IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-12-22
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08:05:21 <andythenorth> user bytes on vehicles?
08:05:41 <andythenorth> I guess we can't afford the RAM
08:06:48 <andythenorth> 16 bytes per vehicle would scale up horribly
08:07:02 <andythenorth> 250 MB or so would be reached even in small games
08:08:20 <andythenorth> I don't know if all props are copied to every vehicle instance though, or if some are derived from the class definition
08:08:58 <andythenorth> if user bytes weren't instanced, it's only 16 KB for 1000 vehicles
08:09:34 <andythenorth> I probably have much more than 16 KB of varact 2 checking IDs š
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09:16:22 <LordAro> @calc 16 * 5000 * 4 * 15
09:17:37 <LordAro> 4.8MB at absolute maximum
09:17:43 <LordAro> unless i'm missing something
09:21:01 <petern> Most engine data isn't copied to vehicles.
09:36:41 <andythenorth> probably fine then š
09:37:47 <andythenorth> lordaro just a small off-by-1000 error in my calculation š
09:38:14 <petern> We do have a lot of v->GetEngine() or EngInfo(v->engine_type) calls.
09:38:44 <petern> I wonder how much they cost š
09:39:21 <andythenorth> are they cached locally to the vehicle? š
09:39:40 * andythenorth unoptimises the optimising
09:40:21 <petern> There are still places where we do both of those, despite EngineInfo since being moved inside the Engine class.
09:41:29 <andythenorth> well....being able to define arbitrary props and check them....would avoid some stupidity I do using vehicle ID lookups
09:41:59 <andythenorth> or I can do it in the compile, and nobody has to discuss the grf spec š
09:59:29 <petern> You can kinda do that with 32 bit values though, assuming you don't need all possible values.
10:00:08 <petern> And most of the time you then still only need to check for a specific value.
10:01:11 <petern> Should we think about using the same number across vehicle types for new properties?
10:06:10 <petern> It doesn't really clean things up as there's also same-properties on different numbers.
10:06:24 <petern> Makes it slightly easier to add new props I guess
10:06:45 <petern> Hmm, even with the 'new' metrics some fonts still have loads of space top & bottom.
10:13:21 <petern> [build] I:\src\vcpkg\installed\x64-windows-static\include\freetype\config\public-macros.h(104,1): warning C4005: 'FT_EXPORT': macro redefinition [I:\src\OpenTTD\build\openttd.vcxproj]
10:15:35 <petern> Looks like Freetype already does the extern "C" now.
10:15:57 <petern> At least with my copy on WIndows.
10:18:08 <petern> And checking if FT_EXPORT is defined before we include FT_FREETYPE_H is... probably not helpful.
10:22:16 <dP> andythenorth: you can't do alt var41 on compile though
10:28:55 <dP> petern: seems to be a lost cause already
10:29:03 <dP> also, only affects those who deal with nfo
10:29:54 <petern> Basically yes, although we do have to duplicate it all in newgrf.cpp too.
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11:27:07 <andythenorth> dP: I already do, if we refer to same thing š
11:42:20 <dP> it depends on the consist which isn't know at compile
11:42:34 <dP> unless you changed the whole logic somewhere else
11:49:41 <glx[d]> Font fallback mechanism is annoying
11:52:48 <glx[d]> It always check small, medium and large, and the fallback result is reset even if language or font config are untouched
11:54:40 <petern> It's all wrong tbh š
11:55:03 <petern> We should use the font given, and only use fallback if a character isn't available.
11:55:14 <petern> But that is probably a big rewrite.
11:56:05 <petern> With my SVG changes I shoved an extra fontcache layer on top and it "works" but isn't pretty. And it gets the offsets all wrong.
11:58:36 <petern> TBH font as svg is only needed for those transport icons.
11:59:28 <petern> Although I changed lots of other things to draw glyphs instead of sprites.
12:06:36 <petern> Oof, nearly replied to that thread but decided better of it.
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12:43:55 <andythenorth> dP: +1 the consist isn't known at compile, I mean the IDs are known š
12:44:25 * andythenorth has been outside
12:44:28 <petern> Shut up fingers, it's 19Ā°C, that's not cold.
12:44:31 <andythenorth> to the shops and so on
12:45:25 <petern> I just realised I have been putting off going to Tesco because of the school kids invading it. They're probably at home.
12:45:53 <andythenorth> I went to M&S food
12:45:57 <andythenorth> it was an angry place
12:46:07 <petern> Christmas time is the worst.
12:46:27 <petern> Everyone is like "what's the bother, it's just another day" and also "GET OUT OF MY WAY I NEED ALL THE CHRISTMAS FOOD RIGHT NOW"
12:46:28 <andythenorth> there is a specifically middle-class combination of lack of coping, and anger
12:46:59 <petern> That's just the staff...
12:47:16 <andythenorth> on the plus side....snacks
12:47:35 <petern> I could have a banana.
