IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2024-09-18
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03:30:08 <wensimehrp> This is so annoying
03:30:08 <wensimehrp> The font works on Windows but somehow it does not work on Linux
04:45:29 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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05:47:57 <soylent_cow[m]> Looks like this city slowed down around 150K
05:48:04 <soylent_cow[m]> wonder if they grow even bigger.....
06:40:48 <soylent_cow[m]> lol what's the gray stuff
06:47:33 <truebrain> Owh, another bug in eints? I (and frosch) really should finish "nile" .. but free time hasn't been my friend
06:53:39 <LordAro> just quit your job again
07:00:42 <truebrain> Will you pay the gap? 😄
07:01:35 <LordAro> depends, have you burnt through all of OTTD's money yet?
07:02:31 <kuhnovic> Be generous with your hourly rate TB :p
07:03:13 <truebrain> even if I would go to a "I can barely survive" amount, money would run out in days 😛
07:03:21 <truebrain> (OpenTTD's money, that is 😛 )
07:03:29 <truebrain> but ofc, I cannot do away with my butler
07:04:07 <LordAro> the barest of essentials
07:18:00 <_glx_> Well the string looks fine, but this huge `{P}` should have been split in 3
07:19:11 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
07:39:58 <kuhnovic> Guess we need a buy-TB-a-coffee-button
07:40:42 <peter1138> We need to buy him a lot of coffees...
07:52:19 <truebrain> kuhnovic: You are aware a lot of things in life can't be bought with coffee, right? 😄
07:52:40 <kuhnovic> I also know that coffee goes a long way 😛
07:52:53 <kuhnovic> But ok I guess you have a point
08:08:32 <truebrain> just imagine me going to my bank, giving them coffee, and say: this will do for the payments of this month, right? 😄
08:25:09 <LordAro> depends on the coffee i imagine
08:25:29 <LordAro> i think there's a bank somewhere that takes deposits in the form of wheels of cheese
08:33:55 <mnhebi> I dunno, if the coffee prices keep climbing I imagine some banks might start accepting packages of coffee as payment lol.
08:34:24 <mnhebi> Good thing I managed to quit drinking that stuff after over 30 years..
08:51:01 <xarick> I'm attempting something...
08:51:18 <xarick> virtual machine with linux mint 22
08:51:29 <_pruple> takes all sorts, I suppose
09:00:36 <xarick> why is it always asking for a password, this is annoyin
09:34:20 <xarick> asking for permissions
09:34:50 <xarick> i want it to just don't ask, just do it
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09:36:58 <reldred> windows does by default, that's what uac is
09:38:53 <xarick> hmm, i was forced to enter a password during mint install
09:39:22 <xarick> on windows, when i switch to a local account, i can leave the password field empty
09:43:58 <peter1138> Surely you only need a password when you login.
09:44:07 <peter1138> Then once you've logged in... you're logged in.
09:45:50 <xarick> no, when i turn on the computer, it goes straight to desktop
09:48:54 <reldred> But you will still need password to get elevated rights with sudo
09:49:27 <reldred> but to be fair if you're gonna be in the thick of it you just open a terminal, type sudo su, and just keep rocking out til you close the terminal.
09:50:31 <xarick> looks like my VM is stuck
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10:36:23 <xarick> ext4 or fat32 for a virtual disk inside a virtual disk?
10:45:21 <xarick> this part of the installation
10:46:03 <xarick> forces me to put a password, if i leave those fields empty it won't install
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10:46:12 <ahyangyi> ext4 unless you also plan to use that disk with Windows
10:53:55 <merni> xarick: You should be able to remove it afterwards (if not via gui at least via terminal)
10:55:56 <peter1138> Having login passwords is normal...
10:58:14 <xarick> typical linux experience
11:02:42 <peter1138> Typical Xarick experience, perhaps.
