IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2025-10-19
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07:10:03 <kuhnovic> _jgr_: Damn, he put quite some work into it. Impressive.
07:33:20 <LordAro> ic111's patch queues were the stuff of legends
07:33:27 <LordAro> good ol' more height levels
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07:52:30 <reldred> Aw man I loved rainfall river generator. Was a bit slow on some settings but very impressive.
08:29:50 <peter1138> Hmm, so Mac OS makes a mess of the custom small font I see.
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08:57:43 <andythenorth> Hmm just woke up
10:04:08 <andythenorth> yeah 1 coffee isn't enough
10:04:15 <andythenorth> normally I have 4
10:23:12 <reldred> I'll have like one can of monster, the rule is to have it done by midday, and then I avoid caffeine the rest of the day
10:23:21 <reldred> might have a coffee in the afternoon but usually only one
10:24:00 <andythenorth> wasn't an intentional rule, just seems to work
10:24:43 <reldred> Yeah I used to drink a helluva lot more caffeine than I do now. Used to have like 4-5 strong coffees a day
10:25:30 <reldred> I think my record was seven? doing a multi-site install, five sites, and they all had brand new espresso machines. Didn't sleep much after that.
10:25:55 <andythenorth> were they internet connected espresso machines?
10:26:02 <andythenorth> was it part of the install?
10:26:23 <reldred> i was installing telling bones
10:27:02 <reldred> many many moons ago when i was a dog and bone technician
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10:44:31 <reldred> that said it's only quarter to nine and I'm about ready to go lay down and have a snooze so manybe I need more caffeine in my life 🤔
10:44:57 <reldred> joys of getting old I suppose
11:06:19 <xarick> dang... RiverFlowsDown is dumb
11:06:51 <xarick> if it's at sea level, it can flow down to itself
11:31:53 <xarick> this looks bad if i say so
11:33:29 <xarick> the bfs approach for each height segment combined with perlin is actually a good combo 🙁
11:33:44 <andythenorth> unforseen consequences
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13:52:55 <xarick> instead of reinventing the wheel
13:53:06 <xarick> yapf does the bfs instead
13:54:00 <xarick> yapf no longer has the ability to build
13:54:08 <xarick> now it only returns the path
13:54:38 <xarick> it will be built in a separate function named BuildRiver in landscape.cpp instead
13:56:11 <xarick> the MakeLake part is still.... bfs
14:06:57 <xarick> 11128265 us vs 9467433 us
14:12:15 <xarick> oops, my lakes are disconnected
14:48:49 <xarick> okay they also happen on the original method
14:52:01 <xarick> I have a stupidly bad weird idea
14:53:16 <xarick> based on my previous work on get a list of all possible destinations
14:53:38 <xarick> get all inclined slopes this time
14:53:52 <xarick> and feed the pf with them to calculate estimated costs
14:56:47 <jfkuayue> peter1138: Pumpkin spice tastes like putting sugar into some traditional chinese herbal medicine (which is usually bitter), for me
15:41:06 <xarick> alright, this was a bad idea
15:41:26 <xarick> unless I get the inclined slopes only once
15:44:05 <andythenorth> "rivers difficult"
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17:07:11 <Borg> anyone can give me a hint how to concatenate string in GS?
17:07:22 <Borg> text=GSText(GSText.STR_NEED2_CARGO,tx1,tx2);
17:07:37 <Borg> I tried and it fails.. it only added tx1 (GSText instance)
17:08:02 <Borg> STR_NEED2_CARGO:{}{BLACK}Cargo needed for town growth:{STRING}{STRING}
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17:15:34 <rito12_51026> local text = GSText(GSText.STR_NEED2_CARGO);
17:15:34 <rito12_51026> text.AddParam(tx1);
17:15:34 <rito12_51026> text.AddParam(tx2);
17:17:01 <Borg> rito12_51026: but GSText() accepts params.. just fine..
17:18:29 <Borg> so this is sth else.. it seems like second {STRING} is ignored
17:19:25 <rito12_51026> or maybe try `text=GSText(GSText.STR_NEED2_CARGO, tx1 + tx2);`
17:19:53 <Borg> I doubt you can add tx1 to tx2.. they are GSText() instances..
