IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-06-04
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04:05:21 <Tirili> _dp_, thanks, it actually was not a bus station. Problem solved.
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09:07:35 <TrueBrain> hmmmmm .. so I now have a townnames grf .. at least, I hope so
09:07:45 <TrueBrain> but when I load it in the game, it is not showing up in the townnames dropdown
09:08:19 <TrueBrain> ah, hidden in the noise, there is a problem while reading
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09:12:04 <TrueBrain> funny, rescanning doesn't show the error anymore .. you only see it the first time :D
09:14:46 <TrueBrain> grfcodec can decode it just fine, so it is just the actionF that I wrote wrongly .. lets find out :D
09:17:27 <TrueBrain> lol, -dgrf=6 gives so much noise of OpenGFX, that the scrollback of Windows isn't sufficient to see what it is actually doing .. nice
09:20:00 <TrueBrain> okay, that was a stupid mistake .. AND IT WORKS :D
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09:20:04 <TrueBrain> ActionF is really simple :P
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09:47:22 <frosch123> i didn't know sentry reports could be funny. apparently bananas considered a 400-error worth logging, and someone made a request to an url starting with /cgi-bin and ending with ';cat /etc/passwd
09:47:48 <TrueBrain> yeah, it made me wonder too, why I made the decision to log 400s
09:47:53 <TrueBrain> also shows how rare those events are :D
09:49:32 <frosch123> also, since when is andy on matrix?
09:51:17 <TrueBrain> he made an account there months ago
09:51:21 <TrueBrain> and completely forgot about it, I am sure :P
09:54:02 <frosch123> you mean like fonsinchen, planetmaker, SmatZ and Terkhen?
09:54:15 <TrueBrain> those are on an IRC bouncer, not? :P
09:54:34 <TrueBrain> well, 90% of this channel are zombies :P
09:55:42 <TrueBrain> ugh, WASM isn't as mature as I would like .. I get a random error from WASM which I do not understand, especially as it works with an older version, and I changed nothing in this part :P
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10:01:18 <TrueBrain> lol, even if I manually compile the old version myself, it still doesn't work
10:03:58 <frosch123> sounds like "make clean", retry again
10:04:15 <TrueBrain> exactly what I have been trying yes :P
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10:06:36 <TrueBrain> the issue? The version of the node package ...
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10:14:05 <frosch123> aw, you made a real set, i was expecting (True|False|New)(Brain|Light|Dark)
10:14:18 <TrueBrain> that would have been funnier :P
10:14:36 <TrueBrain> ugh, why don't I get debug symbols in my Rust WASM binaries .. debugging this is very annoying
10:14:39 <TrueBrain> "something" doesn't work
10:19:51 <TrueBrain> the more tricky thing about townnames would be that some things are mutual exclusive .. and how to present that in a nice GUI :P
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10:34:42 <TrueBrain> hihi, my Dutch fictive townnames look shockingly good :D
10:45:43 <TrueBrain> wow, you know you made a good framework if adding a whole new type is just a few minutes work :) Okay .. now for the real UI .. but first, LUNCH! :D
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12:20:43 <glx> well opengl and intel of course
12:22:04 <glx> hmm but why is it using sdl-opengl when asked to use sdl ?
12:28:09 <frosch123> yeah, no idea, it doesn't do that for me
12:28:41 <TrueBrain> be mindful flatpack might be eating the "-v"
12:28:51 <TrueBrain> mostly you have to do "-- -v sdl" in these kind of applications
12:28:54 <frosch123> nah, it detected -v sdl2 as invalid
12:29:17 <frosch123> and -d driver3 also worked
12:30:09 <frosch123> but yeah, i guess rejecting all "*Intel*" may be an option
12:30:20 <frosch123> funnily I have the same problem at work
12:30:41 <TrueBrain> yeah, what the pita is with these kind of tools, that he might be like: I don't know "-d" , so I send it to the app .. but I do know "-v", so I will eat it :P But if that isn't the problem, good :)
12:30:50 <frosch123> qt crashes on a lot of intel drivers since january
12:50:35 <frosch123> what's the "(Optional) Source of this set"?
