IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2008-04-29
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00:00:26 <Zuu> I'm going to have nightmares about 425 :p
00:02:13 <Zuu> The fact that 42 the answer of universe is in it does not make it better :p
00:03:32 *** mynetdude is now known as mynetdude|Away
00:06:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> maybe you'll find out in 7.5 million years ;)
00:14:29 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: THE THIRD?
00:14:59 <glx> but now I'm stuck on the third
00:15:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> dumb question, really ;)
00:16:34 <Sacro> Eddi|zuHause3: what is the solution?
00:16:39 <Fiddler> is 2nd one so obvious that any hint would make it too easy ?
00:23:33 <Fiddler> hmmm... glx wrote "openttd.cpp:425 can be many things"...
00:27:04 <Zuu> but only one is correct..
00:28:43 <Fiddler> ... and we also need to know what revision to use
00:31:53 <Sacro> Don't suppose anyone here has done any XNA?
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00:36:01 <Zuu> hmm, by the way why use strcpy and not strncpy in openttd.cpp? guess there is a reason that i will find out if I look around a bit.. :)
00:38:27 <glx> sometimes we use strcpy, sometimes strncpy
00:38:35 <Zuu> Where the argument of -g is copied to _file_to_saveload.name
00:39:50 <Zuu> have not looked yet, could be that the cli arguments are clamped to a certain length before strcpy.
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02:59:37 <DaleStan> peter1138: How does one tell when the list in prop 11 is finished?
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05:49:45 <peter1138> DaleStan: hmm, described wrong... it's one entry per 'id'
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06:11:51 <ln> what's wrong with austrians?
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06:24:24 <Zahl> openttd support in xfire? nice one :-D
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07:05:05 <Roest> that's exactly what i mean
07:12:18 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12917 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: standardise variable names called with FOR_ALL_ENGINEIDS_OF_TYPE
07:12:36 <Roest> "I do have a couple of game related issues that I think are bugs in trunk (checking those details now). "
07:12:54 <Alberth> yeh, unfortunately, he is not telling what the bugs are
07:13:15 <Roest> coming from someone who couldn't even get buildottd to run
07:13:48 <Alberth> maybe they have to do with the win9x build that is not done any more as i understand
07:14:08 <Alberth> we watch and learn :)
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07:24:32 <Roest> I would report this on flyspray but I don't have a login...
07:26:35 <Roest> omg now he found me too
07:27:06 <Roest> but i can confirm this bug, just tried it
07:27:57 <DorpsGek> yorick: Commit by peter1138 :: r12914 trunk/src/newgrf_engine.cpp (2008-04-28 11:15:13 UTC)
07:27:58 <DorpsGek> yorick: -Fix: Game crash when a spectator/server tried to show an engine with no owner when a NewGRF requested a specific variable.
07:28:35 <yorick> hmm...another autoptr problem?
07:30:09 <yorick> it is available, but I can't build it
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07:38:32 <Roest> that's surely an equation you need a computer for
07:38:58 <yorick> it seemed that openttd calculated it wrongly, so just a double-check
07:46:17 <ln> Roest: is that an equation?
08:18:23 <Roest> it's not doing what i want it to do
08:18:53 <Roest> doing your request on the newgrf window
08:20:18 <yorick> should make a button: "show all newgrfs" / "show only addable grfs"
08:21:11 <Roest> actually i see no reason to show all grfs
08:21:37 <yorick> imagine a multiplayer server
08:21:49 <yorick> and you want to list your grfs to see what aren't compatible
08:22:22 <yorick> and btw, should use another string for >> and << buttons, because this one is also used for add and remove in other languages
08:22:30 <yorick> so it isn't language-compatible
08:22:54 <Roest> meh i hate you and your totally reasonable requests
08:23:22 <Roest> but then it's original nycom design, but he seems to have abandoned it
08:24:15 <yorick> his first patch was somewhere around 2007
08:24:27 <yorick> he didn't update it until 2008, methinks
08:27:45 <yorick> does it refresh every minute?
08:27:54 <yorick> the picture, that is, not the page
08:29:07 * yorick got a picture of the transport tycoon cd
08:29:45 <Roest> could please smile intot he camera?
08:30:16 <peter1138> god my arm looks strange :o
08:30:40 <yorick> !peter1138: dosmile camera
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08:34:46 <yorick> "the dark side of peter1138!"
08:36:35 <yorick> are you gonna keep that webcam?
08:42:49 <blindcoder> hey all. I've asked a few days ago about updating from electric to monorail trains without rebuilding all trains and routes. I now just patched my source tree to allow converting railways even if trains are on it and autoreplacing electric to monorail trains.
08:43:54 <yorick> for normal -> electric: send trains into depot, drag convert tool over it, and use autoreplace to convert trains if you like
08:44:05 <yorick> for electric -> monorail: what about newgrfs?
08:44:56 <blindcoder> yeah, normal -> electric woorked fine, of course
08:45:08 <Alberth> newgrfs do updating too?
08:45:29 <blindcoder> what do you mean "what about newgrfs"?
08:47:42 <peter1138> for electric to monorail... do it manually
08:47:47 <Alberth> blindcoder: Why do you allow converting tracks when a train is on it? with 'normal' to 'electric' I can imagine, since 'normal' trains also run on electric, but non-monorail doesn't run on monorail afaik
08:48:03 <yorick> newgrfs may completely disable monorail
08:48:10 <yorick> or remove certain vehicles?
08:48:19 <blindcoder> Alberth: yes, but I want to upgrade my existing electric network to monorail
08:48:25 <blindcoder> Alberth: so I send all my trains into depots now
08:48:32 <blindcoder> Alberth: update my whole network to monorail
08:48:34 <Alberth> yorick: just the engines is enough :)
08:48:42 <blindcoder> Alberth: autoreplace all my trains to monorail
08:48:47 <blindcoder> Alberth: and send them back on the track
08:48:52 <yorick> yes, what if newgrfs remove engines?
08:49:12 <Alberth> yorick: enough to disable monorail
08:49:20 <blindcoder> doesn''t really matter, does it? I basically just removed the check if the trains can run on the tracks
08:49:22 <Alberth> blindcoder: what's wrong with this approach?
08:49:26 <yorick> what if they only remove some?
08:49:41 <blindcoder> Alberth: it doesn't work with 0.6.0 without changing the source code :)
08:50:45 <peter1138> Alberth: wagons are rail type specific too ;)
08:51:03 <blindcoder> Alberth: with 0.6.0 if I have trains in the depot, i can't update the depot from electric to monorail
08:51:14 <blindcoder> Alberth: and I can't update electric trains to monorail trains
08:51:15 <peter1138> hmm, so if you figured out a way around it, what's the problem?
08:51:33 <yorick> except you shouldn't expect for the devs to include your patch
08:51:41 <blindcoder> Alberth: BUT I don't want to recreate all trains and manually program the routes againnnn
08:51:47 <blindcoder> yorick: I don't, really.
08:51:48 <Alberth> blindcoder: I like my trains to be type-specific
08:52:08 <yorick> you don't have to, if you remove a train, replace the depot, make a train, it recieves the same orders
08:52:40 <yorick> since a few revs, maybe even the economical data
08:52:53 <yorick> but I'm not entirely sure on that one
08:52:58 <blindcoder> yorick: so basically, move train to depot, sell train, demolish depot, build new depot, build new train?
08:53:05 <Alberth> does that also work when removing multiple trains?
08:54:03 <Alberth> peter1138: ah, I never get that far in the game
08:54:46 <Alberth> so build one depot for each train then ;)
08:54:52 <yorick> no, you have to upgrade the depot
08:55:05 <yorick> just use the convert track tool on it after removing the train
08:55:11 <peter1138> the old one and a new one
08:55:19 <peter1138> delete a vehicle, build a vehicle
08:55:26 <peter1138> (not fun, of course)
08:55:36 <peter1138> personally i just upgrade bits of the network in stages
08:55:41 <peter1138> or just run a separate network
08:56:31 <Alberth> mono is so much faster, you'd waste resources by simply copying the old situation imho
08:56:49 <yorick> personally I just skip monorail
08:58:03 <peter1138> Alberth: faster depends on what newgrfs you have in use...
09:00:39 <blindcoder> I'm also playing without newgrfs here on my older game. my newer game has enhanced construction vectors in it, but no vehicle newgrfs
09:03:39 <peter1138> i wonder if just setting the rail type compatibility flags has the appropriate effect
09:06:20 <yorick> docs.openttd.org has a small bug
09:07:59 <blindcoder> peter1138: not exactly, because that would enable electric rails to run on monorail tracks, wouldn't it?