17:19:57 <Borg> objects.. you cannot merge them
17:24:46 <LordAro> the documentation definitely suggests that multiple parameters should work fine
17:24:58 <LordAro> but variadic constructor... could easily have been broken unintentionally
17:26:47 <Borg> im looking at SCC_STRING: case.. and I have no clue whats going on
17:27:03 <Borg> StringID str = args->GetInt32(SCC_STRING);
17:27:08 <Borg> this is definitly not right..
17:27:12 <peter1138> The awkward part is the number of parameters consumed.
17:27:24 <Borg> it looks like it wants string ID again
17:27:34 <Borg> I want to pass GSText() result.. but RAW_STRING doesnt work either
17:27:37 <peter1138> GSText are processed elsewhere.
17:29:27 <Borg> looking at strgen_tables.h STRING takes 1 param
17:29:48 <Borg> but maybe Im reading it wrong. it should be STR ID again from lang/
17:30:10 <Borg> actually I cannot see where I can use GSText() result..
17:32:13 <peter1138> GSText is handled in game_text.cpp. That treats SCC_STRING differently from the normal string processing in strings.cpp.
17:34:22 <Borg> yeah.. no clue how it works
17:34:29 <Borg> okey.. so it seems I tried to be too smart
17:34:39 <locosage> what are tx1 and tx2?
17:34:45 <Borg> I wanted to avoid having shitload of STR_IDs for every case of cargo combination
17:34:51 <Borg> locosage: they are GSText() instances itself
17:34:58 <locosage> do they use parameters?
17:35:09 <locosage> iirc you need STRINGn with n being the total number
17:35:24 <Borg> thats confusing :/ I tought GSText() handles everything
17:35:37 <Borg> tx1=GSText(sid,cid,t.cam[0],cid,v);
17:36:06 <Borg> I supply params there.. sid from lang/ cid is cargo ID... t.cam[0] is cargo amount.. and v needed
17:36:27 <Borg> locosage: you are saying that I need to set all those params on final GSText?
17:37:35 <locosage> I think you need `{STRING5}` for tx1 then
17:37:44 <Borg> something fishy is happening.. because first {STRING} works
17:38:12 <Borg> if I swap paramteres.. tx2,tx1
17:38:14 <locosage> but it may be screwing parameters for the second one
17:38:16 <Borg> I see water instead of food
17:38:26 <_glx_> does tx1 consumes args ?
17:38:27 <Borg> but always just single {STRING}
17:38:43 <Borg> greeter: yes.. I pasted you GSText() constructor earlier
17:38:57 <Borg> it should prepare text for display..
17:39:19 <Borg> text=GSText(GSText.STR_NEED2_CARGO,tx1,tx2);
17:39:32 <_glx_> so yeah STR_NEED2_CARGO is incorrectly using {STRING}
17:40:12 <_glx_> you should have many warnings in script debug window
17:41:27 <Borg> okey.. Ill dig that myself...
17:43:37 <Borg> oh.. there is OT_INSTANCE
17:46:11 <_glx_> {STRING} consumes GSText instance
17:48:04 <locosage> my comment about 20 params total may not be relevant in 15.0 though but looks like the rest still applies
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17:49:00 <locosage> actually, was that limit 20 param limit removed recently?
17:50:13 <Borg> okey.. sth more akward happened
17:50:20 <Borg> still display one line.. now passangers ;)
17:50:57 <locosage> so is it completely unlimited now?
17:51:45 <_glx_> it should, like internal strings
17:56:15 <Borg> so.. GSText() all it does it just prepare string and parameters? and thats all?
17:56:27 <Borg> whole FormatString() happens whatever you do SetText() somewhere?
18:00:25 <Borg> thx locosage .. its freaking akward..
18:00:40 <Borg> I suspect its done that way due to netcode, to send text over network
18:00:54 <_glx_> SetText() encodes the GSText() and FormatString() handles the drawing of the encoded text
18:01:45 <_glx_> during encoding a lot of validation happens (can be really verbose)
18:02:43 <xarick> need help to get rid of bfs for lake guessing
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18:39:10 <xarick> how fast is kdtree at inserting 900 entries?
