IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2007-09-12
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00:17:33 <wleader> Cool, the first part of my patch is working. If you try to purchase land a tile that has a town building on it, it clears it, buys it, and grows a new town tile somewhere else.
00:17:59 <wleader> Its also got the cost substantially higher, and a reduced rating cost.
00:18:08 <wleader> So now I need to do the same thing with road tiles.
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00:54:34 <wleader> Cool version 1 of my town restructuring patch is done. Anyone interested having a quick look over it?
00:55:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm not sure if i could gather the sense of that patch...
00:58:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'll rephrase that: what are you actually trying to achieve?
01:01:31 <wleader> The base program, you can use eminent domain and bulldoze a town tile knocking down builings that way really messes with your town rating.
01:01:45 <wleader> To deal with that you have have to plant trees, wait, bribe, etc.
01:02:05 <wleader> But why not just make the property owner an offer they can't refuse.
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01:02:45 <wleader> if you have the money its just easier to offer the property owner 10 times market value, and overall unhappiness is reduced.
01:02:58 <wleader> So it kind of simulates that sort of situation.
01:05:00 <wleader> its just a faster more reliable way of building in a town.
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01:40:46 <Eddi|zuHause2> my isp is having the hiccups
01:51:19 <MrBrrr> Try to scare your ISP, always helps with the hiccups.
01:56:08 <Eddi|zuHause2> i don't think the Big Magenta T is that easily scared by a random poor student complaining
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07:12:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11089 /trunk/ (15 files in 4 dirs): -Codechange: add revision detection to MSVC.
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09:09:40 <Chris82> does anybody know how tree growth is controlled in the source?
09:10:03 <Chris82> I want to make the random placement of new trees be relative to the daylength so the map isn't covered with jungle in 2 years :p
09:17:39 <SmatZ> Chris82: TileLoop_Trees
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10:12:44 <Rubidium> because "somebody" reordered the widgets *and* did use magic numbers instead of enumified constants
10:13:44 <Chris82> too bad I am no magician :D ok I will look where those magic numbers are used with this patch
10:14:37 <Rubidium> magic numbers are most likely in the routemarkers patch
10:14:42 <Chris82> I thought this here "(e->we.dropdown.button == 13 || e->we.dropdown.button == 14)" are magic numbers too, but when I replace with with VLD_WIDGET_ROUTEMARKER_DROPDOWN the button doesn't work anymore
10:15:10 <Rubidium> there are two widgets for the dropdown menu
10:16:30 <Chris82> yeah I called them VLD_WIDGET_ROUTEMARKER_DROPDOWN and VLD_WIDGET_ROUTEMARKER_BUTTON
10:16:54 <Chris82> which I thought are the equivalent for 13 and 14 so I replaced it but that breaks the menu totally
10:17:17 <Rubidium> is that before or after the speed thingy tab
10:17:55 <Chris82> I introduced this widget names before, but I tried replacing the 13 and 14 after the speed thingy tab because that patch "broke" the dropdown
10:18:00 <Chris82> it was working fine before adding this patch
10:19:28 <Chris82> when I leave the 13 and 14 there the dropdown menu works "fine" except that it is drawn in the completely wrong place
10:20:49 <Rubidium> because it is drawn at the wrong widget
10:22:52 <Chris82> yeah but I don't understand why suddenly
10:23:54 <Rubidium> because somebody changed the order of the widgets
10:24:32 <Chris82> and what do I need to change now so the dropdown is in the right place again?
10:24:48 <Chris82> the speed button was added and a widget called endline
10:25:44 <Rubidium> and I can't be bothered to look at the diff either
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11:33:06 <Chris82> does anybody happen to know why BamBam limited the routemarkers patch to 6 colours compared to richk's original version?
11:34:06 <Rubidium> I guess BamBam knows...
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11:42:16 <Chris82> BamBan has vanished tho :( lol
11:42:57 <Rubidium> maybe he's on some German site
11:47:19 <Chris82> he was on TTDLXHQ (www.tt-ms.de) but he isn't anymore for a few months already
11:47:56 <Chris82> he allowed positive penalties in his version of routemarkers which crashes the game, just not too often since they are negative most of the time
11:48:05 <Chris82> I am just fixing this using the original patch of richk
11:59:52 <SmatZ> A* algorithm cannot work with negative track costs, you would have not to use YAPF
12:00:32 <SmatZ> it will work, will work wrong, or may hang
12:00:57 <SmatZ> you would have to handle at least circles with negative cost...
12:03:27 <Chris82> yup but before testing routemarkers I have to fix the bug that grass growth on unused tracks grows routemarkers instead of grass :D
12:09:20 <Chris82> base = SPR_OLDTRACKS_BASE + 10 * (phase - 1);
12:09:48 <Chris82> but how should that printf look like properly?