09:12:17 <peter1138> which is what you want
09:12:30 <peter1138> to let you upgrade them
09:12:45 <peter1138> ok... she said "fuck. i want one." ... what was i supposed to reply with...
09:14:35 <peter1138> well she certainly blushed a lot...
09:14:35 <blindcoder> hmm, yeah, would have been easier than to remove to compatibility checks from the upgrade and autoreplace mechanism :)
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09:17:44 <yorick> you can close FS$1964; duplicate of 1963
09:20:12 <Roest> ok yorick, do you really want such a button :/
09:20:51 <yorick> how else can I check some checksums with other grfs loaded
09:21:45 <Roest> also i wonder why the window update is so sluggish
09:22:27 <yorick> and its because you havent done InvalidateWindow?
09:22:36 <Roest> no i mean the update of that grf window
09:22:48 <yorick> yes, what update is so sluggish?
09:23:07 <yorick> redrawing of the window only happens when you click it, you mean
09:23:23 <yorick> you'll have to mark it dirty ;)
09:24:14 <Roest> or wait, maybe he forgot it somewhere
09:25:51 * Alberth Roest goes in for the kill
09:25:54 <shodan> XFire now tracks openttd
09:26:29 <shodan> I'd sent an email in the past requesting it
09:26:34 <shodan> but like, many months ago
09:26:38 *** User is now known as Guest2225
09:26:42 <shodan> i guess a few other people did too
09:29:37 <Roest> still needs some work, but it's getting there
09:30:44 <Alberth> shouldn't the right side have a 'installed NewGRFs' title?
09:31:05 <Roest> yea it actually uses DoDrawStringTruncated but i guess the formula is wrong
09:33:50 <peter1138> often those things are set to use the window width
09:34:01 <peter1138> instead of the widget width
09:34:28 *** Osai`off is now known as Osai
09:35:57 * yorick has fixed 3 bugs the last 7 days, and only one made it into trunk :(
09:42:22 <Alberth> 6 desktops and still not enough space...
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09:52:20 <peter1138> and the third one? heh
09:53:07 * Hendikins hrms, and wishes a decent version for Windows Mobile existed.
09:53:27 <Hendikins> I could kill many hours playing it on my Palm Treo if it actually worked properly.
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10:11:10 <yorick> Roest, how is progress going?
10:12:15 <Roest> added the button, have to do the logic behind now, the truncate gives me trouble, no matter what i put there for the right border it doesnt truncate
10:12:48 <Roest> DoDrawStringTruncated(text, w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST].left + txtoffset, y + 2, WP(w, newgrf_d).sel_r == c ? TC_WHITE : TC_BLACK, w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST].right);
10:13:33 <yorick> maybe you should get the width?
10:14:32 <peter1138> you need right - left
10:14:56 <yorick> nt DoDrawStringTruncated(const char *str, int x, int y, uint16 color, uint maxw)
10:15:46 <yorick> DoDrawStringTruncated(text, w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST].left + txtoffset, y + 2, WP(w, newgrf_d).sel_r == c ? TC_WHITE : TC_BLACK, w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST].right - w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST].left);
10:18:36 <yorick> can't you better do Widget *w = w->widget[NLW_WIDGET_FILE_LIST]?
10:21:08 <Rubidium> yorick: your fix for FS#1963 is wrong (even though it works)
10:21:34 <Rubidium> the value of BAW_COUNT
10:22:03 <Rubidium> *if* there would only be one airport, the count would be 0
10:22:13 <Rubidium> if there would be 2 airports, the count would be 1
10:26:37 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r12918 /trunk/src/airport_gui.cpp: -Fix [FS#1963] (r12679): last airport would always be shown as buildable even when it was not.
10:30:37 <yorick> adn FS#1890? any comments on that one?
10:34:30 <yorick> now the drag-drop as with orders :p
10:36:23 <peter1138> you've cropped too much now ;)
10:38:05 <Roest> yea had an additional -10, thats gone now
10:43:09 <yorick> peter1138 should stop breaking his own patches with trunk changes
10:47:59 <ln> what the hell is wrong with austrians?
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10:50:35 * peter1138 hides yorick in a cellar
10:51:20 * yorick gets 7 children from peter1138
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10:56:41 * yorick sees one of the children dieing and 3 being taken away
10:59:34 <Roest> i guess i have to find the ignore option in this irc thing here
11:00:18 <yorick> the only thing he says is english only.
11:00:23 <ln> Roest: English only is ordered in the topic, not by me.
11:00:36 <yorick> and whats not english about this?
11:00:45 <yorick> and what says that you should be cop?
11:01:16 <ln> the topic does not (currently) say "should not be enforced by ln".
11:01:50 <yorick> it doesn't say the opposite, does it?
11:02:08 <yorick> peter1138, feel free to add that one
11:02:11 <Roest> well since english isn't my native language and i was under the impression i used it, please show where i did not
11:02:35 <yorick> he hates apostrophes that are missing ;)
11:03:11 <Roest> apparantly he is a bigger idiot than i thought then
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11:08:18 <yorick> I'm spotting another one on the fuzzlecam
11:08:49 <yorick> pointing at the screen
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11:43:47 <ln> Roest: who are you to call other people idiots?
11:46:48 <Roest> i'm just me, but i think a person who screams "english only" everytime someone makes a typo or a grammar mistake fits the description pretty well
11:48:07 <ln> i've never said that about typos.
12:07:55 <ln> if it isn't there, one didn't even try to press it.
12:08:05 <yorick> any dev that'd like to add "should not be enforced by ln"?
12:09:52 <Roest> yorick did you try the patch? btw there wont be drag & drop
12:10:51 <Roest> because double click already works and is faster
12:11:21 <Rubidium> not for moving individual items in the 'chosen' newgrf list
12:11:38 <Rubidium> oh noes... just made two typos!
12:12:40 <teeg> I wonder what'd happen if we all decided to write SMSish
12:12:58 <teeg> ln'd probably have a heart attack
12:13:31 <teeg> come to think of it, I think I'll have a heart attack as well
12:15:28 <yorick> Roest, the scrollbar doesn't change size
12:16:33 <Roest> thing is i don't keep the number of items shown, so it shows the scrollbar according to total # of grfs
12:18:09 <Roest> guess i have a look at order window how dnd is done, greedy bastard
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12:55:53 <Roest> hmm do i have to allow dragndrop with some flag or is it superceded by the click event?
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13:15:00 <Roest> peter1138: i see you on the fuzzlecam, gimme a clue plz
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13:19:01 <Chicago_Rail_Authority> fuzzlecam?
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13:36:25 <Gekz> I have a girlfriend that is a foot and bit shorter than me
13:36:49 <yorick> I can smell him through the screen :o
13:37:20 <Gekz> I will stick you with a knife
13:37:40 <Gekz> and throw it at your head
13:37:53 <Gekz> and then I'll eat your big toe!
13:38:03 <Gekz> and I'll sell your kidneys on the black market
13:38:09 <Gekz> and I'll eat your liver.
13:39:33 <Roest> just curious, you eat it raw or cooked?
13:40:52 <Roest> anyway, why doesn't case WE_DRAGDROP: ShowErrorMessage(INVALID_STRING_ID, STR_NEWGRF_DUPLICATE_GRFID, 0, 0); show that damn thing
13:41:03 <Gekz> Roest: cooked in his entrails
13:41:14 <yorick> anyone wants to participate in the current #openttdcoop.dev game?
13:41:22 <yorick> it has tracksharing :)
13:41:34 <Roest> those coop guys are too leet for me
13:42:31 <Roest> and why would you need tracksharing in a coop game anyway
13:42:43 <yorick> because everyone can have different companies
13:42:59 <yorick> in case you're a windows user
13:43:02 <Gekz> its nearly midnight and I have school
13:44:48 <Belugas> hey! don't!!! For once, it was usefull!!
13:45:50 * teeg looks up "life" in a dictionary
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13:51:06 <Belugas> the duck was helpfull, since "[09:42] * yorick ducks"
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14:12:10 <Ammler> has someone tried cond orders yet?