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12:22:58 <truebrain> lol, GitHub is weird .. it now says a pull request is "closed" instead of "merged" when it is merged
12:23:02 <truebrain> that threw me off for a bit
12:23:11 <truebrain> (was looking over one of the merged PRs from last night)
12:47:20 <xarick> openttd is faster on linux mint inside hyper-x
12:51:41 <xarick> stuff that makes no sense
13:04:05 <xarick> river generation is much faster on mint
13:04:22 <xarick> i can tell with a naked eye
13:04:50 <xarick> the other generation steps are harder to see
13:07:24 <xarick> 14.1 vs 14.1, both downloaded from openttd.org
13:07:38 <xarick> one for windows, other for linux
13:09:38 <xarick> openttd-14.1-linux-generic-amd64
13:19:51 <xarick> there is no installer?
13:22:07 <xarick> program manager doesn't have the most recent version
13:23:26 <ahyangyi> xarick: Perhaps compiler differences? Considering that the river generation code doesn't depend on many libraries...
13:24:18 <xarick> i thought virtual machines would always be slower than the host
13:24:58 <ahyangyi> Virtual machine's overhead is small for CPU-intensive computing code
13:29:31 <xarick> what is flatpak flathub
13:48:48 <peter1138> Download the generic linux binary as you have. Unpack it. Run it.
13:48:54 <peter1138> There is no need to install it.
13:59:18 <talltyler> More illegal characters in Greek, now? CI on merged commits is failing since today’s eints push.
13:59:44 <peter1138> Illegal command this time.
14:04:26 <talltyler> Which one? Is there a limit to how many plurals you can have after a `{NUM}`?
14:04:44 <peter1138> "The one it says" 😉 I don't remember.
14:05:55 <talltyler> I guess four plurals isn’t allowed
14:06:17 <talltyler> Or does it have to match English? (Which has three)
14:26:01 <_glx_> it's `{P "στην προβλεπόμενη τοποθεσία" "στις προβλεπόμενες τοποθεσίες"}` I think
14:26:28 <_glx_> it should use 3 `{P}` instead
14:33:05 <peter1138> static const ptrdiff_t MAX_COMMAND_PARAM_SIZE = 100; ///< Maximum size of every command block, not counting the name of the command itself
14:33:17 <peter1138> Hard limit or random "probably enough" limit?
14:34:05 <peter1138> It's used in some fix-sized buffers, so... may just be some old-school string limit for no good reason.
14:34:41 <truebrain> explains why eints doesn't know about it 🙂
14:43:03 <peter1138> I'll try patching it to use std::string.
14:52:00 <truebrain> peter to the rescue! 🙂
14:54:24 <peter1138> Jack of all trades, master of none...
14:55:50 <_glx_> wow this string is actually hyper complex to translate
14:56:50 <_glx_> `STR_TOWN_DATA_ERROR_FAILED_TO_FOUND_TOWN :{WHITE}Pas d'emplacement valide trouvé pour fonder {NUM} ville{P "" s}. À la place, {P un des} panneau{P "" x} {P a ont} été créé {P "à l'" aux} emplacement{P "" s} prévu{P "" s}` so many {P}
15:04:21 <truebrain> you get a P, and you get a P
15:04:29 <truebrain> maybe we should make it an easier English string? 😄
15:04:51 <truebrain> "Shit failed with town data; go figure it out yourself"
15:05:03 <_glx_> {WHITE}Could not find valid location to found {NUM} town{P "" s}. Created {P "a " ""}sign{P "" s} at the intended location{P "" s} instead
15:05:13 <_glx_> it's "simpler" in english
15:05:38 <truebrain> `{WHITE}Could not find valid location to found {NUM} town{P "" s}. Created signs instead`
15:05:43 <truebrain> would be more than enough, I would guess?
15:06:05 <peter1138> Oh my unit test breaks release builds too :S
15:06:06 <talltyler> That is probably the most common error, as even if your data is correct if your heightmap is too hilly, etc., some towns will fail
15:06:53 <truebrain> on the other hand, I am sure this is the first time most translators from Germanic origin learn that you can do this plural stuff 😛
15:12:13 <peter1138> Okay, missing stdafx.h, oops.