12:09:48 <Chris82> I want to see what value base has
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14:13:10 <Bjarni> I just won a million EURO
14:13:17 <Bjarni> I just got a mail telling me this
14:13:46 <Bjarni> all I need to do is to contact some bank in NL
14:14:12 <Bjarni> it looks somewhat similar to the Email I got yesterday from some Czech guys, who wants to give me some huge grant
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14:14:44 <DeGhosty> what's the program to check diff?
14:14:48 <Bjarni> in fact parts of it is copy paste... so do you think I will inform them my bank info so they can transfer the money? :P
14:15:43 <Bjarni> if you want to read a diff, just open it in a text editor. It's a plain text file
14:15:44 <Belugas> DeGhosty, breath, relax and explain in details your need
14:18:58 <Ammler> Hi, is there a page where I can see which GRF NFO Actions are in OTTD possible?
14:19:15 <Ammler> i.e. is Action10 possible?
14:19:29 <glx> there is ottdcompat somewhere in the forum
14:21:18 <Bjarni> Ammler: make a test grf, compile the newest trunk and check if it works. I guess this is the most up to date info on what features the trunk supports ;)
14:21:31 <Belugas> and somewhere on wiki.openttd, there is a page about that, but i don't remember url
14:21:47 <Belugas> Ammler, the best way to know is to look at the sources
14:21:57 <Belugas> newgrf.cpp is the first place to check
14:22:03 <Ammler> Belugas: yeah, I am looking for that, I've seen it too, but can't find it now
14:22:51 <Belugas> it's there, i'm sure... and for sure notcomplete. think it was peter's work
14:23:24 <Ammler> :), I try newgrf.cpp and the "real" test
14:24:46 <Ammler> yes, thx, "labels" are supported then?
14:25:22 <Belugas> [10:23] <@Belugas> it's there, i'm sure... and for sure notcomplete.
14:25:51 <Ammler> ok, I try and edit it, if so...
14:26:02 <DeGhosty> i want to generate a diff
14:27:11 <glx> diff file1 file2 > output file
14:27:52 <glx> ^^ that is the generic method, as you didn't specify what kind of file you want to compare
14:32:46 <skidd13> Ammler: IIRC someone of the dev's wrote a grf-action checker.
14:33:00 <Ammler> Action10 is in newgrf.cpp
14:33:49 <glx> skidd13: yes it's ottdcompat, but it is outdated
14:35:52 <Ammler> Belugas: not complete means, there are more supported things, but everything whats listed should be ok
14:37:04 <Belugas> supported things indeed, not supported not listed. Some are in trunk supported but not reported on the page
14:40:07 <DeGhosty> how i compile like asdf.c
14:44:46 <DeGhosty> what happen if i need mutiple?
14:45:05 <glx> gcc -o output <file list>
14:48:08 <DeGhosty> how i compile libraries?
14:50:15 <frosch123> SmatZ: your new patch?
14:51:35 <frosch123> it does not look like a mock-up.
14:52:13 <SmatZ> I just hope nobody is working on something similiar :-p
14:53:21 <frosch123> underground railway
14:53:24 <SmatZ> I just transformed some thoughs into real code
14:56:51 <DeGhosty> is it signal in tunnel?
14:57:51 <SmatZ> bridges yes, signals not yet - maybe in few mins :)
14:57:59 <SmatZ> problematic is rendering
14:58:23 <Belugas> cannot read oog files :(
14:58:46 <frosch123> I would let him draw barren land
14:58:55 <Belugas> how many bytes have you added to the maparray?
14:59:25 <frosch123> I guess currently you clip every tile above a certain heightlevel, draw barren land instead
15:02:26 <SmatZ> rendering is not in the focus now, I would like to get rid of asserts everywhere :-p
15:04:11 <DeGhosty> we need more view options
15:06:49 <DeGhosty> or roller coster tycon
15:06:57 <frosch123> Am I the only one, who keeps rewinding and playing?
15:07:44 <Belugas> and we are eating it up!
15:08:41 <SmatZ> yes.. now 3 uploads atm
15:08:45 <DeGhosty> what are u guys doing?
15:09:40 <Belugas> looking/typing at irc screen, right now ^_^
15:10:10 <glx> frosch123: but we can't open .ogg
15:10:22 <frosch123> I only downloaded the ogg
15:10:34 <glx> I'll mirror the avi when done
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15:12:52 <glx> nooooo 1 leecher added :(
15:13:58 <DeGhosty> the moutain like disappeared
15:14:16 <DeGhosty> yea earth would look awsome
15:14:37 <DeGhosty> can we signal in it?
15:14:51 <SmatZ> signals will be ready soon
15:15:18 <SmatZ> but the code is unusable for any playing... asserting after almost every action :)
15:15:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> what do you mean with bridges in tunnels?