12:50:49 <TrueBrain> a link to the source you used to generate your townnames
12:50:54 <TrueBrain> the (?) explains it in a bit more detail
12:51:04 <TrueBrain> mainly meant for real-world townname sets
12:51:21 <TrueBrain> not generated in the GRF, ofc
12:51:51 <frosch123> ok, so a source code comment :)
12:52:18 <TrueBrain> initially I tried naming "Part #1" etc
12:52:21 <TrueBrain> but there are no useful names
12:52:31 <glx> suggestion: display somewhere some resulting generated names
12:52:40 <TrueBrain> glx: yup! Planned :D
12:52:56 <frosch123> do you want to keep the parts on separate pages? or maybe put them into a single spreadsheet as columns?
12:53:13 <frosch123> or maybe multiple independentl scrollable lists
12:53:15 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I initially tried that, but probability makes that really busy
12:53:27 <TrueBrain> so I also initially tried to do without probability
12:53:30 <TrueBrain> but that is also meh
12:53:52 <glx> you can name probability "weight"
12:54:02 <TrueBrain> yeah, that is a better name :D
12:54:31 <glx> because that's more the effect
12:57:25 <TrueBrain> main issue with any UI, horizontal scrollbars are the worst
12:58:58 <peter1138> Design it for 640x480, can't go wrong...
12:59:01 <TrueBrain> anyway, subset references also work .. so you can have an "@aan" in one of those fields, which means the "aan" set is used for that case
12:59:11 <TrueBrain> I just need to fix that their order is resolved correctly ..
12:59:26 <TrueBrain> otherwise it surprisingly works ..
12:59:41 <TrueBrain> frosch123: if you create the UI elements for me :P
12:59:54 <frosch123> there should be a townname-whack mode :p
13:00:21 <TrueBrain> I btw auto calculate firstbit and bitcount .. I might add an "expert" mode so you can set this yourself, but .. this makes things a lot easier :)
13:00:40 <TrueBrain> hmm, that image does give me an idea, I can instead of having this tree-view, a paginator
13:01:07 <glx> nml auto determine first and count too
13:01:17 <TrueBrain> I did that for layouts too
13:01:24 <TrueBrain> maybe that works here for the parts instead of what I have now
13:02:34 <TrueBrain> owh well, enough for now, time to enjoy the sun a bit :)
13:02:38 <peter1138> Hmm, why is this screen stuck in night-time lighting mode...
13:02:51 <frosch123> maybe add some preview, that shows a random choice of the other parts and <blank> for the currently displayed part
13:03:42 <TrueBrain> Or a random one but highlighted instead of blank
13:03:54 <frosch123> yeah, something like that
13:04:26 <frosch123> it's basically a slot machine
13:05:01 <TrueBrain> Works for trains too
13:05:41 <frosch123> i see, you know the dark web
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14:30:56 <TrueBrain> now should I do one or more examples .. hmm
14:42:16 <frosch123> one, the reroll button is good enough
14:42:32 <TrueBrain> I concluded the same .. I tried multiple, it is fucking weird :D :D
14:42:46 <TrueBrain> now to make add/remove actually work .. and some information of what the parts are etc
14:42:57 <TrueBrain> well, I think the parts people can work out just fine
14:43:02 <TrueBrain> the sets are more of an issue to explain
14:57:57 <TrueBrain> right, just adding a tooltip seems to do it :)
14:59:22 <Samu> rebasing is more difficult now :( command changes and settings.ini changes too hard
15:00:16 <Samu> some of the command changes even have been modified
15:00:34 <Samu> and i was counting on them in some of my patches
15:02:35 <Samu> took me a while to get it right
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15:40:29 <TrueBrain> right .. one thing left ... find out the order to generate for the subsets .. so the user doesn't need to care :)
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16:13:41 <Samu> okay, seems to be dictator ai, let's see
16:17:33 <Samu> alright, pintpointed the issue
16:20:31 <Samu> seems similar symptoms than the one you fixed before glx
16:21:09 <Samu> but now instead of a dead end, it's a lorry station
16:22:35 <glx> should be a drivethrough I guess
16:22:57 <Samu> the trucks want to go to depot behind the stations, but it's inaccessible, i presume this is mass calling the pathfinder, causing the spike in road ticks
16:23:08 <Samu> and the road network the trucks are in is huge
16:33:35 <glx> screenshot really looks like they should be drive through
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16:55:51 <Samu> got a savegame reproducing it now, it requires 6 vehicles this time t.t
16:56:13 <glx> the weird part for me is the station
16:56:28 <glx> but script api seems to work fine
16:56:43 <Samu> that's dictatorai not doing a good job
16:57:13 <Samu> the issue im complaining is the spike in road ticks, in the latency graph
16:57:37 <glx> spike is expected if not path can be found
16:58:21 <glx> as more nodes are checked until if pf gives up
17:03:48 <glx> is the depot in the order list ?