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16:11:00 <wensimehrp> _glx_: `{WHITE}无法为 {NUM} 座城镇找到合适的生成位置；已在这些城镇的原定位置放置标志`
16:15:35 <peter1138> Because that definitely needs a video.
16:16:36 <peter1138> As a Gnome user, I would just tick that Automatic Login if I actually wanted to allow it.
16:21:39 <xarick> hmm 2nd part of video, i dont have some folder
16:27:24 <_glx_> on normal use it should ask password only on logon, and of course when you are doing admin things
16:28:09 <_glx_> as it makes sure you're supposed to know what you are doing
16:28:17 <xarick> wow, vm text editor is garbage...
16:33:43 <xarick> he doesn't explain how to save the file...
16:34:54 <_glx_> there are many text editors
16:35:00 <xarick> i press the arrow keys and it types A BCD...
16:35:30 <peter1138> It's normal to login.
16:36:09 <xarick> absolutely garbage text editor, how can you linux guys live with this
16:36:10 <_glx_> some editors are hard to use, some are more user friendly
16:38:40 <Heiki> I had to proofread “{WHITE}{NUM} kunnan perustamiseksi ei löytynyt kelvollis{P ta ia} paikk{P a oj}a. Aiottu{P u ihi}n paikk{P aa oihi}n sijoitettiin sen sijaan kylt{P ti it}” many many times before submitting
16:44:14 <LordAro> this is where we learn that xarick believes notepad is "the windows text editor"
16:44:21 <LordAro> which would explain much
16:44:59 <LordAro> but yes, vi/vim/neovim very much is not a "point and click" text editor
16:45:09 <LordAro> it is decidedly not garbage though
16:45:16 <ahyangyi> xarick: You probably want to use gedit instead of vi/vim.
16:45:29 <LordAro> (well, depending on how you feel about emacs)
16:46:05 <ahyangyi> Or install modern stuff like VS Code/Sublime/Atom, they are all cross-platform
16:51:29 <LordAro> there will be some form of "package manager" app available
16:51:50 <LordAro> that's how you install things on linux, rather than randomly downloading things from the internet
16:52:13 <LordAro> though i'm surprised if it hadn't come with anything preinstalled
16:54:13 <wensimehrp> wensimehrp: Probably the plural property should be changed.
16:54:13 <wensimehrp> Of course Chinese does not have plural, but this case is a bit special. When {NUM} is one, the "些" character in "已在这些城镇" won't quite work. "些" is usually used when the object count is not one. "个" should be used when the count is one, and it should be something like `已在这{P 个 些}城镇`
16:54:13 <wensimehrp> So the best solution is to remove "这些" completely, resulting `{WHITE}无法为 {NUM} 座城镇找到合适的生成位置；已在城镇的原定位置放置标志` It is no longer a problem when it is removed, and the rest still makes sense. 😄
17:11:04 <ahyangyi> Chinese just doesn't have plural nouns, but plural pronouns and determiners do exist... Anyway, is it too late to change the "plural type" for a language in OpenTTD?
17:33:31 <xarick> I have no idea what I'm doing atm...
17:37:52 <ahyangyi> Hmm, you are looking at a shell script... that seems to be a cmake installer
17:38:51 <ahyangyi> but you probably don't need it -- find your package manager and install cmake from it should be good enough
17:54:28 <xarick> trying to build openttd, i fail of course
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18:00:48 <LordAro> oh wait, you've done precisely what we told you not to
18:00:59 <LordAro> remove everything you've just installed
18:01:06 <LordAro> install things through the package manager only
18:01:12 <LordAro> (unless you really really know what you're doing)
18:02:55 <xarick> i know nothing, and it's dinner time, brb
18:04:30 <LordAro> well you've not Linus'd it yet
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18:18:07 <LordAro> uninstalled the base system
18:25:39 <ahyangyi> LordAro: Google points to Green Hills Software
18:25:50 <ahyangyi> But... that's an embedded toolchain vendor?