18:39:33 <xarick> for pathfinding reasons
18:40:35 <xarick> 900 inclined slopes, needing to calculate the closest inclined slope to where I am at the moment
18:40:56 <xarick> for the estimated cost, for each node
18:45:58 <xarick> inclinedslope_kdtree.cpp ?
18:46:20 <xarick> I'm so tempted to do something stupid
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19:08:51 <rito12_51026> Does `{STRING}` command allows to insert std::string or only StringID ?
19:11:45 <peter1138> Within the normal (non-script) string system, only string ID. {RAW_STRING} exists for, uh, raw strings.
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19:50:39 <xarick> is centre_tile british enough?
19:50:51 <xarick> or center_tile is better?
19:58:21 <xarick> i had a but in my code
19:58:50 <xarick> a variable "tile" hiding the other variable "tile"
20:06:28 <xarick> I need ideas to find a spot for a lake
20:06:41 <xarick> or I'll just remove lakes
20:08:17 <andythenorth> lakes are only there for rivers that can't find a coast
20:08:20 <andythenorth> they're just a sink
20:10:47 <xarick> this is the code for a river, migrated to yapf
20:12:39 <jfkuayue> I hope everyone enjoyed the 11-day holiday from 3rd September 1752.
20:21:02 <peter1138> jfkuayue, wrong way around.
20:35:20 <rito12_51026> andythenorth: does that meet your expectations?
20:35:30 <andythenorth> haven't compiled it 🙂
20:35:53 <andythenorth> but that railtypes dropdown has definitely needed taking out and shooting for a while 🙂
20:37:18 <andythenorth> slow compile is slow
20:39:15 <rito12_51026> What's wrong with renaming?
20:39:35 <peter1138> I don't see the point of adding that.
20:40:23 <peter1138> You need to learn about scope.
20:42:58 <rito12_51026> I need to learn a lot of things
20:44:29 <peter1138> Yeah. I would prefer to have none of the string changes in an initial PR to change how railtype selection works.
20:44:48 <andythenorth> I mean....the improvement in UX here is significant
20:44:50 <peter1138> Renaming railtypes is an entirely separate affair and is most probably not really desirable.
20:45:06 <andythenorth> so does the PR need picking apart into components?
20:45:14 <peter1138> (I would've removed renaming engines long ago, tbh, but hey.)
20:46:13 <peter1138> including table/strings.h from within a header file is a big no-no for me too.
20:46:40 <peter1138> Which is funny because we do in places. Hmm.
20:46:48 <rito12_51026> I have added rename feature because there was a button on the sketch
20:47:06 <peter1138> That's because the sketch is the build vehicle window.
20:47:08 <andythenorth> the sketch was not a considered design 🙂
20:47:17 <andythenorth> it was more "could we stop seeing the silly dropdown list"
20:48:02 <peter1138> We'll have to see how it works in practice.
20:48:26 <andythenorth> my alternative idea was like station / objects selection panel
20:48:34 <andythenorth> but that would require categories
20:48:41 <andythenorth> thought it was a bit weird
20:49:06 <andythenorth> this will work well with badges I think
20:49:11 <andythenorth> 'electrified' and so on
20:49:27 <andythenorth> the badge filter is nice
20:49:54 <andythenorth> I suspect you're not respecting the 'hidden' railtype flag 🙂
20:50:03 <rito12_51026> peter1138: so RailTypeInfo::GetString should be moved into the cpp file
20:50:18 <peter1138> I shouldn't need to exist.
20:50:22 <peter1138> It shouldn't need to exist.
20:50:34 <peter1138> I don't know why you changed it from how it currently is to that.
20:50:57 <rito12_51026> ah the rename was the reason
20:51:27 <peter1138> By implementating that you've made the changes in the PR much larger.
20:51:49 <rito12_51026> should have done that in second commit
20:51:58 <rito12_51026> it added about 200 lines
20:51:59 <peter1138> I would say: 1st step is reorganising code to support a new window.
20:52:15 <peter1138> 2nd step is implementing the new window with a little new features as possible.
