IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2025-05-17
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04:44:39 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
06:52:06 <andythenorth> I'm in bed, how do I get coffee?
06:55:07 <andythenorth> I'd have to answer the door
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06:59:39 <kuhnovic> I was in a hotel once that had a nespresso machine right next to the bed. It was great.
07:16:17 <peter1138[d]> Hmm, am I cycling?
07:17:28 <andythenorth> I got up and made coffee
07:18:01 <andythenorth> better than discording, probably
07:19:36 <peter1138[d]> But what I *want* to sit here doing nothing all day?
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08:21:00 <foodliker> just get one of these
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09:08:34 <xarick> hi, I just woke up and was greeted with
10:25:32 <xarick> where can a divide by 0 can occur in this screenshot?
10:25:54 <xarick> this is the crash20250517090112.png
10:53:58 <_glx_> And the trace just shows an infinite loop
10:55:37 <_glx_> You should be able to debug your own builds
11:00:54 <xarick> system woke up from hibernation and openttd crashed
11:01:23 <xarick> not the first time it occurs, but one day I will find out the cause
11:14:50 <andythenorth> where do bananas removal request PRs go?
11:19:53 <andythenorth> it doesn't violate ToS, but it's useless, causes confusion, and is primarily the work of someone who has been banned from parts of the community
11:20:14 <kuhnovic> Is it _that_ person?
11:20:54 <andythenorth> so presumably it's somehow empty
11:21:43 <reldred> *that* person has a tonne of garbage broken grf’s on bananas all pointing their website link to a reddit thread under a deleted/banned account.
11:21:58 <andythenorth> "tonne" would be a countable number
11:22:50 <reldred> Given they’ve been banned from just about every OpenTTD community for their behaviour, and the grf’s are all pretty much broken, they should at least be hidden from public listing
11:23:03 <LordAro> andythenorth: an email to abuse@ would seem appropriate
11:23:27 <andythenorth> can do, it doesn't violate ToS though
11:23:39 <andythenorth> it's just bad community practice
11:23:51 <andythenorth> we're into "are we curating or not?"
11:24:15 <kuhnovic> Is there any way to label broken grfs as archived or hidden or something. That could be helpful in general. And then don't show them in the online content list, at least not by default.
11:24:31 <LordAro> kuhnovic: "savegame only"
11:24:59 <kuhnovic> That would be curating, but only at a functional level. We wouldn't be throwing anything away.
11:25:25 <LordAro> we almost never actually delete anything
11:25:40 <LordAro> because that would break existing saves, etc
11:26:13 <LordAro> if it actually is 0B, then it should be removed anyway
11:26:25 <LordAro> (and the bug that allowed that to be uploaded fixed)
11:26:30 <kuhnovic> Makes sense. But some mechanism to keep things available but hidden could help keep things clean(er)
11:27:14 <kuhnovic> You got the special Xarick edition
11:27:48 <andythenorth> so what's broken there?
11:27:56 <andythenorth> is it the client?
11:28:06 <xarick> Download size: 11.2 KiB
11:28:29 <andythenorth> I never use Bananas
11:28:33 <andythenorth> what am I supposed to do?
11:28:36 <xarick> Total download size: 0 B because you haven't selected it
11:29:05 <andythenorth> yeah I never use this
11:29:22 <andythenorth> all grfs are local, or when I join a server, they magically get added
11:30:28 <xarick> Total download size could be a separate widget
11:31:09 <andythenorth> I can see how selecting everything with one click per content
11:31:13 <andythenorth> and then clicking download
11:31:16 <andythenorth> is fewer clicks overall
11:31:26 <andythenorth> compared to having 'download' on each piece of content
11:31:30 <andythenorth> because 100 < 99
11:32:12 <_jgr_> The actual size value is towards the end of text, it's not the "total download size" line at the bottom
11:32:44 <andythenorth> I value knowing that all 3 of the grfs I've selected are 37.8 KiB
11:34:42 <andythenorth> ok so maybe "Iron Horse 2 Addon" isn't broken
11:35:37 <reldred> Most of the other grfs are broken. All the GRC stuff is absolutely rooted
11:35:54 <reldred> the road fixes grf is fucked
11:36:17 <andythenorth> the amount of support requests this stuff generates
11:36:18 <reldred> the only one I know that definitely does what it says on the tin is the OpenGFX Mars late start .grf
11:36:50 <andythenorth> does Iron Horse 2 Addon even have any vehicles in it?