18:26:00 <LordAro> why it's looking for that by default i've no idea
18:26:39 <ahyangyi> I wonder if Xarick ran some GHS-powered cmake installation script
18:26:50 <ahyangyi> instead of installing it from the package manager
18:27:01 <LordAro> i'm not going to spend any time trying to work it out
18:27:28 <ahyangyi> installing everything from a clean start is simpler, right?
18:35:54 <xarick> how do i run a .sh file, and why is it so difficult 🙂
18:36:09 <peter1138> You shouldn't need to do so.
18:37:01 <xarick> i attempted to install cmake
18:37:32 <LordAro> you definitely have a GUI package manager installed
18:37:42 <ahyangyi> it's "Synaptic Package Manager"
18:37:45 <peter1138> `sudo apt install git build-essential cmake pkg-config zlib1g-dev liblzma-dev liblzo2-dev`
18:38:00 <LordAro> see, now they'll just run that without learning anything
18:38:32 <truebrain> this is also hardly the channel to learn a new OS
18:38:35 <peter1138> Xarick, your system uses a package manager called "apt"
18:38:44 <truebrain> find a good Youtube movie and watch that or what-ever
18:38:55 <peter1138> You must install most things using this package manager (or a front-end for it)
18:39:00 <ahyangyi> truebrain: Well, it's clear that they are trying to set up an environment to build OpenTTD 😛
18:39:49 <truebrain> ahyangyi: Even if that would be the case, I would first do my own research. Plenty of YouTube tells you how to get to the cmake step tbh
18:40:09 <peter1138> "How to install software on Mint"
18:41:51 <ahyangyi> I guess they probably tried something like "How to install cmake on Linux", which is why they ended up with the ghs installer
18:42:07 <ahyangyi> turns out the distro is a very important part of the recipe
18:42:51 <truebrain> You have a lot of faith 🙂
18:45:24 <talltyler> Someone smarter than me will have to review #12950 😉
18:52:55 <michi_cc[d]> Shall I pretend to be smart? 🙂
18:53:53 <michi_cc[d]> Let's cheat a bit to avoid checking it out 🙂
18:59:11 <peter1138> Find out how to install sdl2 development library on mint.
18:59:28 <xarick> it's looking for breakpad, sdl2, lib stuff 🙂
18:59:39 <peter1138> Breakpad is ignorable
19:01:43 <peter1138> Yes, find out how to install the development dependencies on mint.
19:01:56 <peter1138> Posting screenshots of cmake's output doesn't won't fix it 🙂
19:03:13 <peter1138> A little hint. It will involve the apt package manager again.
19:15:01 <_glx_> xarick: `sudo apt install cmake` should be enough
19:16:04 <_glx_> you'll also need `sudo apt install gcc` and same for all the libs (but the -dev or -devel version)
19:17:33 <_glx_> it's basic knowledge for any debian derivative
19:19:09 <_glx_> and yes you should have a GUI version for the package manager, it's usually easily findable in the menu
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19:27:24 <ahyangyi> `sudo apt install build-essential`
19:41:41 <xarick> it only installs version 3.28.3 with sudo apt install cmake
19:41:49 <xarick> there's already a 3.30.3
19:49:36 <_glx_> you don't need latest cmake for openttd
19:50:40 <_glx_> `cmake_minimum_required(VERSION 3.16)`
19:50:55 <_glx_> so you're fine with 3.20
19:55:08 <peter1138> xarick: you should always stick with the version that is distributed with your package manager unless you have a good reason not to.
19:55:33 <goddess_ishtar> oh are we walking someone through how to build OpenTTD on Mint
19:56:07 <peter1138> No, we are... trying to prevent them from trashing everything by doing completely the wrong things.