12:58:36 <Merni> Evidently they need to install the safer level crossings patch
13:03:14 <andythenorth> petern: so just a dword or 2?
13:05:54 <petern> Why are US truck drivers so dumb?
13:06:23 <petern> It's the land of trucks getting stuck on tracks.
13:07:19 <TallTyler> I think it's probably just the sheer quantity of level crossings
13:08:55 <LordAro> "it's thought the driver was waiting at a set of traffic lights."
13:09:23 <LordAro> also, a 134ft long load?
13:09:26 <andythenorth> big country, statistical probabilities?
13:09:26 <LordAro> ffs, so many failures here
13:09:30 <TallTyler> A giant concrete beam
13:09:46 <andythenorth> UK has precedent sticking abnormal loads on crossings
13:11:13 <TallTyler> I used to work a line that had a crossing about ten feet before a stop sign at a busy road. I've had four close calls at that one crossing requiring an emergency stop, including with a loaded cement mixer š¬
13:33:52 <andythenorth> hmm are user bits / bytes / dwords per vehicle a good idea?
13:35:25 <andythenorth> I think my objection to them is they're not necessary š
13:35:34 <andythenorth> it can all be done in varact2
13:35:49 <dP> vehicle kinda lack storage so some would be helpful
13:35:53 <andythenorth> but then again it's quite....something....heavyweight?
13:36:01 <andythenorth> doing it in varact2
13:36:31 <petern> If it's changeable it's a recipe for desync.
13:36:52 <dP> make it only changeable in depot
13:36:58 <petern> If it's not changeable there's not much point.
13:37:13 <andythenorth> I assumed static
13:37:41 <andythenorth> hmm I wonder if there's a var that can be interpolated on the fly
13:38:20 <andythenorth> 0x61 could set a parameter, and the vehicle it's reading the var on could return different results š
13:43:45 <JGR> If all storage is stored in the savegame, making it changeable should not be a problem
13:52:04 <Gwyd> I would have thought if would be static from a grf
13:52:29 <Gwyd> For if the author wanted to mark a certain subset of vehicles for some reason
13:53:57 <dP> but it shouldn't be hard to also add action0 props that would be copied into vehicle as initial value
13:54:02 <dP> so it can be used both wayss
13:59:15 <dP> basically, the same way user bits work for trains, just not as limited
14:01:07 <andythenorth> meanwhile, a var to get the variant group probably is a thing
14:05:08 <dP> prop to change variant group for extra lolz xD
14:10:00 <andythenorth> "Nope, it's not" or "Nope, it shouldn't be"? š
14:14:43 <petern> Require purchase of a vehicle to determine its variant group.
14:16:39 <andythenorth> Require purchasing 1 to unlock the next 1
14:16:44 <andythenorth> collect the full set
14:16:51 <andythenorth> add achievement badges
14:17:56 <dP> loot boxes, you purchase the group you get some random stuff
14:18:39 <petern> Pfft, game script tor that š
14:18:48 <andythenorth> or should be š
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14:21:02 <Eddi|zuHause> that the train icon isn't correctly aligned to the writing line of the text
14:27:21 <petern> Neither old nor new text metrics do that, but probably because I changed the aligned of the sprite when using Truetypes.
14:31:01 <petern> It's now centred within the font height. Maybe that can be semi-reverted.
14:33:42 <petern> Not sure why the "u" has tons of spacing there but that's Uniscribe.
14:35:57 <petern> The change from base-line to centre was because the sprites can overflow. Hm.
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15:39:41 <petern> Is Samu going to come on and tell us that we're all shit again? š
15:46:33 <Yuerak> Hello, I just have a quick question, is it possible to hide the icons from station labels?
15:47:32 <Gwyd> You could have the sprites set to just one transparent pixel
15:52:10 <Yuerak> Ah ok, so no native in-game option or hidden config to do it then, was hoping it was possible to have it as one of the transparency options or something.
15:52:57 <andythenorth> hmm I bet none of my dual-head magic handles livery variants correctly š
15:55:28 <andythenorth> needs the 2nd livery drawing but eh
16:03:31 <FLHerne> Yuerak: of course you can hide the entire label including the icons ;-)
16:05:18 <FLHerne> nvm my other idea doesn't work
16:06:07 <FLHerne> Why do you particularly want to hide the icons? They don't seem more intrusive than the rest of the sign
16:10:37 <supermop_toil> andythenorth: og livery or gner?