15:16:19 <SmatZ> bridges outside, tunnels inside
15:16:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> oh, that way :p
15:17:20 <DeGhosty> oh and add the option to go up a bit
15:17:28 <DeGhosty> i mean when ur tunneling u can change elevation
15:18:12 <SmatZ> I am in the beginning of the code, not caring about GUI now ...
15:20:43 <DeGhosty> when you are tunneling, you can change elevation?
15:22:28 <Belugas> relax, DeGhosty, he's only starting...
15:23:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> looks very promising
15:25:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> note, when allowing slopes in tunnels, you also need to allow sloped tunnel entrances [similar to sloped bridge ramps] (needs new graphics)
15:25:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> the gui will get a mess :p
15:26:48 <SmatZ> it won't be a mess, if it would, some features would be disabled instead :-)
15:27:01 <DeGhosty> i imagin it would just be an over lay of current graphics
15:27:23 <DeGhosty> watch it it's AWSOMe
15:33:45 <Belugas> cannot open the damn file... my system myt be screwed or something
15:33:58 <Belugas> i'll have AGAIN to wait to go home
15:35:39 <SmatZ> xine-lib doesn't open it, but mplayer does
15:35:47 <SmatZ> on my system ... I have xine bad :)
15:36:02 <glx> vlc has no pb with the avi
15:36:25 <glx> firefox didn't like the .ogg
15:36:40 <DeGhosty> .ogg is just a wrapper file
15:36:49 <DeGhosty> vlc have no prob with ogg
15:37:19 <glx> .ogg is usually a sound file, .ogm is used for video
15:43:07 * Belugas wishes he could already be home
15:45:09 <glx> many people are downloading it but I don't see any comments :)
15:46:17 <TrueBrain> and I can't get a decent upstream :p
15:46:42 <glx> TrueBrain: try frosch123 mirror :)
15:46:53 <Belugas> as usual, the "silent majority" syndrom ^_^
15:46:59 <glx> he only have the .ogg but a decent up
15:47:07 <TrueBrain> glx: I can't play ogg
15:47:18 <TrueBrain> glx: I can't play ogg
15:48:38 <TrueBrain> your http doesn't even reply :p Oh well, 4 minutes left :p
15:49:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> kaffeine (xine) had no problem playing the .ogg
15:50:30 <Belugas> SmatZ, from what i can see, you're trying to make "visible" all the tiles that are on the height above tunnel entrance, right?
15:52:59 * SmatZ back, had a fast dinner
15:53:06 <TrueBrain> glx: as fast as it gets :p
15:53:17 <TrueBrain> glx: suprised me you didn't do that ;)
15:53:35 <glx> I don't have a devs.openttd.org account
15:53:52 <SmatZ> Belugas: yes,mousewheel sets the _current_height, and what is above it, is not drawn
15:54:30 <glx> SmatZ: so you broke zoom handling?
15:54:48 <SmatZ> also, things are built on _current_height, and so, 3d map array is needed ... dynamically allocated, so it doesn't eat all memory :)
15:54:56 <SmatZ> glx with ctrl + mouse wheel
15:55:18 <SmatZ> actually, it may change... now I try to make it working without asserts :)
15:55:41 <TrueBrain> I hate slow upstreams
15:55:51 <Belugas> what would be required (it has been discussed before) is to have a block of memory specifically for the tunnel path
15:56:06 <Belugas> but i think you are talking about closely the same thing
15:56:33 <Phazorx> what is video container for that ogg?
15:56:48 <Phazorx> mpc seems having an issue recognizing it
15:56:51 <Belugas> and the drawing of the "above tunnel" tiles could be done with new tiles gfx or else... dunno yet
15:56:58 <Belugas> but it seems WOW of ao strat :)
15:57:09 <SmatZ> Belugas: yes... but to make things simpler, everything (except MP_CLEAR and MP_TREES) is in the 3d array
15:57:28 <SmatZ> so subway stations, depots etc is possible...
15:57:54 <TrueBrain> Ogg stream 0 is of an unknown type
15:57:55 <TrueBrain> [Ogg] stream 1: audio (Vorbis), -aid 0
15:57:57 <SmatZ> allocated in 64x64x1 x-y-z block
15:58:00 <TrueBrain> I guess my mplayer doesn't know ogm :)
15:58:16 <Phazorx> well my ogm splitter doesnt know ogm either
15:58:46 <TrueBrain> I need to recompile mplayer for ogm support... too lazy :p
15:59:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> konqueror says "filetype: theora video"
16:01:11 <SmatZ> yes... originally I wanted to place only MP_RAILWAY and MP_ROAD into the 3d array, but this is easier
16:01:23 <SmatZ> and the 2d array can now be smaller
16:01:58 <SmatZ> I am not sure about water yet... eg. building water tunnels and tunnels under water
16:02:15 <SmatZ> but this is so so far... :)
16:03:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> what happened to the raised water level/deep water patch
16:05:38 <Belugas> boekabart is the one to ask about it, dunno
16:05:45 <Phazorx> theora was a bad choice of codec whoever made that clip, but i like the idea for sure
16:05:48 <Belugas> peter1138 was watching over him, i think
16:10:30 <Ammler> TrueBrain: take VLC...