17:06:17 <glx> 775 vehicles, if the road is badly designed for all of them the main issue is the AI
17:12:56 <Samu> wow, while debugging, i triggered an assert in the frametime graph
17:14:19 <Samu> assert(newpoint.x <= lastpoint.x);
17:22:43 <Samu> this assert is annoying me, doesn't let me debug the other issue properly lol
17:23:39 <glx> don't open the graph while debugging ?
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17:49:29 <Samu> oh boy this issue is harder
17:50:21 <Samu> the pathfinder is called, finds the path, but doesn't cache it
17:50:31 <Samu> because it's just 1 step
17:50:49 <Samu> the vehicle finds itself blocked
17:51:02 <Samu> and bam, it repeats the same procedure
17:55:26 <Samu> i regret having deleted my PR about this :(
17:56:07 <Samu> I thought it wasn't gonna happen again
17:56:55 <glx> but the main issue is there's no path
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18:03:59 <TrueBrain> ugh, why do I always forget how tricky it is to flatten a graph? :)
18:04:18 <TrueBrain> especially as I kinda need cycli detection
18:04:21 <TrueBrain> as people will do weird shit :D
18:06:25 <_dp_> why can't you just do dfs? ez cycle detection as well
18:37:46 <peter1138> Hmm, think my Wii has given up :(
18:38:22 <peter1138> Think it's still under warranty...?
18:38:41 <TrueBrain> you are asking us? :D
18:43:30 <TrueBrain> `&&&std::string::String: Borrow<std::string::String>`
18:47:37 <peter1138> I want some extra $
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18:55:09 <TrueBrain> Rust is awesome for his lifetimes, but sometimes it gives you weird code :D
18:55:15 <TrueBrain> Style { id: u8, name: Option<&'a String>, parts: &'a Vec<ActionFPart<'a>> },
18:55:24 <TrueBrain> basically a: yes, those all live equally long, stfu compiler :P
18:59:40 <TrueBrain> but okay, 50 lines of code later, and we have graph flattening :D
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19:05:01 <TrueBrain> I think it is ready :o
19:10:08 <Samu> i've been thinking, unconditionally push tile and trackdir without caring whether the cache is empty
19:11:51 <Samu> because, if it reaches this point, it means the pathfinder returned a valid trackdir
19:12:09 <Samu> so, it's not like it's gonna push an invalid path
19:13:08 <Samu> but... i wonder if this is the right approach
19:14:12 <glx> would be better to fix the AI
19:14:58 <Samu> btw glx, we forgot another location where this happened
19:16:27 <glx> start with ships maybe TrueBrain
19:21:21 <frosch123> i wondered about trains... i concluded that people who care about railtypes would not ue truegrf
19:21:37 <Samu> this is what I'm testing atm
19:21:56 <frosch123> so maybe truegrf should be opinionated about not supporting railtypes with weight classes or voltages or shit
19:23:58 <Samu> do i create a new issue, or re-open #7670? since it's related to it
19:24:21 <Samu> i'm even using the same savegame example
19:24:43 <Samu> i guess i better make a new issue
19:33:11 <TrueBrain> pretty happy with the result .. it is even for me now easy to make townname grfs :D
19:33:18 <TrueBrain> guess next step is to auto-publish to BaNaNaS on release? :P
19:33:37 <frosch123> is there some viewing mode?