20:03:54 <xarick> gcc was already installed
20:14:09 <peter1138> _zephyris: bit of kerning here 🙂
20:37:07 <xarick> it's compiling harfbuzz in a single-thread vm 😦
20:42:50 <talltyler> _jgr_: Thanks for your patience with my reviews. Sometimes I feel like three kids in a trenchcoat reviewing PRs 😅
20:47:30 <xarick> so it build harfbuzz... now what, it still can't find it 😦
20:48:13 <ahyangyi> You can probably `apt install libharfbuzz-dev` to grab a working version of harfbuzz
20:48:23 <ahyangyi> and similarly for all other openttd dependencies
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20:53:20 <xarick> openttd documentation isn't clear enough about the whole name
20:59:33 <_jgr_> talltyler: Not to worry, thank you for doing all this review work. 🙂
21:04:02 <xarick> libcurl-dev doesn't want to install with apt install
21:08:07 <LordAro> apt is a program, it doesn't want to do anything
21:08:18 <LordAro> it gives errors if something has gone wrong
21:09:05 <_zephyris> peter1138: Grr, it's an annoying one... It's a kerning problem, but only because the i circumflex has the incorrect width, because it's composed from the dottless i glyph with an accent, which has locked the width to the width of the dotless i for some reason... But only for a few of the i diacritics. Odd, and annoying to debug.
21:11:23 <peter1138> I'm sorry, I've should've reported it on github instead of pinging you.
21:11:43 <_zephyris> No worries, I'll pop it up as a bug report
21:12:30 <xarick> Could NOT find Doxigen, Curl, Allegro, Fluidsynth, Grfcodec
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21:14:07 <xarick> and unofficial-breakpad
21:19:08 <_glx_> you won't find unofficial-breakpad in apt, it's only in vcpkg
21:19:33 <_glx_> and you don't really need it
21:19:48 <peter1138> You don't need doxygen, allegro and unofficial-breakpad
21:20:00 <peter1138> fluidsynth is not required, only if you want music
21:20:17 <peter1138> grfcodec only if you want to edit the included graphics
21:20:57 <_glx_> if libcurl-dev doesn't exist try libcurl-devel
21:21:27 <peter1138> libcurl is a weird one.
21:21:32 <peter1138> There are different implementations
21:21:50 <peter1138> libcurl4-gnutls-dev, libcurl4-nss-dev or libcurl4-openssl-dev
21:22:19 <peter1138> Though I think installing libcurl4-dev will pick one.
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21:23:21 <xarick> i need to explicitly tell which one
21:23:49 <_glx_> it can't even find "gcc" anywhere
21:24:20 <_glx_> xarick: just go with openssl
21:29:45 <xarick> wow, it's gonna take an eternity
21:29:50 <xarick> but it's compiling something
21:30:08 <_glx_> how many cores do you have ?
21:30:32 <xarick> 1, otherwise it won't boot
21:31:37 <_glx_> since wsl I never used a real VM
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21:44:48 <xarick> next step is maybe a visual studo in linux mint maybe?
21:46:32 <xarick> Visual Studio Code would work?
21:46:50 <peter1138> VS Code will work, yes.
21:47:41 <belajalilija> Is the fact that the engine search feature doesn’t work with variants a known bug?
21:49:56 <peter1138> I would say it isn't a fact.
21:53:04 <belajalilija> @ ed you in the help channel
21:53:46 <peter1138> Don't @ me in other channels. I only watch a few.
21:54:05 <belajalilija> _glx_: It is since fixed?
21:54:17 <xarick> 363 MB for the program quite big
21:54:33 <_glx_> always check nightlies first 🙂
21:55:30 <belajalilija> It just came to my mine right now and I’m not at my desk, I’ll take that as a yes though, thanks, it had been annoying me xd
22:08:31 <peter1138> All those temporal8 "realistic 32bpp" NewGRFs remind me of "realistic" Minecraft resource packs...
22:18:37 <peter1138> No Youtube, of course I'm not interested in random videos of models of train couplers...
22:21:03 <peter1138> (Am I going to watch it...? Probably)
23:18:28 <belajalilija> peter1138: Do you mean like ez stuff? If so i agree
continue to next day ⏵