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16:39:12 <Wolf01> " Jean-Francois Claeys (Belugas) - In training, not yet specialized",
16:39:13 <Wolf01> i think this can be updated, don't you? :D
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16:47:44 <Wolf01> eh, he worked on newhouses (in coop with Maedhros if i'm not wrong), he is working on newindustries, he is working on the documentation
16:51:29 <Wolf01> maybe all the credits should be updated, that is only the first line i've see when i opened that source file to look for a function
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17:16:22 <Wolf01> is not related to OTTD
17:16:38 <Wolf01> but i don't know who ask :P
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17:33:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> "//skip the first 2 chars "/x"" <- can't you do that in the sscanf instead of copying the string one by one?
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17:36:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> i mean like "/x%2x%2x%2x" as format pattern?
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17:42:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> or "%*2c%2x%2x%2x"
17:42:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> * means the value is ignored
17:44:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think you miss some guardig against illegal input, though
17:48:03 <Wolf01> uhm, it doesn't work, or maybe i'm dumb
17:49:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> try the 2nd version
17:50:01 <Wolf01> yes, the second version
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17:50:42 <Wolf01> it works, but i'm trying to avoid the while by passing the /c###### to the function instead of the whole string
17:53:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> there should also be clip and copy functions for strings
17:53:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> instead of a while loop
17:55:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> i mean C-strings are just pointers, so passing a substring starting from index i would be the same as passing (str+i)
17:55:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> there must be similar ways with std::string
17:56:25 <Tefad> or is it c_str() i forget
17:56:47 <Tefad> you'd probably want to use a substring though
18:01:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> what i mean, there should be a way without copying
18:01:46 <Tefad> that's what HLLs are all about.. redundancy. ; )
18:01:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> and especially a way without copying with a for loop
18:02:10 <Tefad> substring is probably what you're looking for
18:03:03 <Wolf01> v before v now v in 5 mins
18:03:03 <Wolf01> :D ... :) ... :| ... :(
18:03:18 <Tefad> yourstring.substr(2,yourstring.length())
18:03:27 <Tefad> assuming you want the remainder of the string.
18:04:51 <Tefad> i *think* that's what you're going for, eh?
18:05:11 <Wolf01> the function is called in this way:
18:05:12 <Wolf01> DrawStringExt(10, 110, "/b000000/c00ff00Test: /bFF0000/c0000FFbackground color before the text color", C_GREEN, C_YELLOW);
18:06:02 <Tefad> i'm failing to understand the goal
18:06:27 <Tefad> oh, this is your business
18:06:29 <Wolf01> it draws a string with a colored text and a colored background
18:07:03 <Tefad> in GetColor() get rid of the loop
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18:07:31 <Tefad> std::string colorcode = text.substr(2, text.length());
18:08:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> make that substring in the function call, not in the function
18:08:36 <Tefad> i've yet to grasp what in the dickens is going on
18:08:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> i.e. GetColour(text.substring(pos,pos+8))
18:09:48 <Tefad> is length ever other than 6?
18:10:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> assumig substring takes start (including) and end (excluding), instead of start and count
18:10:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> the latter is how i remember it from pascal
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18:10:50 <Tefad> start and length, 0-based
18:11:07 <Tefad> (the former.. the latter is a size)
18:11:41 <Tefad> "OH NOES".substr(3,2) yields "NO" iirc.
18:11:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> "the former" is the opposite of "the latter"
18:12:13 <Tefad> start value is 0based, length is a size.
18:12:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> so substring(pos,8)
18:13:22 <Tefad> probably shouldn't use 'magic' number ; )
18:13:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> that's his job :p
18:15:00 <Tefad> i think he wants 6 btw, not 8
18:15:17 <Tefad> 8 was including the /c count
18:15:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, could also use (pos+2,6)
18:16:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> and then leave out the "%*2c"
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18:23:51 <Wolf01> length = text.copy(buffer, code_length, pos);
18:23:51 <Wolf01> sscanf(&buffer[length], "%*2c%2x%2x%2x", &r, &g, &b);
18:23:51 <Wolf01> but it have weird effects
18:24:32 <Wolf01> i should debug it after dinner
18:24:43 <TrueBrain> Wolf01: printf is your friend :)
18:24:55 <Bjarni> heh, I got yet another mail telling me I won a lot of money
18:25:07 <Bjarni> I think they are getting less and less trustworthy :P
18:25:13 <TrueBrain> wow Bjarni, I think you are the only one who receives such emails!!!!