20:52:30 <peter1138> Then later, things like hiding and renaming may (or may not) be done separately
20:53:38 <rito12_51026> Is it possible to split specific files from commit with git?
20:53:53 <peter1138> You can stage bits of files, yes.
20:54:19 <talltyler> `gui gui` is probably a helpful tool for what you’re trying to do
20:55:13 <peter1138> Anyway, before doing anything.
20:55:22 <peter1138> Let's stick the preview tag on it so we can, uh, preview it.
20:55:57 <andythenorth> does that cause it to build on my MBP?
20:56:01 <peter1138> My initial concern is "is this the right way to go for a new UI?"
20:56:22 <peter1138> And if it's not, then reworking it to meet our... strictness... is not useful.
20:57:00 <peter1138> andythenorth, yes, it logs into your MBP, and then opens up your KeepAss without a password to compile it.
20:57:45 <andythenorth> probably why my GPU is maxed out
20:59:09 <talltyler> Someone smarter than is strongly recommends it
20:59:44 <tabytac> Tbh i don't think a whole new window that is detached from the toolbar for selecting railtypes/roadtypes is really a good user experience.
20:59:44 <tabytac> Something more akin to what Cities Skylines 1 & 2 has with Layered toolbars with tabs to support much larger number of types
21:00:52 <peter1138> Deploymen to preview is in progress, can be tested soon.
21:01:37 <mmtunligit> tabytac: oh that'd be nifty, you could have all the badges for filtering as icons along the top as well that you could just click on, instead of yet another dropdown
21:02:38 <peter1138> "all" could end up being a lot ;-)
21:03:32 <mmtunligit> it could yeah i noticed the flaw in my plan before i started writing it, but i still thought itd be worthwhile to consider
21:04:26 <rito12_51026> peter1138: Therefore I'm not going to touch it until you decide if it is the appropriate way.
21:05:23 <mmtunligit> maybe have a dropdown for each axis you could filer across then, one for groundsprite, one for electrification, one for gauge, etc
21:05:42 <rito12_51026> tabytac: Cities Skylines forces to use icons and current design strings
21:05:54 <mmtunligit> then you have a limited number of tabs but an unlmitied number of options in each tab
21:06:00 <andythenorth> whilst the OpenTTD UI has many issues
21:06:15 <andythenorth> I am sort of hesitant about introducing more UI, not designed by UI designers 🙂
21:06:19 <andythenorth> when we have existing patterns
21:07:08 <mmtunligit> andythenorth: the time for context menus is nigh
21:08:17 <peter1138> Hmm, okay, so it doesn't currently actually select the selection :)
21:08:28 <andythenorth> hmm when I recompile vanilla, I am going to hate seeing the railtype dropdown 🙂
21:08:42 <mmtunligit> right click on a station? it brings up a menu to change the sprite, what station its a part of, orientation
21:08:47 <mmtunligit> i see no issues with this whatsoever
21:09:19 <peter1138> rito12_51026, the thing doesn't really seem to work properly at the moment?
21:09:47 <peter1138> Oh I see. It is listing unavailable rail types which I can't build yet.
21:10:13 <peter1138> "New (invalid parameter) now available!"
21:10:18 <andythenorth> of that have the hidden flag
21:12:21 <andythenorth> toggling badges on and off shrinks the window vertically 🙂
21:12:42 <peter1138> Yes, window system isn't not particularly good with dynamic widgets.
21:12:51 <andythenorth> it's subtracting the space for the filter, then not expanding
21:13:16 <peter1138> Build vehicle window does the same.
21:13:34 <andythenorth> well this is widly better than the dropdown list
21:13:42 <andythenorth> and I don't think this pattern would be the one
21:13:55 <peter1138> I don't like the amount of screen space it takes up and continues taking up.
21:14:37 <peter1138> Like, should the window disappear after making a selection? But then you can't view the details before making a selection...
21:14:43 <andythenorth> it has windowshade 😛
21:14:58 <andythenorth> to build stations (2x UI zoom) I pretty much have to use windowshade
21:15:18 <peter1138> Also: should it some how just be part of the Railway Construction window itself.