19:33:45 <TrueBrain> no .. I have been thinking about that
19:33:54 <TrueBrain> but every time I come to realisation it is only useful for a very small portion of people
19:34:01 <TrueBrain> and it is a lot of effort to ensure everything is disabled
19:34:02 <frosch123> it may scare people away if they first have to login to github, grant access to all their rpos, ...
19:34:20 <TrueBrain> yeah .. I kinda dislike that you can't get a smaller scope request via OAuth
19:34:36 <frosch123> hmm, "downloading project" takes ages :p
19:35:06 <TrueBrain> but I might make a sandbox some day (soon)
19:35:15 <TrueBrain> for FIRS, downloading a project takes a while :P
19:35:19 <TrueBrain> the rest should be relative quick
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19:35:49 <frosch123> i created a new townname set based on dutch towns
19:35:59 <TrueBrain> that should be done rapidly
19:36:04 <TrueBrain> otherwise, check the console!
19:37:00 <TrueBrain> it is not, but I also wonder why I enabled beaconing ..
19:37:29 <frosch123> looks like it is stuck on fetching project tree, 0/5 files
19:37:42 <TrueBrain> that is really odd ..
19:38:22 <TrueBrain> project creation worked fine
19:38:30 <TrueBrain> so you could talk to GitHub API just fine
19:39:39 <TrueBrain> hmm .. the only thing I can think off, that it is waiting for your permission to write stuff in the indexeddb
19:41:13 <TrueBrain> that is really odd ..
19:41:32 <frosch123> the response looks all right, all 5 files ilsted
19:41:52 <TrueBrain> let me check I added anti-cache headers everywhere ..
19:43:41 <TrueBrain> I also see it loads fonts from another website .. that is also not the intention :D
19:43:59 <TrueBrain> yeah, I really tell it not to cache anything
19:45:48 <frosch123> i don't see that in the requestr
19:45:53 <TrueBrain> I do not handle exceptions at that point, so there should on your console be a fat error
19:46:03 <TrueBrain> but seeing the error doesn't actually help anything :D
19:46:24 <TrueBrain> and I cannot reproduce the issue on any browser here .. so that is annoying :D
19:46:46 <frosch123> oh, that beacon.min.js is actually blocked by ublock :p
19:47:05 <TrueBrain> yeah, but that shouldn't prevent anything
19:47:12 <TrueBrain> I am not redeploying with the beacon disabled anyway :P
19:47:37 <frosch123> ok, now it is blocked by cors :p
19:47:46 <TrueBrain> CORS? On what request?
19:48:04 <frosch123> i disabled ublock, and the next thing blocked it :p
19:48:07 <TrueBrain> reload, and it won't even try beacon anymore :)
19:48:53 <TrueBrain> well, it might take a bit of time for CF to purge their cache I guess
19:49:33 <TrueBrain> okay, on Firefox I do see the 304s too, but they are fine
19:50:02 <TrueBrain> owh, I render all projects with GRFID TRU1 ... this .... is going to be an issue :D
19:50:24 <frosch123> we should preemtively block TRU* on bananas :p
19:50:32 <TrueBrain> I should force people to fill in their own, and lookup on BaNaNaS if it isn't taken yet :P
19:50:54 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I am guessing you are on Linux .. what browser?
19:51:21 <frosch123> shall i try chromium?
19:51:34 <TrueBrain> I want to know why it doesn't work :D
19:51:41 <TrueBrain> but if your console remains empty .. that is just odd :P
19:51:47 <frosch123> i have no experience with the js debugger
19:52:04 <frosch123> the beacon is gone now though :)
19:52:17 <TrueBrain> if there is nothing in the console, there is nothing to debug I am afraid :P
19:52:48 <frosch123> i assumed one can see some async-await somewhere?
19:53:16 <frosch123> oh, i found a "disable cache" checkbox
19:53:21 <TrueBrain> honestly, don't know .. never had the need to
19:54:11 <TrueBrain> libdbus-glib-1.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
19:54:11 <frosch123> with that checked, everything is 200/204
19:54:16 <TrueBrain> can't start firefox on WSL :P
19:54:23 <TrueBrain> but it still doesn't continue?