14:12:45 <Ammler> how do I have to make orders to skip a station if 100% loaded
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14:16:21 <yorick> if load percentage equals 100
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14:30:03 <Roest> my productivity today equals zero
14:30:56 <teeg> Roest: Swap tasks? I've got some old VB code which apparently doesn't want to run in vs2008, which makes things a bit difficult to debug
14:31:27 <teeg> and I can't for the life of me find the enthusiasm to try to fix the damned thing. :P
14:33:04 <Roest> how good is your opengl :)
14:33:33 <teeg> I wish I could say "about as good as my VB", but sadly it's non-existent
14:33:56 <teeg> (not that I'm a VB guru either, but at least VB isn't exactly the most difficult language ever to understand...)
14:34:32 <Roest> i can say i never wrote a single line VB in my life
14:35:07 <teeg> sadly, I cannot. but I can at least say I never enjoyed any of them, and if I don't have to write another line in my life, that'll be just dandy
14:35:49 <Roest> but then i wrote enough PHP which is probably as bad if not worse
14:36:12 <teeg> better syntax, but not really a step up, no
14:39:42 * blathijs did some very nice programming in VB5 :-D
14:39:46 <peter1138> ah... syntax on that is already
14:39:55 <peter1138> it's just like C# but without the ;s ;)
14:40:04 <blathijs> Actually, that's where a lot of my programming experience comes from :-)
14:40:22 <teeg> which is why I'm a Perl guy and not a python guy :P
14:40:50 <teeg> I constantly have to fix at least 5 ;'s which sneak into any VB code I write, because it's automatic
14:42:05 <teeg> oh great. a meeting.<fake enthusiasm>
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15:22:22 <DorpsGek> yorick: dih was last seen in #openttd 17 hours, 21 minutes, and 35 seconds ago: <dih> sup ladies?
15:36:04 <nicfer> hmmm what about replacing the propietary openttd's chat with a standardized one?
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15:37:34 <nicfer> I mean, if each game has it's own chat engine, it would be too complicated for devs to start from scratch every engine
15:37:41 <nicfer> why not make a standard lib for it?
15:38:30 <Belugas> because we're not starting from scratch. it's already there
15:38:44 <Belugas> why changing something just for changing?
15:39:25 <nicfer> linux is good because it's libs are organizated
15:39:38 <Belugas> why changing something just for changing?
15:39:47 <SmatZ> nicfer: you can chat at IRC while playing if you want
15:39:56 <Belugas> why changing something just for changing?
15:39:57 <SmatZ> and OTTD doesn't run only on Linux
15:41:28 <nicfer> because if I want to start a game and I want to do a chat, it's simpler to pick up openttd's one and implement it on my game rather than writing one from the scratch
15:41:37 <glx> and chat is part of ottd networkig protocol
15:42:05 <nicfer> that is the principle of sdl
15:42:34 <Belugas> so basically, you are a bit of a lazy guy who would like to reuse our stuff for your own purpose
15:43:05 <peter1138> no problem... have fun with the string system... and the graphics system... and the network system... :)
15:43:07 <Belugas> or, make it so that you can re-use without much effort our stufff
15:43:48 <nicfer> and why to use an own networking protocol when you can use sdl_net's one?
15:44:22 <glx> because sdl is not needed on windows, nor on osx
15:44:54 <glx> and dedicated servers don't use sdl either
15:45:06 <SmatZ> and because current code works
15:45:15 <SmatZ> and do not have too much overhead
15:47:38 <nicfer> sdl_net doesn't use graphical functions
15:48:07 <Zuu> nicfer: sdl_net is just the lower layers ottd still have to implement the higher layers etc.
15:49:21 <Zuu> Even if you would have a ssh connection or whatever to build on you still have to design and implement the application layer.
15:49:26 <SmatZ> nicfer: mixing two network protocols would make the code more complex, and current network protocol is suited for OTTD ; you can't know how would any other higher level protocol work
15:49:40 <SmatZ> UDP / TCP is on adequate level to work with
15:50:02 <SmatZ> furthermore, with sockets...
15:50:17 <Belugas> 12 minutes before lunch time. might not wait until then
15:50:34 <nicfer> you don't understand the concept of libraries just
15:50:42 <nicfer> it would be useful in other games
15:51:08 <Belugas> nicfer, you do not understand our needs either
15:51:20 <Belugas> nor the decisions that have been taken
15:51:36 <SmatZ> Belugas said it exactly
15:52:01 <Zuu> Having the implementation "in house" have it's benefits too.
15:52:29 <Belugas> but hey... don't listen to me, after all, i'm sarcastic, condescendant and cynical...
15:53:05 <SmatZ> Belugas: sometimes it is good to be sarcastic and cynical :)
15:53:14 <Albert1> nicfer: could you plz explain? you want us to use sdl_net's so you can use it? why not use sdl_net directly?
15:56:00 <Belugas> 'cause it's haaaaaard
15:56:08 <nicfer> microsoft is doing the same thing, propietary protocols closed to their own products
15:56:59 <teeg> nicfer: then make a chat lib and release it as open source, maybe we'll use it then.
15:57:21 <peter1138> to fit into out network system? hehe
15:57:44 <teeg> peter1138: mother of all shoehorns? :P no, I'm just putting the shoe on the other foot.
16:05:13 <Onack> im started to get annoyed by 0.6.1 RC1
16:05:27 <Onack> now i get desync by removing roads :S
16:06:29 <SmatZ> Onack: do you use the CIV1 version?
16:07:13 <Onack> using a 64bit compiled 0.6.1 RC1
16:07:18 <SmatZ> glx: it is better to ask...
16:07:34 <SmatZ> I know I had this problem in a game with CIV1 patch
16:07:49 <SmatZ> but maybe it was caused by OTTD + some grf set
16:07:59 <SmatZ> Onack: what GRFs do you use?
16:08:24 <Onack> im White_Tiger in the flyspry
16:08:54 <Onack> on the desync on electric trains
16:09:03 <Albert1> nicfer: if you want a chat protocol, get one from jabber. it is open, and used by Google
16:09:34 <nicfer> is possible to use it inside a game?
16:09:37 <Onack> i dont have the patch with easier removing city roads on, but it seems like the client dont see it
16:10:12 <Onack> cause when i connect back to the server the road is back again
16:10:32 <Zuu> Onack: When you say don't have the patch, you mean that you've disabled that option in the patch dialog on the server?
16:11:01 <Onack> no my server but he said so
16:11:09 <Onack> a buddy of mine running the server
16:12:08 <Onack> hm, my client says its on
16:12:14 <Onack> that might be the problem
16:13:25 <Zuu> Sounds a bit like an assert that only affects some builds. I found one a year ago (or was it two?) which was when you had station spread < airport size and built a station an assert was triggered. Some builds stoped because of the assertion (my client) but the windows-server did not stop because of which flags it was built with.
16:13:54 <Zuu> On what operating systems and how are the clients/server built?
16:14:18 <Onack> server is running on FreeBSD
16:14:30 <Onack> my buddy compiled them so i need to ask him then
16:14:33 <peter1138> yes, i have desyncs removing roads too
16:14:48 *** thgergo has joined #openttd
16:15:28 <Onack> good to hear im not the only one
16:15:30 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Bjarni
16:15:58 <glx> nice when the client removes road they disappear on server, the opposite is wrong
16:16:34 <Onack> when i reconnect(cause of desync) the road is back
16:16:53 <Onack> takes ~20 seconds after i remove the road before the desync happens
16:19:39 *** Brianetta has joined #openttd
16:24:01 <Zuu> I've calculated it to 111 clients on the server list on openttd.org :)
16:24:20 <Bjarni> give or take 100, right?
16:25:32 <Zuu> give or take 1-10 maybe, but I think I got it quite correct. But the list is not static so noone can say I calculated it wrong :)
16:25:51 *** Chicago_Rail_Authority has quit IRC
16:36:54 <Bjarni> you could script counting the total amount of clients
16:37:04 <Bjarni> then you will get them fast enough to be somewhat sure
16:37:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r12919 /trunk/src/road_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#1965]: flood road tiles even when there are road works in progress
16:42:09 *** ChanServ sets mode: -b Karen*!*@*
16:42:09 *** ChanServ sets mode: -b *!*riddle@*.lylix.net
16:42:09 *** ChanServ sets mode: -b questionmark!*@*
16:43:28 <Onack> Zuu: got word from my buddy, the server was buildt with normal FreeBSD compile, clients are from openttd
16:48:23 *** Leviath has joined #openttd
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16:57:08 <hylje> i built a 2-wagon multiple unit out of lego
17:06:40 <Bjarni> I once built a 3 unit articulated unit out of lego
17:06:50 <Bjarni> the middle unit shared a bogie with each of the ends
17:06:52 <hylje> how did you do articulation
17:07:03 <Bjarni> it did surprisingly well when turning
17:07:17 <yorick> huh? who removed the bans?