16:11:04 <andythenorth> supermop probably both
16:11:44 <andythenorth> there can be a 4th
16:11:52 <andythenorth> but maybe royal mail, or RES
16:12:01 <andythenorth> there are mail HST cars in Horse
16:12:17 <supermop_toil> RM HST would be nice
16:15:47 <Yuerak> It varies a bit, usually I hide labels and stuff when I want to take screenshots, but in some cases I would like to have the station name showing, but when you combine multiple modes of transport and call it "Hub A" then 1/3rd of the label is the name, the rest icons, so it would be cleaner to hide the icons in that case :)
16:16:56 <Pruple> turn off station names and use a sign? š
16:17:33 <Yuerak> That is my current workaround yes :p
16:22:44 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: just noticed the Ferion link in your forum sig seems dead and spamified
16:23:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i should have ditched that like 10 years ago
16:23:24 <FLHerne> (which is a pity, it seemed interesting last time I looked)
16:23:39 <FLHerne> ((that was probably like 10 years ago))
16:24:39 <Eddi|zuHause> i've nothing interesting to put in my signature
16:26:54 <Eddi|zuHause> last sign of life (according to my emails) was in 2016
16:27:37 <Eddi|zuHause> however, that was when my old mail account died
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18:45:18 <pickpacket> Tea Tea Deluxe 1.2.0 is now published!
18:47:51 <pickpacket> It's really fun to tinker with new content
18:50:48 <petern> Who even needs to play the game š
18:51:44 <pickpacket> which version of the game is on steam now? I don't have steam
18:52:46 <pickpacket> eeerrrrhhh... I forgot that I just built the latest from the master branch... So if I start a multiplayer game pretty much nobody will be able to join me, will they?
18:53:23 <Olionkey> LordAro: All minus the patch packs
18:54:05 <LordAro> OTTD versions are not compatible with each other
18:54:13 <LordAro> GRF versions on the other hand, will be fine
18:54:29 <LordAro> with each other for multiplayer*
18:55:28 <pickpacket> hmmm... I'm looking at tags on the master branch but I can only find beta versions
18:56:16 <LordAro> full releases are done in release/13 etc branches
18:59:54 <glx[d]> but you can just `git checkout <tag>`
19:00:35 <LordAro> (it'll likely just end up detecting the hash rather than the tag otherwise)
19:09:59 <petern> I wonder which dialogue box that is.
19:11:44 <LordAro> looks like the town authority window
19:11:51 <LordAro> judging on the tooltip positioning
19:22:36 <petern> I went to shop and it knackered me, wtf :/
19:27:15 <pickpacket> I can't compile 1.2.3... "cd build; cmake .." complains that there's no CMakeLists.txt file
19:30:47 <pickpacket> oh... maybe I should check the COMPILING.md file for that version...
19:35:37 <pickpacket> humdidum *watches latest OpenTTD compile*
19:35:55 <pickpacket> it's almost up to 50% in just a few minutes
19:38:28 <andythenorth> has anyone actually heard from frosch?
19:38:33 <andythenorth> seems absent for longer than usual
19:46:36 <supermop_toil> can i spend holiday week making bus stops, or is that not done yet?
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20:15:29 <Rubidium> sounds like MinGW 64 bit speeds
20:18:52 <LordAro> Rubidium: 32bit atom speeds
20:20:10 <petern> It's actually still compiling from the other night š
20:21:14 <pickpacket> I'm guessing it'll take about an hour in total
20:21:46 <LordAro> (other than the very fun version number, ofc)
20:23:53 <pickpacket> haha, because... uhm... I can't count, apparently š
20:24:19 <pickpacket> I'll build 12.2 tomorrow...
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20:39:32 <petern> Oh no, you actually build 1.2.3...
20:41:08 <andythenorth> it really needs to be out there and tested to find issues
20:41:14 <andythenorth> can always revert it
20:47:04 <petern> You can always reverse it
20:48:55 <LordAro> we haven't got to #26201 yet
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20:56:33 <Rubidium> though what about #6661?
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20:58:40 <pickpacket> petern: no, I failed building 1.2.3, but Iād removed the artifacts from my previous build. Just built the latest on master
20:58:44 <petern> Andy completed that one š
21:01:23 <glx[d]> of course #10275 is on 12.2 so crashlog is useless
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22:55:11 <andythenorth> most of the offset things just need merged
22:55:33 <andythenorth> what was the thing about PRs and branches and bureaucracy? š
23:06:05 <petern> There is definitely not going to be a peter1138pp
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23:27:45 <andythenorth> Christmas2022PP?
23:30:48 <glx[d]> better than nothing, but only tested on my non freetype windows build
23:41:57 <glx[d]> hmm I should probably test with null video driver
23:45:38 <LordAro> i shall test on linux
23:52:25 <glx[d]> oups my workaround is of course incorrect for sprite font
23:53:52 <LordAro> glx[d]: also a warning :)
23:54:13 <LordAro> ...which is odd, actually
23:54:31 <LordAro> static where it shouldn't be, i guess
23:54:34 <glx[d]> waiting for annotation check
23:55:58 <LordAro> i suppose it'd be a load more effort to get a list of available fonts?
23:56:15 <LordAro> the "true" names of fonts can be really weird sometimes
23:58:21 <petern> Must be inline if it's in a header.
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