11:37:06 <andythenorth> I still need to answer that dude's question about the grf parameters too
11:37:45 <_jgr_> It has 1, which looks reasonable enough
11:37:57 <_jgr_> If he'd named the GRF something else it probably wouldn't be any issue
11:38:00 <andythenorth> I can't get this to do anything
11:39:22 <andythenorth> does it have sources?
11:39:53 <andythenorth> I hate that this is my obligation just because someone can take the same name on Bananas
11:43:43 <reldred> andythenorth: I mean is it? You can just reply saying 'no some other knobhead made that'
11:44:48 <reldred> like, that is a thing you're allowed to do
11:45:19 <reldred> not saying the situation on bananas doesn't need a little bit of attention with a mop and bucket
11:46:19 <reldred> the mysterious people of the Yellow Username
11:46:37 <reldred> it is not actively curated though
11:46:59 <yiffgirl> andy is a yellow username, it's just hidden behind the blue username
11:48:09 <reldred> livestream participant is some sort of minor openttd royalty however
11:48:34 <yiffgirl> whoops. i saw developer and must have assumed the other one was for newgrf development. how embarrassing!
11:48:42 <brickblock19280> Would it be possible to add an deprecated status to bananas content and have it require a button is pressed for it to show up?
11:49:49 <yiffgirl> very surprised to learn that andy isn't considered a full developer though
11:53:17 <reldred> writing and comitting sea plus plus code is pretty much the requisite for that
11:53:41 <reldred> you don't get it for making newgrfs and being around 5ever 😛
11:55:18 <yiffgirl> i could have sworn i've seen c++ patches get merged in the past
11:58:01 <reldred> not since mid 2023 according to github
11:58:09 <andythenorth> yiffgirl: I relinquished some rights I had
11:58:15 <reldred> but the yellow dudes also do other stuff, infrastructure, prep releases, etc.
11:58:50 <reldred> oh no, andy the north, fallen from grace, lost the mandate of heaven
11:58:53 <andythenorth> I have too much spiky mental profile to have github rights
11:59:00 <andythenorth> poor choices get made
11:59:37 <reldred> having responsibility is bad and yucky
11:59:50 <reldred> I have too much of that IRL
11:59:54 <talltyler> There’s no automatic qualification, it’s mostly “we’re merging a lot of your stuff, would you like to push the button yourself and save us the trouble” 🙂
12:00:37 <andythenorth> reldred: yair, I have a high compliance, high profile, work environment, it's hard to regulate my behaviour appropriately when it's just drama over pixel trains
12:00:58 <andythenorth> appropriate behaviour is a limited resource
12:01:09 <reldred> andythenorth: god if I get this new job I'm interviewing for next week I'm going to be in the same boat
12:01:19 <reldred> I will have no choice but to get more unhinged online
12:01:21 <talltyler> Zephyris is the latest yellow name as our baseset wizard, which is not C++ but much more important than anything I do 😛
12:01:39 <andythenorth> speaking of high compliance high profile, here's peter1138[d] 😛
12:01:55 <talltyler> reldred: Can’t wait 😄
12:02:18 <reldred> talltyler: at least I've mostly stopped picking fights with people
12:02:19 <foodliker> reldred: the reason i'm so chilled out is because i have no responsibility, most people at even work don't know who i am and if i mess anything up by accident or inattention it can easily be fixed
12:02:29 <foodliker> there is something to be said for a true bullshit job
12:03:20 <talltyler> reldred: I am not criticizing, I enjoy your posts around here, often entertaining 🙂
12:03:38 <talltyler> Wrong thread but I am very excited to see what you do with your house set someday
12:04:02 <reldred> need badge detection in houses
12:04:13 <reldred> which means I need to actually test that PR of peters
12:04:27 <talltyler> I stepped back from helping moderate this Discord as it was wearing me out, luckily GitHub has less silliness 🙂
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12:21:26 <truebrain> andythenorth: As it has been for the, owh, I dunno, last 18 years or so, that value shows how much bytes you will download when pressing download. It does -not- show the size of a content you just clicked on. You need to select it for download first.