19:54:35 <frosch123> that weird ibmplexsans-regular is still there
19:54:56 <frosch123> yep, fetching project tree succeeds, but it does not try to download any files
19:55:10 <TrueBrain> it isn't asking for permissions or anything?
19:55:16 <TrueBrain> as it tries to write in the indexeddb
19:55:40 <frosch123> no idea where it would ask for permissions
19:56:59 <TrueBrain> Firefox ESR on Linux, works without issue
19:57:10 <TrueBrain> do you happen to have some extension that is blocking access to indexeddb or something?
19:58:11 <TrueBrain> as literally the next thing it does after fetching the tree you showed earlier, is opened indexeddb .. so then an indexeddb entry should be created
19:59:37 <frosch123> ok, with chromium it works, so it's no network or other weirdness
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20:00:28 <TrueBrain> I was thinking, maybe it doesn't like the name of the indexeddb I try to create .. but at least I expect a message about that
20:02:34 <TrueBrain> owh, no, after the trees/.../?recursive=1, there should be a call to /commits/<sha>
20:03:06 <TrueBrain> I dunno ... something to look into another day .. if Chromium works, you can at least enjoy what I did today :P
20:03:44 <TrueBrain> one bug I spotted, "Reload NewGRF" under testing doesn't do the correct thing, as the languages aren't showing up in-game .. you have to open NewGRF Settings yourself, and hit Apply
20:03:49 <TrueBrain> which is odd .. but something to look into
20:04:51 <frosch123> quite impressed how much work you put into the license stuff :)
20:05:04 <TrueBrain> hopefully it also actually helps
20:05:36 <TrueBrain> I do have to fix BaNaNaS to have these licenses too :P
20:07:42 <frosch123> ha, found the issue
20:07:55 <frosch123> i enabled "dom.indexedDB.privateBrowsing.enabled", now it works
20:08:30 <TrueBrain> as clearly it doesn't report that back to me ..
20:08:45 <frosch123> as in: default is "off"
20:09:30 <frosch123> hmm, indexdb is still empty, is it only used temporary?
20:09:44 <TrueBrain> no, but you hav eto refresh it manually
20:10:23 <frosch123> clearly the "refresh" button is broken there
20:10:34 <frosch123> but ok, opening/closing the debug dock worked
20:12:17 <TrueBrain> it is a transactional database, really annoying to debug in the browser :P
20:16:59 <frosch123> it's funny how every gui action results in a git commit
20:17:15 <TrueBrain> only when you leave the active item :)
20:17:21 <TrueBrain> so you can work all you want in a single industry/townnames/etc
20:17:28 <frosch123> i wonder when people actually paste their passwords :p
20:17:31 <TrueBrain> but when you move away, it saves it :)
20:17:34 <TrueBrain> I can even implement "undo" on it :)
20:17:48 <TrueBrain> well, as it doesn't save when you modify the field, you should be fine ;)
20:17:52 <TrueBrain> just remove it before clicking away :D
20:18:29 <frosch123> i assume if i open the thing in two tabs/browsers/machine, they mess everything up
20:18:46 <TrueBrain> one of the two will tell you to reload really quick
20:19:04 <TrueBrain> when saving, it validates the sha of the current file on GitHub is what the local cache also thinks
20:19:19 <TrueBrain> if they mismatch, the commit is discarded, and a big error is shown that you have to reload
20:19:26 <TrueBrain> the only work you can lose basically is your active item
20:20:34 <frosch123> "Papenmolen aan den IJssel" <- i like that one
20:20:47 <TrueBrain> weirdly enough, it could have been a real place
20:20:50 <frosch123> i clicked like 20 times, it was always a short name, then that monster showed up
20:20:57 <TrueBrain> I never realised how silly our city names actually are
20:21:10 <TrueBrain> 1 in 20 chance for it to be larger :P
20:21:15 <frosch123> i assume it's the same all over europe
20:22:00 <TrueBrain> but I like how the example turned out
20:22:04 <frosch123> i moved from north to south germany, and suddenly all town names were confusing
20:22:30 <frosch123> south uses a different namegen, and everything sounds like a random combination of the same parts
20:24:03 <frosch123> there is some weird 00000000 grf in the active newgrf list
20:26:17 <frosch123> ah, it squashes everything on main-commit
20:26:35 <frosch123> "Co-authored-by: TrueGRF <truegrf@truebrain.nl>" <- haha
20:28:12 <frosch123> (on topics/truegrf)
20:33:16 <TrueBrain> either way, this is a whole lot more line of code than I expected I would need :P
20:34:11 <TrueBrain> but at least I have the first user that is actually building an industry GRF with it, mostly from scratch .. and he has a ton of requests to add stuff :P
20:34:37 <frosch123> haha, i like how the "dutch (real)" are just the first 250 from some list, so they all start with A :)
20:35:45 <frosch123> i am missing some logout button. you can't use this in an internet cafe... do those still exist?