18:25:24 <TrueBrain> that I get the spam in my inbox is bad enough, that I have to enjoy it on IRC too..... :s
18:25:35 <Tefad> i think what he really wants is this: iss(text.substr(2,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.r; iss(text.substr(4,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.g; iss(text.substr(6,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.b; col0.r /= 256; col0.g /= 256; col0.b /= 256;
18:25:56 <Tefad> though, i've not coded in C++ since 2001
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18:32:31 <Tefad> you might need to #include <iomanip>
18:32:44 <Tefad> Wolf01: does that even compile?
18:35:14 <Tefad> modified: if ((iss(text.substr(2,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.r).fail() || (iss(text.substr(4,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.g).fail() || (iss(text.substr(6,2)) >> std::hex >> col0.b).fail()) { /* OH TEH NOES, FAILLUR */;} else { col0.r /= 256; col0.g /= 256; col0.b /= 256; }
18:38:35 <moebius_> and people still wants to use C++ when you can write such atrocities ???
18:38:36 <Tefad> else { col0.r = (col0.r + 1) / 256; col0.g = (col0.g + 1) / 256; col0.b = (col0.b + 1) / 256; }
18:38:46 <Tefad> moebius_: you want to see java instead?
18:38:56 <moebius_> haha, I know it's even worser
18:39:26 <Tefad> that's the proper conversion for 8bit to float, for colors.
18:39:28 <moebius_> simply I find funny how hairy things can become
18:39:47 <moebius_> I've made myself some preprocessor abuse in plan C...
18:40:08 <Tefad> i love the token operator
18:40:12 <Tefad> or whatever it's called
18:40:29 <Tefad> #define foo(bar) someshit##bar
18:40:52 <DaleStan> Token pasting operator.
18:41:10 <Tefad> they don't teach you that one if you take a class ; )
18:41:37 <DaleStan> I use that to much effect in NFORenum. Whether it's "good effect" or not is debatable.
18:41:44 <Timwi> I'm trying to build the latest version... When I run the result, I get two error messages about ini settings. Anyone know?
18:41:47 <moebius_> hehe, you're right, I've read about it in books, noone said nothing in class
18:41:58 <Tefad> but you only use goto if you're writing drivers or something anyway, and want to optimize at the sake of losing consistency
18:42:06 <moebius_> you can emulate c++ templates using plain C with ##
18:42:08 <DaleStan> Delete or rename openttd.cfg and try again.
18:42:35 <Timwi> I don't have such a file, DaleStan
18:42:42 <Tefad> unless your type is already some preprocessor masterpiece
18:42:52 <Tefad> then sometimes the preprocessor gets confused : \
18:42:58 <DaleStan> There are other uses for goto. Interlaced loops, for one.
18:43:16 <Tefad> eh, that's usually a sign of poor style
18:43:25 <moebius_> yeah, right... the thing that I find impressive about C is that it hardly changed since its conception
18:43:30 <Tefad> and usually continue/breaks resolve those eh?
18:43:58 <Tefad> moebius_: only because the standard library doesn't do diddly ; )
18:43:59 <DaleStan> Nope. Because then I couldn't break out of the enclosing switch.
18:44:36 <Tefad> that's the only time they overloaded a statement i think
18:45:07 <Tefad> switch isn't really soemthing i would think i could break out of
18:45:17 <Tefad> continue would make more sense, eh?
18:45:23 * moebius_ continues making statistics exercises
18:45:35 <moebius_> it's funnier talking about languages and the such
18:45:41 <Tefad> moebius_: you ever realize how funny /me strips would be?
18:45:52 <moebius_> but i recall having an exam next tuesday
18:45:57 <Tefad> perhaps that's why you chose the handle ; )
18:46:15 <moebius_> I have never thought about that one!!
18:47:11 <Tefad> well now you have some fodder for lame joke haters
18:47:40 <moebius_> I've chosen it because of that man which was good at maths
18:47:46 <Tefad> gotcha. this handle is a collection of random keystrokes i liked. picked it out in 1995
18:47:46 <moebius_> and there is also a french guy which makes comics
18:47:46 <moebius_> lol, it's being a lot of time since then
18:48:02 <moebius_> mine was about 1999, I think
18:48:15 <Tefad> my yahoo profile was last updated in 1997 profiles.yahoo.com/tefad
18:48:46 * Belugas found a memory leak in grfmaker
18:48:56 <Tefad> unless of course, you wrote it, and might take offense . . .