12:21:26 <truebrain> I am not saying it is a good interface, just saying it has been like that for a very very long time 😛
12:21:51 <truebrain> LordAro: It isn't 0B. You cannot upload empty content. This is a PEBKAC issue, not a BaNaNaS 😉
12:22:32 <truebrain> and spreading lies because of it! 😛 😛
12:23:07 <truebrain> I think mostly that text is just in a weird place on the UI, making it seem like it is the size of the item you clicked
12:23:13 <andythenorth> “Alternative Facts”
12:24:05 <truebrain> If it wouldn't be in the "CONTENT INFO" panel, it would be more clear. But the "download size" is mentioned in that panel as well
12:24:29 <truebrain> I guess moving it just above "Close" / "Download" button, outside ot eh "CONTENT INTO" panel, would already help out
12:24:33 <truebrain> but okay .. still PEBKAC 😛
12:26:04 <truebrain> for your viewing pleasure 🙂
12:41:43 <peter1138[d]> I was fiddling with that UI the other week and wondered about moving that out.
12:42:06 <peter1138[d]> And the info buttons should be moved in, but that gets inconsistent with those buttons elsewhere.
12:42:23 <peter1138[d]> Is it beer o'clock?
12:42:38 <_zephyris> The yard arm says yea
12:42:39 <reldred> it's after five oclock somewhere
12:43:52 <_zephyris> I think it might be gin o'clock, got to be primed for eurovision.
12:53:34 <andythenorth> peter1138[d]: I am supervising a chlidren’s party, so no
12:54:19 <peter1138[d]> I could go out on a bike ride
13:03:26 <xarick> should I hibernate and resume to try catch a bug?
13:04:03 <xarick> what if it requires ~12 hours of hibernation
13:10:32 <_glx_> or attach the debugger when it crashed
13:11:16 <xarick> I made changes to the branch
13:12:25 <_glx_> impossible to debug if you made changes
13:12:42 <xarick> changed the 12 hash bits to 11
13:13:06 <_glx_> even just rebuilding from the same source will prevent debugging
13:13:39 <_glx_> unless exe and pdb are stored outside build dir
13:14:46 <xarick> how do I generate the pdb
13:20:30 <LordAro> truebrain: i said 'if' !
13:21:17 <truebrain> And I answered your "if"! 😛
13:36:46 <peter1138[d]> I was trying to garden but it's hot and I got a headache 😒
13:41:10 <xarick> just hibernated 6 times
13:44:30 <xarick> my suspicion is overflow, underflow due to a sudden 12 hours sleep
13:45:22 <xarick> something is dividing by 0, i suspect in framerate, but i could be wrong, could be somewhere else entirely
13:47:27 <xarick> how much time is 12 hours in milliseconds as an average of 512 measure points
13:51:59 <xarick> 82,432 means... it was slightly less than 12 hours
14:07:55 <xarick> I'm looking at the dump file in notepad++
14:08:05 <xarick> that looks like a string
14:17:19 <_glx_> peter1138[d]: nah it's windy and the wind is cold
14:30:58 <xarick> `Scinterlate` this is sometimes doing math on int64_t - int
14:49:13 <_glx_> trying to guess is just wasting time
14:55:34 <xarick> diff can be negative...
14:57:41 <jfkuayue> So... Andy had a misunderstanding typical for redditors?
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15:37:27 <andythenorth> redditors are people too
15:43:13 <xarick> is it even possible for src_max - src_min = 0
15:43:25 <xarick> that's where a division by 0 can occur
15:43:53 <xarick> need to understand the code
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15:47:55 <alpapilus> andythenorth: Never seen one while walking outside, I cannot prove or disprove this statement.
16:12:11 <foodliker> andythenorth: never been more wrong
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16:13:30 <notluke2578> andythenorth: first ive heard of this
16:14:39 <xarick> is this a valid warning?
16:32:11 <_glx_> warning is correct but it's generic and depends on real numbers
16:35:58 <_glx_> what it's saying is `this->horizontal_scale + 2` (an int) may overflow before being converted to uint64_t for next step
16:36:47 <xarick> I was considering changing horizontal_scale and vertical_scale to int64_t
16:37:06 <xarick> but without a crash, im unsure
16:37:43 <_glx_> I'm quite sure xxx_scale will never reach 32bit limit
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16:38:12 <xarick> `GetString(STR_FRAMERATE_GRAPH_MILLISECONDS, this->vertical_scale * division / 10 * 1000 / TIMESTAMP_PRECISION),` this one is very very close
16:38:54 <xarick> 999999 * 10 / 10 * 1000 / 1000000
16:39:34 <_glx_> but it's already converted to uint64_t because TIMESTAMP_PRECISION
16:40:23 <xarick> i get a sub-expression may overflow etc... warning
16:43:02 <peter1138[d]> it might be second beer o'clock.