17:07:38 <yorick> who instructed chanserv to remove the bans?
17:07:54 <Bjarni> <glx> like a TGV? <-- yeah something like that (even though I wasn't thinking about TGV at the time)
17:08:59 * Wolf01 reads: "<yorick> huh? who removed the bananas?" WTF!!!
17:09:05 <yorick> 2 of the bans were made 2 days ago?
17:09:27 <Bjarni> maybe she will bring more cake
17:10:18 <yorick> its nice to see "our clues are perfect" to be jammed a bit
17:11:06 <dih> you are repeating yourself
17:11:53 <yorick> dih, we're running patched on #openttdcoop.dev
17:11:54 <dih> you annoying little kid :D
17:12:21 *** Chicago_Rail_Authority has joined #openttd
17:12:41 <dih> snow in temperate + yet another pbs patch
17:13:14 <yorick> you know what I mean by saying that
17:13:23 * yorick tries to unstuck belugas again
17:14:18 *** dih was kicked by Belugas (Got a firm grip on my kick!)
17:14:50 <dih> a devine size 9 boot up the rear
17:15:09 <dih> size 9 - you get that Belugas? size 9!
17:15:47 <Belugas> only 9 that i knwo is
17:16:04 <dih> ask your wife what size shoes she wears
17:16:07 <hylje> of note, my precious multiple unit is low-floored between the bogies
17:16:59 <Belugas> # I want to f... you like an animal
17:17:05 <Belugas> # I want to feel you from the inside
17:17:51 <dih> you think that ---- is a perfect druc
17:17:56 <Rubidium> nicfer: too bad I can't install libsdl-net without installing libsdl which needs X, which I don't want on my dedicated server
17:18:18 <yorick> you don't need sdl for dedicated servers, do you?
17:18:43 <yorick> hmm...karen has chanserv access!
17:18:49 <Rubidium> Karen_: 24 hours aren't up yet
17:19:01 <yorick> !peter1138: doban Karen_!
17:19:11 *** Bjarni sets mode: +b *!*yorick@*.adsl.wanadoo.nl
17:19:16 <Bjarni> you don't have anything to say
17:19:28 <Prof_Frink> yorick: You're doing it wrong
17:19:33 *** Bjarni sets mode: -b *!*yorick@*.adsl.wanadoo.nl
17:19:34 *** |Jeroen| has joined #openttd
17:19:44 <Prof_Frink> peter1138! Newbanana!
17:20:02 <Tefad> what's with all the irc modes lately
17:20:13 <Tefad> this channel is usualy quiet in those regards
17:21:02 <Karen_> 1 yes/no question, now!
17:22:02 <yorick> you used our only question
17:22:05 <Onack> is there any to force removal of own created industries?
17:22:24 <Karen_> thank you for the question - see you later on this evening!
17:24:15 <Belugas> called magic bulldozer
17:25:15 <yorick> the problem is that towns can also use it, yes
17:25:29 <dih> [19:22] * Belugas is leaving the channel
17:25:29 <dih> [19:22] * Belugas (belugas@openttd.org) has left #openttdcoop
17:25:56 *** waterpie has joined #openttd
17:25:58 <Belugas> was a joke, in reaction to x,y, joining the game :)
17:26:39 <Onack> well, i guess cheats are not possible in MP even i got server access
17:26:43 <yorick> oh, what's your question?
17:26:50 <Belugas> but dih, i was expecting you to kick me :)
17:26:58 <waterpie> can someone pls explain to me, why i can't make any profit? i get more profit than expenditure (i think), but i constantly lose money
17:27:12 <dih> why would i kick you Belugas?
17:27:12 <yorick> you have transfer button pressed?
17:27:15 <Tefad> waterpie: check your graphs.
17:27:33 <Tefad> er not graphs.. the overview budge screen,.. summary
17:27:37 <Belugas> 'cause i kicked you in #openttd, and you have no power in here, which is the exact opposite situation there
17:27:45 <Tefad> interest can kick your ass
17:27:48 <waterpie> the graph is a ~straight line below 0
17:28:29 <waterpie> the finances screen?
17:29:06 <dih> Belugas: i can understand you had a nasty day at work
17:29:10 <Tefad> to be honest? i've not played the game in a couple of months : D
17:29:33 <dih> i have not either, but at least i dont admit it
17:29:54 <Belugas> wrong, dih. i STILL have a bad day
17:30:19 <dih> well - if i then kicked you it would not be helpful
17:30:33 <dih> rather i accept the kick and "turn the other cheek"
17:30:55 <yorick> peter is still behind the fuzzlecam!
17:31:27 <waterpie> can you pls help me? i am totally lost
17:31:45 <SmatZ> waterpie: do you use transfer orders?
17:32:18 <waterpie> yes (transfer, full load)
17:32:33 <Tefad> waterpie: pics or it didn't happen.
17:32:44 <Rubidium> waterpie: transfer does not cause real payments
17:32:46 <henkie> my multiplayer game seems to desync sometimes :(
17:32:47 <SmatZ> waterpie: do you know how transfer works? if you don't, don't use them
17:33:37 <waterpie> then how do i tell the vehicles where to go?
17:34:11 <SmatZ> waterpie: you just load/unload, no transfer
17:34:45 <henkie> is it possible to trace the cause of a desync? (+easy)
17:35:02 <Rubidium> henkie: read the wiki docs about tracing a desync
17:35:24 *** Osai is now known as Osai^Kendo
17:35:31 <glx> henkie: remove the (+easy) part
17:36:29 <henkie> Rubidium, you got an url? i only see a network protocol description
17:37:47 <Tefad> happy leet-o'clock everyone!
17:38:16 <Prof_Frink> Tefad: You're not Dave2.
17:39:11 <Prof_Frink> Tefad: A ...person... in #lugradio
17:39:13 <henkie> desync happens really random, and can sometimes hours
17:40:13 <henkie> all newgrfs have checksums?
17:40:13 <Prof_Frink> Has an unhealthy obsession with all things goaty, and annonces leet o'clock, leeeet o'clock and other variants just about every day.
17:41:20 <SmatZ> henkie: before you start, there is a known desync problem in 0.6.1-RC1 (caused by removing city road or house)
17:41:45 <henkie> SmatZ, i/we are running 0.6.0
17:42:28 <peter1138> there's a known desync problem in 0.6.0 too, depending on grfs, heh
17:43:13 <waterpie> ok, thanks. i was just transfering cargo around. ...imo, "transfer" is a bit misleading. maybe "connect" is better (?)
17:45:14 <Rubidium> transfer is perfectly okay
17:45:26 <SmatZ> waterpie: you can use localised version (eg. change laguage to Greek) if you have problems understanding English
17:46:00 <Rubidium> airlines, busses, ships and trains in real life use the exact same term
17:48:50 <waterpie> (my english is ok, but it is just my imho). ...anyways, thanks
17:49:14 <dih> just my in my humble oppinion?
17:50:26 *** Yexo is now known as Guest2272
17:55:13 <mynetdude|Away> hey all somehow I loaded several newgrfs and some aren't showing, I saved my game went back to the newgrf menu and none were showing even though I had tram and town replacement graphics, is there any way to force the others to load? like train set, etc
17:55:24 *** mynetdude|Away is now known as mynetdude
17:56:32 <Rubidium> 1) press apply when changing NewGRFs in-game, 2) changing NewGRFs in-game can cause crashes
17:56:49 <Rubidium> 3) changing NewGRFs in-game won't change the newgame settings
17:56:52 <mynetdude> Rubidium yes I know it can cause crashes, I did hit apply
17:57:09 * mynetdude sighs... I have to start over as usual
18:04:04 <Karen_> to answer Smatz question: yes and no. The text in the image is what is in the file. The answer is not in it.
18:04:55 <yorick> are you going to give us the second clue?
18:05:16 <Karen_> yorick: having trouble finding the second answer?
18:05:36 <Zuu> I think i might have got half of the secord one, but not enterly. ..
18:06:08 <Zuu> Could be totally wrong too... :)
18:06:41 <Karen_> Zuu: it is not a composed number.
18:07:20 <Zuu> Karen_: Ok, I left that idea.
