Cool, your firedepartments check for trippyness?
21:25:17 <glx> I have a cable going from ground floor to 1st floor through basement and roof
21:25:22 <ArmEagle> dih what page? Forums still aren't
21:25:31 <Yexo> I've never seen them, but the houseowner told me so
21:25:40 <Rubidium> dih: the forums are there, but don't not quite work yet
21:25:49 <Rubidium> but only if you know what you're looking for ;)
21:25:51 <orudge> Forums will depend on your DNS updates
21:25:53 <ArmEagle> In 8 days I'll be here: campzone.nl. That's a lot more cables than anything you'll ever have at home :)
21:25:57 <orudge> although you wont' be able to log in there
21:26:21 <Rubidium> yeah, that kinda times out the connection
21:29:07 <XeryusTC> ArmEagle: you're going to cz too?
21:30:25 <ArmEagle> XeryusTC aye, I'm a veteran.. my 8th time. 10th time camping like this
21:30:39 <Ammler> it is not a bug report
21:30:51 <ArmEagle> And here I am, wasting time on my stupid 32bpp-zoom catenary..
21:30:55 <XeryusTC> ArmEagle: very nice, it will be my 3rd time, i didnt go last year :P
21:31:15 <XeryusTC> i'm with the [BI] folks :P
21:31:19 <Ammler> if I update it to HEAD, I need to open a new one?
21:31:25 <XeryusTC> we had that in 2005 too :P
21:31:49 <Ammler> isn't that kind of stupid?
21:32:25 <XeryusTC> btw, if you're going for the 8th time you must have been there the first time too?
21:32:47 <ArmEagle> And 2 years before that we went to the predecessor: WAN (northern netherlands)
21:32:47 <Eddi|zuHause2> i almost thought when you said "cz" you were referring to the country :p
21:33:07 <dih> Ammler: i doubt it needs updating :-P
21:33:37 <XeryusTC> ArmEagle: heh, my first time was just in 2005 :P
21:33:45 <dih> Ammler: no but that file never changes :-D
21:34:40 <XeryusTC> but well, as i've said, i'm going with the [BI] folks :P
21:34:53 <Ammler> well, it is still stupid
21:35:05 <XeryusTC> unfortunately we werent able to find a solution for real time beer stats :(
21:35:30 <ArmEagle> heh that's an idea.. we should put some waterflow meter in there..
21:35:49 <Ammler> (I mean the comment of closing...)
21:36:07 <dih> Ammler: the command has no hooks defined
21:36:18 <XeryusTC> ArmEagle: yes, but they're too expensive for something like that :P
21:36:23 <dih> and what happens if it's issued on a network server while clients are connected
21:36:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, we do have "resetengines" which basically serves the same purpose
21:36:45 <XeryusTC> and the cheap ones break too easily when you have air flowing through it :P
21:37:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> dih: but that was not the reason for closing
21:37:30 <dih> the reason for closing is that there is no work on the current console
21:37:39 <dih> or no additions to the current console
21:37:48 <Ammler> the reason was "do not change GRF"
21:38:12 <dih> you mean - don't load a grf in a running game
21:38:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> the problem is that "running game" includes "scenario map with no industries yet"
21:38:54 <Ammler> yoricks patch has that hook you asked about, btw. :P
21:39:14 <dih> there are a few hooks... :-P
21:39:35 <dih> you should only allow it from scn editor, or single player
21:39:56 <dih> create a gui button in the scn editor
21:40:06 <Ammler> dih: I can't, it is closed!
21:40:07 <dih> then you dont need no console command and not hooks
21:40:38 <dih> then you have a higher chance of getting it reopened
21:44:44 <Ammler> but that means, you should not use FS to post patches...
21:44:56 <Ammler> only if you want those included in trunk
21:45:42 <Ammler> I thought, it is also something like a repo for patches...
21:48:13 <dih> yeah - because bugs.openttd.org says randompatchrepository.openttd.org
21:49:32 <ccfreak2k> One person made an online "patch vending machine" for fceu once.
21:49:54 <ccfreak2k> You could mix and match several patches/options, then it spit out the patched binary and/or source.
21:50:56 <Ammler> then sorry about, will use tt-forums next time.. :-)
21:55:13 <dih> if you really want people to look at it, bugs or here :-P
21:56:13 <Ammler> well, was just happy about closing, but as I saw the reason...
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22:39:47 <Ammler> what about calling those functions (reseteconomy and resetengines) with the apply button on the GRF GUI?
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22:57:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> Ammler: no, why would you do that, when just reordering the catenary grf?
22:58:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> especially if the command can have nasty sideeffects with inflation
22:58:27 <Ammler> but it is the right place, if you do it over gui, isn't?
22:59:15 <Ammler> you could detect, if you add a grf or just reorder...
23:00:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> don't even attempt that..
23:00:59 <Ammler> well, the sideeffect is not nasty
23:01:09 <Ammler> it will "just" reset inflation.
23:01:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> that is totally enough of a reason to not do it
23:02:10 <Ammler> well, ctrl+click isn't good either.
23:02:42 <Ammler> so it would need a 2. apply or reset button...
23:05:42 <Ammler> Eddi|zuHause2: do you know how devs like that newgrf gui patch in general?
23:06:07 <Ammler> the drag'n'drop is awesome.
23:06:13 <Eddi|zuHause2> the only real concern was the size, afaik
23:06:51 <Eddi|zuHause2> but you should probably ask the devs :p
23:07:02 <Ammler> I really enjoed the wwottdgd configuration with it.
23:07:17 <Ammler> they seems silent currently :-)
23:07:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> you just need to highlight them enough times :p
23:08:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> and nag about it :p
23:08:13 <Ammler> nah, I do that enough all the time...
23:08:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> they'll have no other choice than to reply to you :p
23:09:15 <Ammler> we have quite a nice collection for our client side patch pack already.
23:10:20 <Ammler> I do not need to push patches, which can be used independent from server...
23:11:13 <Ammler> and planetmaker is going to be a pro with keeping those patches up2date :-)
23:12:27 <Ammler> I would much more like to see the rivers in the game, if I could wish :-)
23:13:12 <Eddi|zuHause2> the design document is there, you just have to implement it :p
23:13:34 <Ammler> nah, I am happy with adding the button, like TTDPatch.
23:15:15 <Ammler> I can't code new things, just copy from somewhere else...
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23:21:43 <Ammler> well, time to sleep over...
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continue to next day ⏵