18:49:37 <Timwi> I SVN currently slow? I'm trying to update to an earlier revision, and it hangs
18:49:41 <Tefad> finding bugs in open source software, at the source level at least, is always pleasing, i would think
18:50:09 <Tefad> of course this is moot if that project isn't open ; )
18:53:07 <Belugas> so grfmaker is not moot since it is an open source software :)
18:53:19 <Belugas> and what's even more, it is in Delphi :D
18:54:38 <Tefad> pascal just needs to die : \
18:55:41 <Ammler> is Delphi something like TurboPascal++?
18:55:48 <Tefad> on steroids, with an IDE
18:56:27 <moebius_> isn't it for harddisks?
18:56:52 <Tefad> integrated development environment
18:57:17 <moebius_> ah, so unix is an IDE
18:57:17 <Tefad> the thing you can click on and see all your functions
18:57:17 <moebius_> it has editors, build tools
18:57:17 <moebius_> and a shell to blend them together
18:57:17 <Tefad> uh, unix is kind of the lack of and IDE
18:57:46 <Tefad> an IDE is a front end to one or multiple tools
18:58:05 <Tefad> i'm off to eat a burrito then work. toodles
18:58:08 <Ammler> hmm, are there compiler for delphi on linux?
18:58:36 <moebius_> Ammler: I heard freepascal is somewhat good as well
18:58:37 <blathijs> Ammler: That's a native port of delphi by Borland
18:58:37 <moebius_> don't know which level of delphi compatibility does it have
18:59:35 <blathijs> It used to be rather buggy combined with mouse-over focus
19:00:56 <Belugas> I've never worked with Kylix. It is my next target.
19:00:59 <Belugas> blathijs : "Used to be" ? means it has been corrected?
19:00:59 <TrueBrain> no, it means Kylix is dead :)
19:01:39 <Belugas> [14:55] <Tefad> pascal just needs to die : \ <--- everyone is entitled to its favorites
19:01:50 <Belugas> it is dead? ho.. bugger :(
19:01:57 <moebius_> well, pascal is somewhat... rigid
19:01:58 <moebius_> I mean, you cannot make hairy things to awe your friends
19:02:09 <Belugas> it's how you use it that makes it rigid
19:02:31 <Belugas> 'cause you can make it quite a flexible tool if yo wish
19:03:24 <moebius_> I find at least std. pascal to be "featureless"
19:04:55 <moebius_> but fasttracker2 was done with tubropascal 7
19:04:56 <moebius_> and that amazes me :D
19:04:56 <moebius_> I personally have nothing against pascal, it's just that I prefer not having to touch code written in it
19:04:56 <Belugas> standard pascal needed to evolve. Borland got Delphi out (granted a migration from Turbo Pascal) and Pascal received the evolution it was required
19:04:57 <Ammler> delphi isn't oo, is it?
19:05:31 <Belugas> i've learned C/C++ long after Pascal/Delphi. I have a profond preference toward the later
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19:14:36 <Tefad> there you have it. RMS says pascal sucks. : x
19:15:06 <blathijs> 21:00 <@Belugas> blathijs : "Used to be" ? means it has been corrected? <-- Don't know, I've never used it since :-)
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19:15:30 <Tefad> also, that statement is probably context with 80's
19:15:36 <Tefad> on that note, i'm really out.
19:15:58 <moebius_> "Pascal is both weak and inelegant compared with Lisp"
19:16:10 <moebius_> well, at least Pascal is easier to write
19:16:26 <glx> blathijs: lost response I think ;)
19:16:34 <moebius_> the last time I tried learning LISP, I nearly got my pants converted in a pair of parentheses
19:16:55 <blathijs> glx: Perhaps someone else cares :-)
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19:20:40 <glx> [21:15:09] <blathijs> 21:00 <@Belugas> blathijs : "Used to be" ? means it has been corrected? <-- Don't know, I've never used it since :-)
19:21:55 <Belugas> looks like i may have to find ways to get my own opinion ;)
19:28:06 <Belugas> which is, ironically, written in c/c++
19:28:10 <TrueBrain> fpc is nice, just it failed when I tried with 64bit code :p
19:28:30 <TrueBrain> although I read that they are the first to produce 64bit windows code in an open source compiler
19:28:48 <moebius_> well, ironically the Borland VCL shipped with C++Builder was written in Delphi, too
19:30:45 <Belugas> no, that is pretty logical. C++ builder was written way after Delphi. And it was made so that both programs can share libraries
19:31:33 <moebius_> I never used the VCL from delphi, but it was quite pleasant to use from C++
19:31:47 <moebius_> (at least compared to raw win32 and MFC)
19:32:08 <moebius_> so I think the guys at Borland made a good decision reusing it
20:02:02 <Wolf01> http://rafb.net/p/xN9rWu24.html i think now is better, thank you for your support, i still have problems to find a way to assert if the colorcode is not an hex, but i think i'll find how to do it
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20:11:22 <zangetsu2> Could someone explain to me the correct use of return_cmd_error?