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21:15:47 <brickblock19280> I also noticed now that it doesn
21:15:57 <andythenorth> the thing that ButGroundTypes was most stuck on was UI
21:16:15 <mmtunligit> if if is part of the construction menu then everything needs to be tucked away in dropdowns imo
21:17:02 <andythenorth> this was Frosch's mockup, it was nothing but first idea
21:17:11 <andythenorth> same issue though, selecting from dropdown lists
21:17:28 <mmtunligit> but personally id rather not see the construction menu get any bulkier
21:17:35 <brickblock19280> filtering on multiple badges at the same time would be nice
21:18:07 <brickblock19280> mmtunligit: could do large and small versions as with the finance window
21:18:20 <tabytac> yeah thats a good idea
21:18:46 <brickblock19280> pain to code ofc but having to click twice to enter the build menu is a pain
21:19:25 <andythenorth> dunno, windowshade does a lot for me
21:19:35 <peter1138> talltyler, preview is up now if you want a go.
21:19:43 <andythenorth> I can't build stations with the station GUI otherwise
21:20:08 <peter1138> There's niggles like it shows up underneath the railway toolbar window so you can't see the whole thing initially.
21:20:14 <peter1138> And it shows railtypes which are not yet available.
21:21:07 <mmtunligit> hmm just noticed something, if the setting for linking the landscape menu to the cunstruction menu is on, then opening the landscape menu by itself probably shouldnt put a gap between it and the taskbar if nothing else is open
21:21:10 <rito12_51026> > Hmm, okay, so it doesn't currently actually select the selection 🙂
21:21:10 <rito12_51026> I have forgot about that part
21:21:10 <rito12_51026> > "New (invalid parameter) now available!"
21:21:10 <rito12_51026> again rename is the reason
21:22:16 <brickblock19280> Personally I'd like this ui to still work
21:22:50 <rito12_51026> > Oh I see. It is listing unavailable rail types which I can't build yet.
21:22:50 <rito12_51026> so i didn't understand the dropdown code correctly
21:22:57 <brickblock19280> it does rn because you forgot about the traditional mode
21:23:15 <rito12_51026> no it should work
21:23:40 <peter1138> So my thought is: can we not keep it as the existing dropdown, but "just" add the sorting/filtering to the dropdown? Instead of a whole new window.
21:24:49 <andythenorth> without sticky menus, it's quite hard to scroll and keep the list open
21:24:55 <andythenorth> and selecting filters will be impossible
21:25:11 <peter1138> Sticky menus are the new default.
21:25:24 <andythenorth> shall we get rid of the old behaviour
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21:25:31 <brickblock19280> they also need some work imo as they are slower to use
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21:25:58 <andythenorth> dunno, the bridge UI has a precedent for just closing after selecting
21:25:58 <brickblock19280> if I click on the meny it won't chose ROAD despite it being the only avaliable option
21:26:40 <brickblock19280> bridge ux is nice since ctrl clicking skips the menu entierly
21:26:58 <michi_cc> It's not something we currently have, but a two-tiered menu could also been an idea. Define a badge namespace and then make sub-menus for each badge. Works until NewGRF authors start giving each railtype a separate category badge, because "special".
21:27:45 <andythenorth> I wonder how players use this
21:27:52 <andythenorth> I don't switch railtype very often
21:28:03 <peter1138> Yeah, well, the problem is people want different menu behaviours.
21:28:05 <andythenorth> but all these model train roleplay types, probably want to keep the menu open
21:28:31 <andythenorth> in fact, with the menu open, I'm starting to see the appeal of the different ballast, sleepers yada yada
21:28:36 <peter1138> But: making it auto-select an item sometimes, but not all times, is inconsistent and not good UX.
21:29:16 <peter1138> Shall I admit that I'd like to take a look at BGT at some point?
21:29:25 <andythenorth> don't we have some history with this window? and migrating it?
21:29:29 <peter1138> I wonder how much space there is.
21:30:19 <brickblock19280> current ui is nice when switching railtypes since it's fast, it only really runs into issues on trackpads and when the railtype list is larger than the screen
21:30:32 <andythenorth> we had a setting for the new and old vehicle list windows I think
21:30:46 <peter1138> Current UI is terrible for new users who don't know to click and hold.