18:07:27 <Karen_> back to yes/no questions: you get 5 this time round
18:07:29 <mynetdude> ok cool, I got the newgrfs to load... except us town names won't load for some reason, although its there
18:08:15 <Rubidium> can I ask a question? really? can I? really? sure? ;)
18:08:37 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r12920 /trunk/src/town_cmd.cpp: -Fix (r12859): town rating was affected even after the test run
18:09:21 <Zuu> Karen_: Is the answer of #2 in r425?
18:10:07 <Karen_> Zuu: no, it is in latest revision, and r425 is not a number
18:10:42 <yorick> Does the account number or the password mean something, except saving my progress, and account number being a random seed
18:10:50 <Zuu> ok, then my theory failed.. :)
18:11:28 <Karen_> yorick: the account number is solely for that purpose
18:11:38 <SmatZ> hehe openttd.cpp:425 InteractiveRandom(); ... well, if you got the number by this function... :-D
18:12:30 <yorick> have we been given the second clue?
18:13:24 <yorick> have we been given the second clue?
18:15:42 <Karen_> keep on tryin! next session later on this evening.
18:18:00 <yorick> Roest, how is dragdrop going?
18:18:35 <Karen_> Roest: according to our stats page ( www.ottd.info/stats.php ): yes
18:18:37 *** elmex_ is now known as elmex
18:19:07 <Roest> i gave up earlier, for some reason it doesn't enter the switch case for dragdrop
18:19:43 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r12921 /trunk/src/openttd.cpp: -Codechange: coding style fixes and documentation updates.
18:20:02 <Roest> ohh documentation, me likes
18:20:26 <yorick> Karen_, you're either a known person to us, or reading the logs, or both
18:20:37 *** Digitalfox has joined #openttd
18:20:48 <Roest> it's more like an unknown spy account
18:21:31 * Rubidium wonders how CreateConsole should deliver a number
18:22:17 <Yexo> Rubidium: nice changing of openttd.cpp:425 :P
18:22:43 <Rubidium> she said it was the latest version
18:23:01 <Yexo> <CIA-3> OpenTTD: rubidium * r12921 /trunk/src/openttd.cpp: -Codechange: coding style fixes and documentation updates.
18:23:07 *** Osai^Kendo is now known as Osai^Kendo`off
18:24:50 <Prof_Frink> Roest: I would hardly class orudge as "unknown"
18:25:35 *** ooo4tom has joined #openttd
18:26:20 <SmatZ> it will either change to openttd.cpp:418 , or it is some other revision...
18:26:50 <SmatZ> I think it would be too risky to apply it to trunk of r12345 without being sure it won't change
18:29:49 *** stillunk1own has joined #openttd
18:31:19 <Prof_Frink> That's the combination on my luggage!
18:31:54 *** elmex_ is now known as elmex
18:33:17 <SmatZ> openttd.cpp:438 is a blank line, now it is really interesting...
18:33:46 <orudge> tis generation_seed = InteractiveRandom();
18:34:09 <orudge> generation_seed is set to GENERATE_NEW_SEED, which is -1. If it returns the result of InteractiveRandom, well...
18:34:16 <Prof_Frink> orudge: is or was?
18:34:33 <orudge> is, as of the latest revision
18:36:40 <SmatZ> orudge: yes, sorry, I had open window of 0.6.0 and 0.6.1-RC1
18:37:51 *** mynetdude is now known as mynetdude|Away
18:39:44 <SmatZ> well, I tried -1 yesterday several times :)
18:39:50 <SmatZ> even 65535 and so, no success
18:41:25 <peter1138> god, torcs fucking sucks
18:43:35 *** mynetdude|Away is now known as mynetdude
18:48:39 <Karen_> blame it on something else
18:52:07 <Karen_> yorick: do you need any further hints?
18:55:53 <SmatZ> that's bad, I don't even know what should I ask :)
18:58:02 <Karen_> SmatZ: what may i shed light on for you?
18:58:34 <Prof_Frink> Karen_: Jean is shorter than Brutus but taller than Imhotep. Imhotep is taller than Jean, but shorter than Lord Scotland. Lord Scotland is twice the height of Jean and Brutus combined but only one-tenth of the height of Millsy. Millsy is at a constant height of x - y. If Jean stands exactly one nautical mile away from Lord Scotland, how tall is Imhotep?
18:59:44 <Belugas> As Tall as His Glory when the Sun hits his Eyes on Eve of First Day of the Year, on the Shores of the Nile
19:00:09 <Karen_> Prof_Frink: that is not a yes/no question.
19:01:47 <Prof_Frink> Eight ladies go to eight shops at eight o'clock in the morning. Each lady wants to buy eight spiders. For each spider, eight spider shoes must also be bought. But they only have eight pounds between them. With each spider costing eight pence and each spider shoe costing an eighth pence each, will the ladies have enough change for the bus ride home? A journey costing eight pence per stop and made up of eight stops.
19:03:32 <Karen_> you do understand that the answer to that question is a joke on its own, not to be answered with yes or no?
19:03:54 *** elmex_ is now known as elmex
19:05:21 *** stillunknown has joined #openttd
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19:11:40 <Roest> yorick dragndrop almost works, but i have no time to finish it now, so tomorrow
19:12:06 <dih> once again Roest: he aint there
19:12:40 <orudge> Karen_: What are birds?
19:13:06 <orudge> Prof_Frink: What are birds?
19:13:31 <Prof_Frink> orudge: We just don't know.
19:13:43 <orudge> Prof_Frink knows of what I speak.
19:13:44 <Prof_Frink> orudge: What is water?
19:15:10 <weirdy> is there a Karen_ here?
19:16:00 <weirdy> are you the owner of ottd.info?
19:16:55 <weirdy> whats the answer to the second one/
19:17:17 <Karen_> only yes/no questions please
19:17:49 <Prof_Frink> Karen_: Is the answer to this question "no"?
19:17:51 <Belugas> good luck finding it!
19:18:25 <Karen_> Belugas: that sounds like you are getting somewhere with the 2nd riddle?
19:18:38 <Karen_> weirdy: no (what is ottd.ccp?)
19:19:04 <Prof_Frink> In soviet russia, game plays you!
19:19:12 <weirdy> has the second riddle got anything to do with code?
19:19:16 <Belugas> no Karen_, i was replying to weirdy and his ottd.cpp
19:19:18 <hylje> in soviet russia the game loses you
19:19:46 <Prof_Frink> Karen_: Will you get bored of us asking silly questions and bugger off?
19:20:04 <Karen_> blame it on something else
19:20:23 <weirdy> has the second riddle got anything to do with code Karen_?
19:21:09 *** sickie88 has joined #openttd
19:21:29 <Prof_Frink> Karen_: Do you have teh upload codez?
19:21:52 <SmatZ> with yes/no questions, we could get the right answer after ~13 questions (using binary interval halving)
19:22:32 <weirdy> whats the highest number you can count to using your fingers?
19:23:14 <Karen_> Prof_Frink: to the nuclear satellites? yes
19:23:22 *** dragonhorseboy has joined #openttd
19:23:36 <dragonhorseboy> any of you in here also on the !!expert zone!! server?
19:23:39 * weirdy gives up and just glares at Karen_
19:23:41 <Prof_Frink> It's not the answer, but try `head -n 438 openttd.cpp | wc -w`
19:23:41 <Karen_> weirdy: 1023, but not a yes/no question
19:24:22 <Karen_> and weirdy: stop staring at my chest! it is not polite...
19:24:43 *** Slowpoke has joined #openttd
19:25:17 <dragonhorseboy> so noone here on the server then?
19:26:58 <SmatZ> the answer could be anything including sprite numbers :-x
19:27:05 <SmatZ> but it has to be something evident...
19:27:33 <dragonhorseboy> its at like 11/11 clients but only 7/8 companies .. I'm wondering whats going on :/
19:27:42 <dragonhorseboy> <<wants to try that map for the second time
19:27:56 <glx> too many spectators I guess
19:27:58 <Karen_> SmatZ: blame it on something else
19:27:58 <SmatZ> two players play for the same company
19:28:35 <dragonhorseboy> glx...well do you even know of any other server with a small (literally) map and friendly players? ^-^
19:29:11 <glx> except when fighting a bug
19:30:00 <Belugas> which you do frequently
19:30:12 <Belugas> which means you do play oftenly ^_^
19:31:28 *** UserError has joined #openttd
19:31:45 <dragonhorseboy> humm *wonders about just starting a fifth server or not*
19:33:54 <weirdy> Karen_: is the ottd.ccp:xxx got anything to do with the fsking riddle?