20:11:45 <zangetsu2> I've added a string to my language file, but when I try to return it I get an Assertion Error.
20:11:55 *** zangetsu2 is now known as wleader
20:13:34 <Belugas> did you added it to the english lang file too?
20:14:01 <wleader> I put it in the english language file first.
20:14:21 <wleader> Then I just used return_cmd_error(STR_MY_STRING_NAME);
20:14:36 <wleader> Which seems to work just fine.
20:15:35 <wleader> because if I follow the code execution back to command.cpp ln 618, it works right up until it gets to the assert on line 623.
20:16:29 <wleader> I think that the message is not the problem, but instead the problem is comparison between res and res2.
20:17:44 <glx> res == res2 assert means you did something wrong
20:18:07 <glx> as DC_EXEC result should be the same as ~DC_EXEC
20:19:46 <wleader> Here is the trouble though. I am working on my town restructuring patch, and I can't test the town growth during ~DC_EXEC, but I do need to test that the growth occurred during DC_EXEC.
20:20:14 <wleader> There is a test that is happening in DC_EXEC thats not happening in ~DC_EXEC.
20:21:04 <glx> that shouldn't happen else it will probably cause desync
20:21:41 <wleader> So I need to find a way to check if the town can grow without actually growing the town.
20:22:01 <wleader> Well that just made things a little more difficult.
20:22:56 <wleader> ok, At least I understand what my problem is.
20:24:36 <Timwi> It's not been responding for the last two hours
20:28:08 <glx> server has been restarted
20:31:46 <Timwi> Done that 10 times already :-p
20:34:24 <Timwi> Yes, works for me now too
20:34:27 <Timwi> Sorry, should have mentioned :)
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20:42:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> Wolf01: little style things
20:43:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> the Color variables need a consistent naming style
20:43:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> the code_length could use const
20:43:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> and i would make the colorcode variable local to each switch block
20:43:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> or don't use it at all
20:49:14 <Wolf01> thank you for the suggestions
20:51:21 <Belugas> th_gergo, do you have that bridge-grf that behaves wrong in ttdp and right in ottd?
20:51:30 <Belugas> wold require it for testing
20:55:30 <wleader> I've been thinking about my problem with testing if the town will grow, and I am thinking that there are two ways to do this: 1) rewrite GrowTown and other functions it uses to create two functions, one to grow the town, and one to test if the town can grow, or 2) modify the GrowTown function (and related) to accept a DC_EXEC flag. Given my experience I would think that option 2 would be easier, but uglier solution any thoughts?
20:59:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think the DC_EXEC version would be more consistent with the rest of the code
21:00:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> you will probably run into problems with randomness
21:00:43 <wleader> what do you mean by the randomness?
21:01:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> there is a multiplayer synched random and a multiplayer unsynched random
21:01:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> you need to use the first with DC_EXEC and the second with ~DC_EXEC
21:01:51 <wleader> like the first go with ~DC_EXEC it might find a location to build, but the second go with DC_EXEC it might find a different (and possibly not ok to build) location?
21:02:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> that might also happen
21:04:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> alternative would be to remember the result of the random decisions, and only consider that exact result in the DC_EXEC part
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21:08:51 <wleader> I quick glance at the growtown code, there doesn't seem to be anything random really going on in there.
21:12:14 <DeGhosty> u need 9 station and a few truck / bus
21:12:23 <DeGhosty> and even faster if u lay out the road
21:15:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> DeGhosty: totally unrelated
21:15:58 <Bjarni> damn you Eddi|zuHause3
21:16:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> i love you, too.
21:16:40 <Bjarni> do you realise how much time I spent watching Verstehen Sie Spaß after you talked nice about it?
21:17:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> that was like a week ago :p
21:17:39 <Bjarni> I didn't stop watching
21:18:40 <wleader> Wow, GrowTownInTile is a mess.
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21:21:21 <wleader> It almost makes me want to rework the town growth code...
21:21:27 <wleader> might actually be easier.
21:21:45 <wleader> of course i'd have to become a whole lot better at c++
21:21:54 <Bjarni> I will not stop you from trying
21:22:56 <Bjarni> worst case: you screw up and makes something that's worse than the current one, so it's rejected, but then you learned stuff while you tried, so it's in no way a waste
21:23:03 <Bjarni> practice makes perfect
21:23:40 <Bjarni> usually if the concept is good, the result tend to end up the same way
21:24:31 <Eddi|zuHause3> the first prototype gets thrown away anyway
21:24:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's to learn how not to do it
21:25:06 <wleader> I guess the thing to do would be to break the code down into smaller tasks like FindEmptyTownTile, then use that to decide where to build. Then have another function like GetTownLayoutElement that determines what should be built there, road or house. Then uses these smaller functions to re-implement things like GrowTown and create CanTownGrow.