21:30:59 <peter1138> andythenorth, yes, you can disable groups.
21:31:01 <rito12_51026> do rail types have NewGRFAdditionalText?
21:31:17 <andythenorth> current UI is terrible for badges, filtering, hiding/showing
21:31:26 <peter1138> No, they do not. There's currently no place to show it.
21:31:39 <brickblock19280> peter1138: that's been mostly solved
21:31:57 <brickblock19280> rito12_51026: they have some more strings but I don't think they're of use
21:32:02 <peter1138> Sorry by "current ui" I mean "old behaviour"
21:32:16 <peter1138> brickblock19280, what's been solved?
21:32:24 <brickblock19280> the hold down
21:32:33 <brickblock19280> it's illogical without that though
21:33:05 <andythenorth> also it's worth testing this PR with JP+ tracks
21:33:10 <brickblock19280> BGT is better than filtering imo even if both are neccesary
21:33:12 <andythenorth> it's not wildly better
21:33:24 <peter1138> As it stands, apart from filtering, this new window doesn't really feel like an improvement to me.
21:33:43 <andythenorth> I think it's much better for about 7-15 railtypes
21:33:48 <andythenorth> and quick switching between them
21:33:51 <rito12_51026> andythenorth: they have badges?
21:34:01 <andythenorth> but there's 63 railtypes
21:34:33 <peter1138> There's 20 narrow-gauge types.
21:35:00 <andythenorth> not sure if it's fair to expect this UI to make that easier
21:35:07 <andythenorth> I am still very confused
21:35:44 <andythenorth> "this is fine though"
21:36:17 <andythenorth> you removed Variants?
21:36:25 <peter1138> I have a patch for that, yes.
21:37:09 <rito12_51026> people like variants
21:37:26 <andythenorth> Horse compile would be so much faster without them 😛
21:37:46 <brickblock19280> I honestly still prefer subtypes even if they are cursed
21:38:01 <rito12_51026> what would you have used instead of them?
21:38:04 <andythenorth> I mean someone has to be wrong
21:38:11 <andythenorth> otherwise nobody else could be right
21:39:27 <peter1138> The execution of variants has made ended up turning it into a message. My "horizontal variants" patch is nicer but doesn't allow for nested variants.
21:40:18 <andythenorth> oof I recompiled master
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21:40:31 <fairyflossy> peter1138: What would happen to current nested variants?
21:40:43 <fairyflossy> That would be problematic
21:41:06 <fairyflossy> I use nested variants for "Same engine, different appearance, different livery"
21:41:24 <fairyflossy> I don't know how else to do them besides nesting or having the same engine show up on its own multiple times
21:41:42 <rito12_51026> andythenorth: Sorting for speed is bad as infinite is treated as 0
21:42:16 <brickblock19280> that could be solved
21:42:22 <fairyflossy> Like a steam locomotive with and without streamlining, available in different colors. How would I do that without nesting beyond having the regular and streamline options appear below eachother to clutter the purchase list
21:42:59 <fairyflossy> This is for purchasing them
21:43:25 <andythenorth> other grfs have implemented it
21:43:29 <andythenorth> variants & subtypes
21:44:31 <brickblock19280> it's the ideal way imo if only the ui was nicer and more badge like instead of arbitrary order
21:44:32 <andythenorth> ok we've stuck to the topic well
21:44:32 <fairyflossy> I currently have it as like
21:44:33 <fairyflossy> - Non Streamlined
21:44:37 <fairyflossy> I'd like to keep this in the buy menu because it makes sense and doesn't clutter the purchase list as much
21:44:56 <andythenorth> railtype subtypes?
21:45:12 <andythenorth> you only get one type, then you select it on the map and change the subtype?
21:45:14 <brickblock19280> ie it needs complete overhaul but that would imo be best
21:45:23 <brickblock19280> sounds like BGT to me
21:45:29 <andythenorth> and there are no railtype labels, just arbitrary subtype strings
21:47:03 <andythenorth> hmmm tree menu is unobtrusive
21:48:54 <reldred> Tree menu is also hiding half the trees it will construct
21:49:16 <reldred> Well, a third/quarter roughly
21:51:26 <andythenorth> randomised railtypes then?