19:34:31 <SmatZ> weirdy: do you mean openttd.cpp ?
19:34:46 <Karen_> weirdy: openttd.cpp:438 is the riddle.
19:34:59 <weirdy> i swear it was a different riddle last time
19:35:11 <Belugas> weirdy, may ai say you are wearing your nick very well?
19:35:28 <glx> weirdy: of course it's different, the file changed
19:35:30 <Karen_> SmatZ: the one who holds the file will help
19:35:45 <Prof_Frink> Peter holds the file!
19:35:45 <Karen_> weirdy: it used to be openttd.cpp:425, but something changed.
19:35:48 <weirdy> so it has something to do with the code for ottd Karen_?
19:36:22 <SmatZ> I won't rather bother him with that riddle, he doesn't seem to like it ;)
19:37:29 <Belugas> [15:34] <weirdy> how so/ <--- your questions are weird, really weird... So oblivious that it's even strange to ask them
19:38:22 <Belugas> maybe you're not paying attention to the various comments been posted in the channel?
19:39:43 <Karen_> Belugas: follow SmatZ' lead
19:40:50 <krix> Client #189 is dropped because it took longer than 500 ticks for him to join
19:40:55 <Karen_> Belugas: the one who holds the file will help
19:41:09 <krix> is this a server side problem or a client side? (because this client can connect to other servers)
19:41:30 <krix> but it can connect to other servers.
19:41:41 <glx> or pause_on_join disabled
19:41:43 <krix> this client was played yesterday :)
19:42:03 <SmatZ> it still can change while the map is being saved
19:42:40 <glx> when a client joins, the map is saved and sent to him
19:42:43 <weirdy> Karen_: can i solve it without using svn?
19:43:07 <glx> once he got it, it should do all commands performed while he was downloading in less than 500 ticks
19:45:06 <Noldo> what about the commands performed while that catch up?
19:45:06 <dragonhorseboy> hm just asking but anyone want try a challenging roads-only map? ^-^
19:45:18 <Belugas> weirdy, i can answer at least this one for karen: yes, you do not need svn.
19:45:34 <Belugas> the sources are available on nightlies and on git
19:45:37 <glx> Noldo: with pause_on-join that should not happen ;)
19:45:41 <Karen_> weirdy: svn can never be a problem for any riddle; there are web-interfaces
19:46:09 <weirdy> Karen_: does the 438 relate to line number/
19:46:52 <Karen_> weirdy: have you ever had contact with source files before?
19:47:14 <weirdy> someone tell me what the 438 is for
19:47:39 <Karen_> weirdy: have you then ever come across error messages?
19:47:42 <glx> openttd.cpp:438 is a standard notation (we use it often)
19:48:11 <Belugas> no File openttd.cpp, line number 438
19:48:28 <weirdy> right, but line 438 is the begining of an if statement
19:48:48 <weirdy> are you counting whitespace Karen_?
19:48:48 <Belugas> depends on which version
19:48:50 <Prof_Frink> weirdy: If you're using an old copy it may be 425
19:49:04 <weirdy> generation_seed = InteractiveRandom(); ?
19:49:30 <weirdy> glx: what does that mean?
19:49:54 <glx> you need to find something about this line
19:50:09 <Prof_Frink> No, that's not it at all.
19:50:32 <Prof_Frink> You need to find something to with which to bribe Karen_ or SmatZ.
19:51:56 *** raimar3 has joined #openttd
19:52:47 <weirdy> r12919 is the one i want to look at, right?
19:53:23 *** ziegenbot has joined #openttd
19:53:27 <glx> the rev doesn't really matter if you know what line it is
19:53:42 <Prof_Frink> Ooh look, weirdy is slowly going more insane
19:54:00 <weirdy> Karen_: do i need to look at r12919?
19:54:44 <Karen_> look at it long enough and you might go blind
19:57:04 <weirdy> Karen_: should i be looking at the line that reads "#if defined(WINCE) && defined(_DEBUG)"?
19:57:08 <Prof_Frink> Aww, there's very little swearing in the sources
19:57:19 <Karen_> weirdy: if you like; but it won't help you.
19:57:30 <Prof_Frink> weirdy: You need to see beyond the code
19:57:33 <glx> <weirdy> generation_seed = InteractiveRandom(); ? <-- THAT IS THE LINE
19:58:00 <weirdy> Geeks should be banned from making riddles
19:58:00 <Karen_> is there a punichment for being stupid?
19:58:16 <Prof_Frink> Karen_: Yes, it's called "being weirdy"
19:58:26 *** peter1138 sets mode: +b *!*riddle@*.lylix.net
19:58:26 *** Karen_ was kicked by peter1138 (like this)
20:01:40 <Belugas> weirdy, you can still talk to karen on MP
20:02:43 <Prof_Frink> Member of Parliament? Prime Minister?
20:03:21 *** peter1138 sets mode: -b *!*riddle@*.lylix.net
20:04:14 <Belugas> Prof_Frink : smart ass...
20:04:48 <Karen_> SmatZ: again, nice job.
20:06:10 <Karen_> SmatZ: dominik solved this one with one attempt.
20:07:51 <Karen_> glad to see you did too.
20:08:41 <henkie> is it possible to influence a primary industry to produce more?
20:08:45 <dragonhorseboy> hm well if anyone want to check for my server in the list and have fun ^-^ (several grfpack grf aside to george's plane grf)
20:09:06 <peter1138> george has a plane grf?
20:09:13 <henkie> like calling in the maffia
20:09:33 <dragonhorseboy> peter...several yeah
20:11:06 <peter1138> ah... they're probably all called beta2 as well
20:11:15 <peter1138> george has not really got the hang of version numbering
20:12:07 *** replaced has joined #openttd
20:13:05 <dragonhorseboy> peter...not quite
20:13:20 <dragonhorseboy> just check his thread on the russia forum... several neverchanged releases there ^-^
20:13:43 <dragonhorseboy> but either way...I've used this planeset for as long as I can imagine - to our own
20:13:47 <replaced> i just built openettd 0.6 on HP-UX
20:15:27 <replaced> speedy, zoom, zomg! i have some patches
20:16:23 <replaced> and the stuff for configure
20:16:49 <Belugas> you migh post them on bugs.opentd.org
20:16:51 <peter1138> dragonhorseboy: EACH
20:17:13 <SmatZ> HP-UX hprx B.11.23 U ia64 replaced: what is your uname -a?
20:17:38 <replaced> HP-UX grogaldr B.11.11 U 9000/785 2005479164 unlimited-user license
20:18:23 <Belugas> WIN-XP gf9adfho B.11.HU x386 what-the-heck-is-that??
20:18:32 <SmatZ> " 367 MHz PA-RISC 8500" nice :)
20:18:47 <replaced> 400mhz to be precise :)
20:19:04 <glx> Belugas: MINGW32_NT-5.1 LOIC 1.0.11(0.46/3/2) 2007-12-05 00:35 i686 Msys
20:19:37 <replaced> gotta compile it on alpha too!
20:20:14 <Karen_> Linux ottd.info 2.6.18-028stab053 #1 SMP Sun Feb 3 07:35:28 GMT 2008 i686 Intel(R) Pentium(R) 4 CPU 3.00GHz GenuineIntel GNU/Linux
20:20:53 <orudge> which of my 8 or so machines do you want? :p
20:21:03 <replaced> Karen_: too plain :>
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20:21:17 <orudge> obiwan is probably the most exotic
20:21:37 <orudge> Linux version 2.6.18-6-486 (Debian 2.6.18.dfsg.1-18etch1) (waldi@debian.org) (gcc version 4.1.2 20061115 (prerelease) (Debian 4.1.1-21)) #1 Sun Feb 10 22:06:33 UTC 2008
20:21:50 <orudge> VIA C7 Processor 1500MHz!
20:21:59 <orudge> which Debian seems to think is a 486, annoyingly
20:22:31 <orudge> it's currently running at 20 degrees C
20:22:35 <orudge> probably the coolest processor I've ever owned
20:22:48 <orudge> aux temp is a little bit... broken ;)
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20:23:24 <SmatZ> nah, you just got fire there
20:23:25 <replaced> mah netbsd machine is sleeping
20:23:40 <Prof_Frink> replaced: Does it contain two slices of bread?