16:44:46 <truebrain> You know what, if you finished that: take a third
16:45:16 <peter1138[d]> Basically, partner is away, and is back tomorrow.
16:45:23 <peter1138[d]> But tomorrow is... BUS REPLACEMENT SERVICE.
16:45:29 <peter1138[d]> So I may well need to drive.
16:45:57 <truebrain> So you have to drink tonight, as tomorrow you can't? 😛
16:56:29 <xarick> I suspect something here
16:57:10 <xarick> durations[point] of 12 hours in milliseconds
16:57:37 <xarick> Scinterlate does math, but Point.y is forced int
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17:14:27 <_glx_> and? the value will be betweed y_zero and y_max anyway
17:18:07 <xarick> does GetString {COMMA} take uint64_t ?
17:19:53 <_glx_> all string parameters are 64bit
17:20:08 <andythenorth> it name squats actual Iron Horse
17:29:12 <xarick> or TimingMeasurement instead of uint64_t
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18:37:23 <xarick> i found 2 instances of Ludi in that video
18:37:53 <xarick> but openttd 13 hmm maybe version 20?
18:38:35 <xarick> easy/medium/hard profiles and random still existed
18:40:20 <xarick> yeah, version 20, for openttd 13
18:41:30 <xarick> if master hellish used defaults, then I was competing as a benevolent easy going ai 😐
18:43:08 <xarick> probably wouldn't make it to the top anyway
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20:09:11 <xarick> not sure what's wrong here
20:45:23 <_glx_> ok I modified regression test and it confirms the failure
20:58:06 <_glx_> but I now have a way to easily debug and test
21:06:52 <_glx_> oh I see what happens, squirrel only receives "plain" ScriptEvent objects without all the inheritance info
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21:28:38 <xarick> can't seem to get bribe going on
21:28:52 <xarick> trying to make exclusive transport right wars
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21:57:54 <peter1138[d]> Hmm, EncodedString decoding is still broken 😦
21:58:09 <peter1138[d]> When decoding`GetEncodedString(part2, std::monostate{}, engine)`, engine is put at parameter 0, not parameter 1.
22:03:38 <_glx_> hmm I though an empty param was pushed in this case
22:04:08 <peter1138[d]> I think strings.cpp:1007 needs to be `PeekUtf8If`, not `ReadUtf8If`
22:04:38 <peter1138[d]> And then if the next character is another separator, that is skipped.
22:05:35 <_glx_> ha looks like the empty param at the end issue
22:05:55 <peter1138[d]> Yeah, we fixed that, but moved it to the empty parameter at beginning instead.
22:11:17 <_glx_> yup Peek makes more sense
22:12:01 <_glx_> since we skip separator anyway in the while
22:12:40 <peter1138[d]> Hmm, can unit tests use language strings?
22:13:08 <peter1138[d]> I think none of that stuff is loaded, and loading it is probably quite a bit of effort.
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22:16:55 <goddess_ishtar> hrm, if we're messing with the main menu UI I might dig up my old plans for fixing the NewGRF menu
22:17:17 <goddess_ishtar> I think Online Content especially needs some extra attention
22:18:55 <_glx_> hmm ScriptEvent issue will be painful to fix
22:21:03 <_glx_> the easiest way is to change the 2 affected `Convert()`
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23:11:09 <talltyler> goddess_ishtar: Agreed! Would love to see your ideas. 🙂
23:18:10 <goddess_ishtar> for now I'm just fixing something very minor (the sort function for the online content window uses the same order as the enum used for holding the selection state, which is exceptionally annoying because it puts selected content *between* already here and unselected content)
23:18:25 <goddess_ishtar> just to familiarise myself with the code around there
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23:41:17 <_glx_> so actually it was "wrong" from the beginning, but hidden until proper validation was added
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23:43:38 <_glx_> "wrong" but safe to use
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