21:52:10 <rito12_51026> One build toolbar
21:52:24 <mmtunligit> reldred: this has made me annoyed many times
21:54:57 <andythenorth> oof must be naptime
21:55:49 <brickblock19280> large and small variant
21:58:38 <brickblock19280> the ui in the PR is clearly advanced and not necessary for play with just a few railtypes
21:59:15 <rito12_51026> what do you mean by "but ground types"
21:59:21 <brickblock19280> BGT could also be placed on the side as in the onject and staiton uis
22:00:15 <brickblock19280> instead of tracks and roads having chips and isr variants the ground itself would be a grf feature so that it is independently switchable
22:01:00 <peter1138> Okay but how many "BGT" are we talking?
22:02:58 <brickblock19280> 10 maybe but honestly I would prefer it to the side when the window is wide (or always). realistically we'd probably have like 32
22:03:26 <brickblock19280> also worth considering if they should be tied to railtypes or not
22:03:48 <brickblock19280> but that's not relevant to the ui discussion really
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22:04:19 <brickblock19280> I would like to se bgt happen but I presume there are map issues
22:07:16 <brickblock19280> that is a bit NRT heavy which I don't think is really necessary
22:08:20 <peter1138> Rail has plenty of bits free, road not so much.
22:08:21 <brickblock19280> It also means unrelated things like speed limits get tied to the ground graphics which I don't like but given its a 10? year old proposal I doub't it's going anywhere
22:08:46 <andythenorth> I would expect about 65k BGT
22:08:57 <peter1138> andythenorth, exactly.
22:09:20 <andythenorth> reality is that authors will generate about 8000 I think
22:09:22 <brickblock19280> peter1138: I'd consider it relevant even on industries and especially objects
22:09:34 <andythenorth> is there a power of 2 at 16k? 😛
22:09:37 <andythenorth> I can't remember
22:09:44 <peter1138> Industries are their own complete thing.
22:09:50 <brickblock19280> I don't believe there will be more than are in the all list of objects
22:10:05 <brickblock19280> fair I am not sure what to think about industries either
22:10:34 <andythenorth> depends if we think BGT supplies the base terrain or not
22:10:38 <peter1138> Afaik industries was never in-scope of BGT, so...
22:10:42 <andythenorth> iirc FIRS overlays a 'ground' sprite
22:10:48 <andythenorth> I'd have to check though
22:11:32 <andythenorth> industries would only work if BGT was some tile painting tool for base terrain
22:11:40 <brickblock19280> peter1138: they were in my head
22:11:58 <peter1138> Does BGT need to set speed limits?
22:12:10 <brickblock19280> andythenorth: this is how I think about BGT in my head
22:12:12 <peter1138> That's a rail/road type property.
22:12:20 <andythenorth> err....no it really does not need to set speed limits 🙂
22:12:42 <brickblock19280> peter1138: No I don't think it should be it's there since it "should" be the same for road and tram and therefore BGT
22:13:16 <andythenorth> "no" was the important bit 🙂
22:13:56 <andythenorth> what are the painting tools in scenario editor?
22:14:01 <andythenorth> there's a rock painter and things
22:15:33 <andythenorth> the variable brush size doesn't work for painting rocks or desert but eh
22:16:31 <andythenorth> * paint arbitrary terrain
22:16:31 <andythenorth> * place objects, rails, etc with an arbitrary terrain brush also selected
22:17:09 <andythenorth> pff if we wanted to waste a lot of CPU, we could have grf BGT that can check neighouring tiles
22:17:12 <andythenorth> including the badges 😛
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22:27:33 <xarick> My TryBuildLake is bugged 🙁
22:31:10 <xarick> it found other rivers/lakes
22:31:20 <xarick> that's a conflict I didn't solve
22:53:56 <xarick> there can be disconnected lakes apparently
22:54:10 <xarick> the more I dig this...
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continue to next day ⏵