20:24:06 <replaced> no i dont have the room...
20:24:17 <replaced> because its full of awesome!
20:24:46 <SmatZ> if I knew password to my modem
20:27:59 <replaced> is it ok to send netbsd and hpux patches in the same pr?
20:29:15 <SmatZ> I think it is better to open two tasks
20:31:48 <replaced> they are made for pkgsrc.org so the configure patch is one file
20:37:17 <Immow> I was wondering how to star a sandbox game so I can design some junctions?
20:38:31 <mynetdude> Immow on your own or in multiplayer?
20:38:39 <dih> double click openttd.exe on windows, openttd.app on os x, ./openttd on linux
20:39:26 <Immow> building something cost money. and I just want a map tahts flat and i have unlimited money
20:39:32 <Immow> cos my junction will be "big" :)
20:39:58 <Prof_Frink> Click the "give me more moneys" button repeatedly
20:41:09 <Immow> fun for me that ctrl alt c opens my ATI catalyst control center :)
20:41:20 <Prof_Frink> Immow: ctrl-alt-win-c
20:42:05 <peter1138> stealing our cheat key
20:47:12 <Ammler> You can't replace to a evaluation vehicle...
20:47:14 <Belugas> wooops... i should not have deleted that file :(
20:47:42 <SmatZ> Ammler: I don't think so
20:48:06 <glx> yeah I failed to see what I need in the savegame
20:48:20 <Karen_> glx: the most obvious thing.
20:48:56 <Karen_> (for your information: filenames are generated randomly on upload and are unrelated to the riddle itself)
20:49:59 <Karen_> glx: not that obvious :-p
20:50:47 <Immow> this junction is gonna insane
20:51:12 <dih> checkout openttdcoop.org juctionary
20:56:57 <SmatZ> Ammler: strange, it seems to be shown in my autoreplace window, and it seems to work
20:57:26 <Ammler> the engine is gone now
20:57:44 <Ammler> maybe something to do with engine_pool or something else
20:57:53 <SmatZ> there is no engine pool
20:57:56 <Ammler> can't reproduce it right away
20:58:28 <dragonhorseboy> any of you know about pbi+brickyard?
20:58:31 <Belugas> cosmic rays have hit you
21:02:14 <Immow> I can buldoze it but name stay's
21:02:44 <SmatZ> Immow: in the scenario editor
21:03:17 <dragonhorseboy> either way is the brickyard supposed to be slight broken in openttd yet?
21:03:22 <Karen_> glx: still very cold..
21:04:26 <dragonhorseboy> I've tried generate a map both with and without terragenesis & smooth and hilly landscape ... in all four I get zero quarries :/
21:06:03 <glx> dragonhorseboy: what version?
21:06:34 <glx> code is broken, they can't appear
21:06:36 <dragonhorseboy> hm thanks, know its not just me now
21:06:49 <glx> fixed in 0.6.1 RC1 though
21:06:51 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12922 /branches/noai/ (5 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: added AIStation::SetName() (Yexo)
21:07:25 <dragonhorseboy> fixed? seriously?
21:07:51 <dragonhorseboy> hm *asks my friend about RC1*
21:07:54 <SmatZ> I tried trunk, PBI 1.2, 1024x1024, Normal industries, no quarry neither
21:08:19 <glx> but in 0.6.0 it was impossible to even place them by hand
21:08:29 <dragonhorseboy> smatz.. even brickchain V1.31 too?
21:08:50 <Immow> hmmm probably overkill this "junction"
21:08:53 <dragonhorseboy> glx yeah....I still wonder why ECS wouldn't load here but then blah I guess what do I really know
21:09:30 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: strange, I can't find that GRF
21:09:53 <peter1138> Ammler: engine_pool problems did you say?
21:10:04 <dragonhorseboy> smatz...hmm I got it on website link from someone...perhaps pikka's livejournal or pikkarail website?
21:10:13 <dragonhorseboy> if its not in either - I have no clue then 0_o
21:10:20 <Ammler> peter1138: no, forget it :-)
21:10:25 <dragonhorseboy> either way anyone here run ECS in openttd?
21:10:32 <glx> SmatZ: it's in ottdcoop pack
21:10:42 <dih> Ammler: you can't reproduce?
21:10:59 <Karen_> glx: if you look at the riddle for the first time, what would you try to do?
21:11:21 <glx> first thing I tried was getseed :)
21:12:27 <peter1138> when i first looked at the page i saw white with images around it
21:12:44 <Karen_> glx: have i ever provided unneeded information with a riddle?
21:13:04 <peter1138> so i guess it's a firefox-only page
21:14:27 <SmatZ> depends if your browser supports translucency
21:14:48 <peter1138> ie7 does, just it's done in a different way to firefox
21:18:48 <dragonhorseboy> not sure why the server decided to convert but either way...
21:19:19 * dragonhorseboy never could understand why it'll never let itself be enabled
21:19:52 <dragonhorseboy> often just played the map with default industry on these grfs otherwise
21:20:08 <glx> dragonhorseboy: ecs town MUST be the first
21:20:44 <glx> just read the error message given by other ECS sets
21:21:15 <Karen_> SmatZ: thank you, a stupid thing to forget to check; peter1138: can you check now, problems should be fixed.
21:21:44 <dragonhorseboy> glx...still does the same...ecs town vector stays disabled and refuses to even enable
21:22:05 <dragonhorseboy> sometimes I wonder if there's something bugging that one grf
21:22:39 <glx> and if you put it before ttrs?
21:24:14 * Sacro is stuck on question 2 :(
21:24:16 <dragonhorseboy> jeeze...*bangs head on wood table*
21:24:34 <dragonhorseboy> glx...you're too clever I didn't think of ttrs being possible at fault for messing up ecs
21:24:51 <dragonhorseboy> when I shoved ttrs to the very bottom then started a new map... ttrs ended up disabled but ecs is fully working
21:25:15 <dragonhorseboy> hmmm ecs doesn't quite replace 100% of the town buildings .. but I guess I can live with that
21:25:18 <Karen_> Sacro: the one who holds the file will help
21:25:31 <dragonhorseboy> *hugs glx so hard*
21:25:33 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12923 /extra/ottd_grf/split/ (openttd.nfo overrides.nfo): -Change: Add engine GRF overrides for some common sets.
21:25:39 <glx> dragonhorseboy: ttrs has some params to disable its own industries
21:26:50 <dragonhorseboy> ttrs industries?...huh?
21:27:09 <dragonhorseboy> you telling me someone added industries into ttrs? (I don't even recall v2 having any which is what I run in ttdp now)
21:27:15 <dragonhorseboy> hmm that explains it now
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21:29:49 <DGMurdockIII> do i need the orignal game to play this
21:30:13 <glx> the data files from it yes
21:30:18 <Karen_> Sacro: blame it on something else
21:30:46 <dih> DGMurdockIII: it sais in the readme file
21:32:14 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: peter1138 * r12924 /trunk/ (49 files in 8 dirs): -Feature: Introducing the so called 'engine pool' which primarily removes the fixed engine type limits and also happens to allow (with the patch option 'dynamic_engines') multiple NewGRF vehicle sets to coexist.
21:32:27 <dragonhorseboy> hmm glx...not sure if its just the map itself but some of the ecs industries such as the forest are saying 'cargos waiting to be processed: 0 vehicles'
21:32:42 <dragonhorseboy> at least 'production last month:' actually says '0 tonnes of wood'
21:33:01 <glx> dragonhorseboy: read ECS pages on ttdpatch wiki
21:34:04 <replaced> ok, patches sent to bugtracker, thanks
21:34:32 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12925 /branches/noai/ (4 files in 2 dirs): [NoAI] -Add: added AIIndustry::GetAmountOfStationsAround() (Yexo)
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21:38:02 <dragonhorseboy> glx hm so several industries need some vehicles anytime to be able to produce more than zero I take it?
21:39:05 <glx> not really, they produce without them
21:39:28 <glx> anyway the production never start immediately
21:39:48 <Karen_> a very good night to you all
21:45:54 <dragonhorseboy> hmmm ecs sure looks complex for a poor single player (to me) heh
21:46:39 <dragonhorseboy> peter...*points to quarries*
21:49:26 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12926 /branches/noai/bin/ai/regression/regression.txt: [NoAI] -Fix r12925: it has been a while, but... forgot to update regression (tnx glx)
21:49:35 <dragonhorseboy> hmm I remember why I didn't want to bother going outside 0.6.0 anymore
21:49:53 <dragonhorseboy> 0.6.0-RC1 is erroring about some absurb grfs I don't even see anywhere .. neverminding about something else too
21:52:27 <dragonhorseboy> just what the hell is tbtest12.grf anyhow?
