IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2023-09-25
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01:05:09 <talltyler> Real-Time Mode just needs one more commit cherry-picked, then it’s time to test! So much work. But first, a three-day business trip… :/
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05:51:04 <truebrain> kamnet: I have errors from BaNaNaS server that one of the uploads went wrong in a weird way .. the 5959 one. I can't really tell what happened yet, and off to work so cannot look at it now. But just so you know .. something is very wrong with that upload. Please don't thinker with it yourself till I had the chance to look at it 🙂
05:52:56 <andythenorth> but there's something in that one
05:53:29 <andythenorth> cargoicons have to be drawn, but they're only used in stations, and not very nicely 🙂
06:00:00 <truebrain> truebrain: A quick look make it seems the upload didn't settle on the backend yet and was already loaded in .. normally not an issue, as there is 10+ seconds between upload and first request .. but as you mutated a lot at once, there was a queue .. so if I would guess, an earlier change caused a reload that picked up 5959 "too soon", which was corrected once the reload request for 5959 came
06:00:00 <truebrain> through .. still want to confirm that tonight 🙂
06:01:15 <truebrain> That is a lot of rambling.. tldr, the upload seems available just fine now, still I want to check out why it triggered backend errors 🙂
06:08:06 <truebrain> Lol, the backend doesn't cancel pending-but-not-executing reloads, so the queue with reloads was reeeeaaallllyyyy long .. guess we can enable that to smoothen out the ride a bit more
06:41:22 <andythenorth> ok trackbits time
06:42:07 <kamnet> truebrain: No worries I'm done for the next 24 hours at least.
06:42:20 <kamnet> Good to know I'm a good problem-causer. 🙂
06:52:57 <peter1138> andythenorth, the text does have a shadow though.
06:53:53 <peter1138> Using a font with single-pixel lines probably doesn't help.
06:54:45 <andythenorth> it does start on the right, so eh
06:55:06 <andythenorth> "just provide better service"? 😛
06:58:17 <peter1138> Maybe change the icon spacing. In the station window it's 10 sprite-scaled pixels. In the grouped vehicle list, it's 6 interface-scaled pixels.
06:58:55 <peter1138> Not sure which is the correct scaling method mind you.
07:26:54 <pickpacket> AAAAAAAHHH!!! I don't want to work today! I just want to play OpenTTD!
07:40:18 <peter1138> 'play' OpenTTD indeed.
07:41:26 <peter1138> Okay, I survived the long ride but slower than I'd like (had to split off from the main group) :/
08:02:52 <andythenorth> can't see station prop 0x15 in the nml docs, might have to read nml src 🙂
08:03:19 <andythenorth> clearly there because the examples are track tiles
08:03:58 <_pruple> "non_traversable_tiles"?
08:10:10 <andythenorth> looks like it's 0xFF in my grf
08:10:16 <andythenorth> presumably that's "all tiles"
08:16:39 <peter1138> Damn, this code still needs to use pointers as the they come from an API :(
08:25:13 <peter1138> Definitely needs a better main loop. usleep(10000) is a bit pants.
08:36:58 <andythenorth> wait what, so a station layout built over multiple tiles can include both traversable and non-traversable tiles?
08:37:14 <andythenorth> I guess that's how those realistic station sets work
08:59:58 <peter1138> And yes, I'd forgotten, both blocked tiles and wire placement flags DO depend on the layout from Prop 0E or CB 24. CB 14 does not influence it.
09:01:01 <peter1138> (You do not want to run NewGRF callbacks in the pathfinder)
09:02:12 <peter1138> Mind you we could probably find space to store that flag in the map instead. Probably JGRPP already does.
09:34:50 <peter1138> Argh, something is interfering with my wireless mouse :(
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12:26:06 <_glx_> trying to find the MSVC equivalent
12:46:58 <_glx_> and it doesn't seem to exist
13:14:37 <andythenorth> should we be storing savegames to the registry?
13:14:50 <andythenorth> we might make Hacker News front page again if we do
13:27:12 <alfagamma7> *Cue the tired MBP trope*
13:36:21 <peter1138> We should store savegames in andy's MBP's registry
14:03:38 <peter1138> I wouldn't've thought of it without your reminder.
14:03:48 <peter1138> And it's only tired when we're tired of it. And we're not.
14:04:29 <alfagamma7> Thank you for the clarification
14:04:50 <peter1138> You will never be free of it :D
14:12:50 <andythenorth> do I have a registry?
14:15:58 <alfagamma7> Depends how you look at it
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17:43:38 <andythenorth> _glx_: we have `hide_wire_tiles` but `draw_pylon_tiles` 🙂
17:43:45 <andythenorth> could we invert one of them?
17:50:32 <peter1138> That's because that's the spec.
17:52:17 <peter1138> The issue with just "inverting" it is what happens to the default value...
17:53:13 <peter1138> And also, inverting one when they already exist in NML is too late.
17:54:45 <andythenorth> nah, there's precedent for change in nml
17:55:11 <andythenorth> we could deprecate `draw_pylon_tiles` and add `hide_pylon_tiles` I think
17:55:29 <peter1138> Is it confusing your brain?
17:55:38 <peter1138> 10+ years of this spec...
17:55:55 <andythenorth> well nml lets us pretend the spec is different
17:56:01 <peter1138> andythenorth comes along and we need to add variants and invert properties and make it be something it's not.
17:56:02 <andythenorth> at least as far as arbitary identifier names go 🙂
18:08:25 <andythenorth> hmm inverting it would be a bit fancy eh 🙂
18:08:44 <andythenorth> have to list all the possible tiles, then net off the tiles given in the property
18:38:56 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
18:39:36 <andythenorth> is it "override"
18:41:54 <peter1138> Don't you mean "conf-igure"?