21:25:27 <Bjarni> sounds like what I told myself after I stopped working on one of the first patches
21:26:13 <Bjarni> it didn't really work, so I hacked it to work. The code became more and more messy and it became even more buggy and then I thought "this is not the way to solve this issue. Let's start all over"
21:27:00 <Bjarni> in the end, I was never able to make it even remotely close to something useful, so it was never finished
21:28:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> ... so autoreplace was commited unfinished :p
21:28:28 <Bjarni> actually I didn't even think of autoreplace back then
21:28:55 <Bjarni> I investigated how to activate railroad crossings earlier... none of my ideas worked
21:29:15 <Bjarni> hence the reason why I didn't finished it
21:29:35 <wleader> I hate to admit it, but one of the things that gives me a hard time is bitmasks. They take me forever to figure out what they are doing, and when I do figure it out, I'm still confused. I usually code professionally in Delphi and VB, and neither makes frequent use of bitmasks. I'm just not yet trained to use them.
21:29:43 <Bjarni> it actually turned out to be a problem that's a whole lot harder to solve than I thought back then
21:29:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> you mean like activate all crossings when a train passes on only one track?
21:30:06 <Wolf01> and if a level crossing is like a signal, you can activate a signal at distance
21:30:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> or activate in advance, while the train is few tiles away?
21:30:27 <Bjarni> activate the crossing when the train is like 3 tiles away
21:30:38 <wleader> We're you trying to make road vehicles less likely to get hit by a train?
21:30:50 <Bjarni> never figured out what to do if the crossing activated and then the train turned in a switch and never reached the road
21:31:10 <Bjarni> <wleader> We're you trying to make road vehicles less likely to get hit by a train? <-- actually eliminate the issue
21:31:20 <Bjarni> except in case of breakdowns
21:31:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> might be solveable if we ever get a working PBS :p
21:31:49 <Bjarni> I tried to do this while the newest stable release was 0.1.3 or 0.1.4
21:32:02 <wleader> I'm sure the code was a lot different then.
21:32:07 <Bjarni> nobody had PBS back then
21:32:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> i don't think the crossing activation changed a lot since then
21:32:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> aside from removing direct map accesses and cleanup
21:32:59 <Bjarni> no, because all attempts failed, so none of them were committed
21:34:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> Wolf01: bad idea
21:34:51 <Bjarni> that idea will not solve the issue. In fact it will make it worse
21:35:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> with a newbie-track: station--track--station, the crossing will always be closed
21:37:26 <Wolf01> and without signals on rail, so trains won't be affected, but all the 3 tiles in front of and beyond the crossing flagged as a sort of signal?
21:37:53 <Wolf01> assigned automatically when the crossing is built
21:38:14 <Bjarni> what if there is a switch between the road and the activation tile?
21:38:48 <Wolf01> when the train leave the 3 flagged tiles the crossing will be reset
21:39:24 <Bjarni> what if each branch crosses a road?
21:39:32 <Bjarni> will both crossing activate?
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22:02:36 <Ammler> SmatZ: is it possible to switch off "building mode" and see only the tunnel entry and a mountain?
22:02:38 <SmatZ> yes, a bit deadlocked :)
22:03:13 <Progman> Ammler: would be worse if you don't know where to build to
22:03:32 <Progman> switch back, "aah there", switch in, build
22:04:03 <Ammler> SmatZ: can you also go up in the mountain?
22:05:34 <SmatZ> Ammler: things like pathfinder would handle it, but I cannot build that rail atm
22:05:59 <Bjarni> SmatZ: nice photoshop work
22:06:31 <Ammler> Bjarni: didn't you see the movie
22:06:32 <Progman> but looks very promising
22:06:41 <exe> to activate "building mode" you click something on the tunnel entrance?
22:07:07 <SmatZ> Ammler: will post video how to build situation in your image :)
22:13:47 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11090 /trunk/projects/ (5 files): -Fix (r11089): incorrect version format and failure with paths containing spaces
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22:46:36 * Smoovious touches the brim of his black hat.
22:47:46 <Smoovious> just popping in while I'm still in Tulsa... will be leaving for Houston tomorrow night to meet up with my truck, and then will be with a trainer for the next few weeks
22:50:58 <Smoovious> welp, not much time... I poof
23:01:28 <Vikthor> erm wrong window, I mean good night
23:06:00 <Bjarni> whatever language that might be
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23:58:33 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11091 /trunk/src/ (road.h town_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: Partial rewrite of the road management code of towns, in order to make it more readable and with improved performance. (FS#1161 by skidd13)
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