21:53:03 <peter1138> no point in 0.6.0-RC1 if you've got 0.6.0 ...
21:56:05 *** XeryusTC is now known as Xeryus|bnc
21:57:17 <dragonhorseboy> peter...there is one tho: I can actually see quarries now :) (now to fix RC1 to shut up like I did with 0.6.0 before ... brb)
21:57:30 *** Osai^Kendo`off is now known as Osai
22:03:03 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12927 /branches/noai/src/ai/ai_gui.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: don't crash on the GUI when an AI failed to compile and you still manual it (bug by glx)
22:06:56 *** Osai is now known as Osai^zZz
22:07:33 *** Osai^zZz is now known as Osai^zZz`off
22:07:36 <DorpsGek> Sacro: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (line 1)
22:07:46 <DorpsGek> Sacro: 1.41288640609
22:07:54 <DorpsGek> Sacro: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (line 1)
22:07:58 <DorpsGek> Sacro: 1.55740772465
22:08:04 <DorpsGek> Sacro: 0.997830183906
22:08:11 <Tefad> secreting those enzymes
22:08:14 <DorpsGek> Sacro: 1.10714871779
22:08:15 <Tefad> secreting those hormones toooooo
22:08:27 <SmatZ> Sacro: you can PM DorpsGek if you don't know
22:08:33 <Sacro> is that radians or degrees
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22:09:32 <Ammler> peter1138: is your overwrite nfo code already documented?
22:10:03 <SmatZ> Sacro: no, it is not a linear functions
22:10:19 <DorpsGek> Sacro: 0.785398163397
22:11:10 <Tefad> my pancreas attracts every other pancrease in the universe with a force proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the distance between them
22:11:22 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: 3.14159265359
22:12:38 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: truebrain * r12928 /branches/noai/src/ai/ai_squirrel.cpp: [NoAI] -Fix: don't crash when reloading an AI that has a compile-error (bug by Fingon)
22:13:34 *** Osai^zZz`off is now known as Osai
22:13:54 <SmatZ> well... tangent is periodic with period of pi
22:14:17 <dragonhorseboy> hm quick question
22:14:26 <dragonhorseboy> any of you in here have serbian narrow gauge train grf?
22:14:36 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: it deplaces DEM
22:14:47 <SmatZ> if that is your question
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22:15:02 <dragonhorseboy> well I'm wondering if you're able to load it in game?
22:15:17 <SmatZ> do not change grfs in-game
22:15:58 <Ammler> dragonhorseboy: you need narraw gauge tracks too
22:16:02 <dragonhorseboy> loading only it and narrow gauge rails v0.93a ... the trainset always disable itself fatally in either order in newgrf .. even if I remove the rails grf :-/
22:16:29 <dragonhorseboy> and no this time I don't have anything else loaded
22:17:45 <dragonhorseboy> I should mention both grfs are from grfpack7-beta1
22:17:48 <Ammler> hmm, our server is dead
22:18:55 <Ammler> dragonhorseboy: did you read the readmes?
22:20:03 <Ammler> you need to load ngrails with 1. parameter = 4
22:20:28 <Ammler> then it will replace maglev with narrow gauge,
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22:27:18 <dragonhorseboy> sometimes I wonder where 0.5.3 went to as it was easy to figure out what was to do
22:27:38 <dragonhorseboy> (neverminding to today I still have no clue where my gamesaves are on the hd from 0.6.0 :p )
22:29:11 <Rubidium> dragonhorseboy: then you should start by NOT reading the readme
22:30:57 <dragonhorseboy> rubidium...well excuse me for c>games>openttd060>save> not existing when >openttd053>save> it does
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22:32:08 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: readme.txt:139
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22:43:57 <dragonhorseboy> smatz..there's no 'my document' at all here
22:44:07 <dragonhorseboy> thats why I wonder why openttd can't just use the old /save/ folder
22:44:28 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: depends on your language
22:44:43 <SmatZ> almost ALL programs save data to that directory
22:45:58 <dragonhorseboy> they (especially photoshop) go to c:\files\ and any caches/scratchdisk are c:\raw\
22:46:11 <dragonhorseboy> ammler.. xp home
22:46:13 <Ammler> SmatZ: just read the readme, there is no "global" share for linux?
22:47:01 <SmatZ> Ammler: I think it saves shared data to the installation directory only
22:47:23 <SmatZ> eg. /usr/share/games/openttd/bin/data
22:47:30 <Rubidium> Ammler: shared directory is conceptually different from the installation directory (at least in my opinion)
22:47:51 <SmatZ> so it is /usr/share/games/openttd/data
22:48:01 <Rubidium> in the shared directory all users should be able to write, whereas that does not need to be the case in the installation directory
22:48:52 <Ammler> there is no common location for that in linux
22:50:08 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: check C:\Documents and Settings\<username>\Documents\OpenTTD
22:50:26 <SmatZ> that folder may be marked as hidden in default windows settings
22:50:44 <SmatZ> byt you should have "My Documents" link on your desktop
22:51:12 <SmatZ> dragonhorseboy: what windows do you use?
22:51:25 <SmatZ> if Win9x, then you have C:\Documents\OpenTTD
22:52:00 <SmatZ> and you can always do "Windows doggie search *.sav"
22:52:52 <Ammler> and is there a reason, why scenario location is handled not as saves?
22:53:20 <dragonhorseboy> xp home and there's no 'my document' .. only 'files' or 'raw' aside to the windows folder being the typical itself
22:53:24 <Ammler> default is working directory
22:54:31 <Ammler> cfg saves are in ~/.openttd/
22:54:40 <Ammler> but if I like to load scenario
22:54:43 <glx> "my documents" is present on all windows since win95
22:54:53 <Ammler> oh, maybe I need to create a folder scenario there
22:56:02 <Ammler> SmatZ: a small glitch :-)
22:56:22 <dragonhorseboy> glx...not if you're doing custom install
22:56:43 <glx> then you don't follow microsoft standard
22:56:45 <Ammler> then you define mydocuments self, like I did
22:56:57 <Rubidium> dragonhorseboy: then you would've fucked up the registry in such a manner that you would know where you would've put your "My documents" directory.
22:57:14 <Ammler> maybe its d:\OpenTTD ?
22:57:22 <dragonhorseboy> glx..not true... windows does not require that silly (which is often empty on many other systems anyhow) folder
22:57:24 <glx> Ammler: yes I redirect My documents to d:
22:57:38 <dragonhorseboy> just like I seriously do have a 98se pc that has no explorer.exe physically (and yes it does run)
23:01:04 <glx> openttd just ask windows for the document dir
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23:08:27 <Ammler> dragonhorseboy: you can still keep the old way by keeping the cfg in the directory where the openttd.exe is.
23:09:31 <Rubidium> (again as described in the readme)
23:11:26 *** Osai is now known as Osai`off
23:12:08 <CIA-3> OpenTTD: smatz * r12929 /trunk/src/town_cmd.cpp: -Fix [FS#1967](r12560): town rating was too often reset to Mediocre
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23:32:03 <teeg> oh, while I've patched ottd for a friend of mine (apparently buildottd caused his computer to bluescreen repeatedly, so I had to do it for him) to support his (and my) 30" monitor, I figure I might as well see if I can't get that in to trunk: http://mindriot.as/bigger_resolution-r12929.patch (yes yes, it's a simple patch. sue me.)
23:34:48 <Rubidium> teeg: fails to apply horribly on trunk
23:35:37 <glx> use a clean trunk next time
23:48:37 <Rubidium> how hard can it be to sync such a simple patch to trunk...
23:50:14 <glx> it should apply with an offset in r12778
23:50:54 <teeg> It was actually made against 0.6.1-rc1, but apparently you made a modification in 12779 which removed that constant in its entirety from ottd.
23:51:47 <glx> now tell us what it means
23:52:03 <teeg> and I'm currently recompiling trunk to see if that fixes the resolution issue. which is why I went silent and didn't sputter around here arms flailing helplessly.
23:52:41 <teeg> and the answer to that is very simple. it no longer applies. forget the patch.
23:55:18 <teeg> or, at least it does on windows. I haven't got linux running on this monitor, so I can't verify those platforms.
continue to next day ⏵