18:42:36 <andythenorth> wow there really is no em-dash
18:42:40 <andythenorth> /me looked it up
18:42:50 <andythenorth> that's quite a greengrocer's comma thing there
18:43:04 <andythenorth> "why is there no em-dash"
18:43:20 <peter1138> - is not —, anyway.
18:43:34 <andythenorth> I think I might live in a parallel reality sometimes
18:44:13 <andythenorth> seems I also don't know what a hyphen is 😛
18:44:32 <andythenorth> I mean...for context....I wear shoes where the laces don't need tied
18:44:50 <andythenorth> hyp-hen would be a covid chicken
18:44:58 <andythenorth> everyone became an egg farmer
18:45:22 <truebrain> kamnet: indeed the problem with 5959 was a temporary issue; basically, BaNaNaS is not build to handle that many mutations in a short window of time, and this resulted in a temporary weird state. But it recovered directly afterwards, so no harm was done 🙂 So all is good!
18:46:08 <andythenorth> what else is not hyphenated?
18:54:00 <peter1138> Okay, what sets use blocked/pylons/wires comprehensively?
18:54:33 <andythenorth> Is there a DB stations?
18:55:55 <_pruple> "over-ride" sounds like something you'd see in a typewritten manual circa 1943, back when people felt they weren't allowed to make up words.
18:56:13 <_pruple> if it's not in shakespeare or the bible, it gets a hyphen
18:56:29 <andythenorth> /me looking in ISR stations
18:56:55 <_pruple> sorry, "type-written manual"
18:58:35 <_pruple> and it differentiates us from the Jerries, who just mash words together like savages.
18:58:46 <andythenorth> ISR uses the blocked/pylons/wires flags
19:06:20 <peter1138> Hmm, can waypoints be blocked? :D
19:10:07 <peter1138> I'm going to say "yes" because the current code doesn't check if it's a waypoint or not.
19:13:31 <peter1138> Hmm, does this need a savegame bump, or perhaps always refresh the flags on load.
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20:20:56 <michi_cc[d]> andythenorth: mb's newstations I guess. Has quite some intricate layouts (including some slope tricks).
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20:39:50 <andythenorth> hmm FIRS seems to not provide a ground sprite in spritelayout for most industries
20:39:57 <andythenorth> this seems wrong?
20:40:30 <andythenorth> looks like in many cases 'ground' is a childsprite with 'always draw' set
20:44:13 <frosch123> childsprites before the first building sprite are groundsprites as well
20:44:46 <frosch123> didn't you draw default grass/concrete first, and then add an industry-specific overlay?
20:44:59 <frosch123> maybe it changed :p
20:46:15 <andythenorth> can't remember 🙂
20:46:34 <andythenorth> think the lack of explicit ground is an accident with no consequences (hopefully)
20:47:58 <andythenorth> how can I put a spriteset reference into a temp register?
20:49:41 <andythenorth> I thought it would resolve to an action 1 realsprite ID eventually 😛
20:52:05 <andythenorth> ok I just duplicate a lot of spritelayouts 🙂
20:52:10 <andythenorth> for different ground types
20:52:43 <frosch123> you can do the GRM sprite reservation magic :p
20:54:43 <andythenorth> nah I might skip that 🙂
21:02:04 <_glx_> for stations there's the `custom_spriteset` mechanism
21:02:57 <_glx_> I really should improve the example
21:04:47 <andythenorth> _glx_: I am trying to vary only the ground sprite currently, unclear if custom_spriteset helps there?
21:06:08 <andythenorth> hmm for non-track tiles, I'm duplicating the spriteset so both orientations can index into it
21:06:11 <andythenorth> that might be wrong
21:07:21 <peter1138> Well, fonts and eyes eh?
21:07:45 <andythenorth> _glx_: looks like custom_spriteset should be what I need
21:08:44 <_glx_> the only limit is 6 different spritesets in total for all spritelayouts of a station
21:09:09 <andythenorth> so if the spritelayout is shared between many stations, but each station sets a custom spriteset....that will work ok?
21:10:27 <_glx_> the chips example even defines spritelayout for fisrt station, then other just copy it
21:12:12 <_glx_> nml does magic with var10 (that was a pain to handle in NFO)
21:17:41 <andythenorth> need to figure out track vs non track next
21:18:30 <_glx_> this one is in one block ?
21:19:14 <andythenorth> this is a single spritelayout per orientation
21:19:37 <andythenorth> I can probably make the custom spriteset switch check rail continuation?
21:19:59 <_glx_> oh yeah I forgot the "infinite" number of spritesets using a switch
21:20:24 <andythenorth> hmm I don't have my sprites set up for platforms
21:20:55 <andythenorth> this nearly all works for rail stations
21:21:13 <andythenorth> road stops next, see how much I need to split spritelayouts
21:34:03 <andythenorth> is there a specific method to put sprites on the rear platform (behind the trains)
21:34:14 <andythenorth> or shall I just add them as childsprites to ground?
21:36:33 <_glx_> and sprite sorter will manage
21:38:20 <andythenorth> they are very fancy 🙂
21:38:55 <peter1138> But which way is North?
21:39:20 <andythenorth> which way is the wind blowing?
21:40:50 <_pruple> in the bin with other clutter, it's a stylistic choice 😛
21:46:36 <_pruple> I've already got some runway extensions as objects, might do approach lighting too
21:48:10 <andythenorth> make a GS to place them 🙂
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