20:46:12 <TrueBrain> Good point. I went for comfort, but that might not be the right thing to do
20:46:22 <TrueBrain> Especially as this token has a lot of permissons
20:48:19 <TrueBrain> Don't know if you can actually logout .. I think that requires revoking access, as otherwise GitHub keeps giving you a token :D
20:48:56 <TrueBrain> I don't like this access model, not one bit .. guess I do need to write some server component to make it a bit more secure
20:49:44 <frosch123> well, yes, it does not log-out from github
20:49:47 <TrueBrain> Currently all information only exists in your browser, which is nice
20:50:23 <frosch123> eints has a logout button to delete its cookie, but it does not logout from github
20:50:42 <TrueBrain> Yeah, but you logout from the eints server
20:50:47 <TrueBrain> That doesn't exist here
20:51:14 <TrueBrain> So when you refresh the page, you ask GitHub a new token, and you get it without user interaction
20:52:00 <TrueBrain> But I can make login always an explicit action
20:52:00 <frosch123> ah, ok, so if i logout from github and close the tab, there is recovery?
20:52:04 <TrueBrain> That is not a bad idea
20:52:28 <TrueBrain> No recovery from what?
20:53:02 <frosch123> the access token is not stored when leaving the page
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20:53:46 <TrueBrain> But I have some ideas to make it all a bit more explicit, instead of the current implicit :)
20:54:06 <TrueBrain> User friendly, but not super secure
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21:21:39 <wallabra_> Note: Cargodist is enabled.
21:21:43 <wallabra_> Maybe a single metro loop?
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22:52:35 <FLHerne> wallabra_: Yes, eventually
22:52:46 <wallabra_> Are there penalties for tunnels and bridges?
23:05:24 <wallabra_> Hang on let me fix my nick
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23:27:13 <FLHerne> the first one is almost certainly worse than not having the one-ways
23:27:37 <FLHerne> because buses will get stuck in any queue of lorries waiting to (un)load, and vice versa, when they wouldn't otherwise
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23:31:54 <wallabra> I wonder if there's a NewGRF which adds highways, which would be bulky and tricky to design/build, and require things like interchanges, but would offer high capacity for road vehicles and multiply their speed.
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23:34:23 <FLHerne> Dutch Road Objects (exact name may vary) has some things for building pretty dual-carriageways and multi-lane roads
23:34:53 <FLHerne> despite the name the appearance is pretty generic, roads are roads
23:35:46 <wallabra> What I had in mind would be kind of a filler between road vehicles being bad for long/high-capacity routes, and train vehicles being unwieldy for highly interconnected traffic networks.
23:36:32 <FLHerne> I keep forgetting, we do have roadtypes now
23:36:52 <FLHerne> 'multiply their speed' isn't possible without a cooperating vehicle grf
23:37:14 <FLHerne> but it could be a thing
23:37:30 <glx> vehicles still can't really overtake
23:37:43 <wallabra> glx, I think most highway designs minimize overtaking, right?
23:37:52 <FLHerne> can't increase road capacity in any way though
23:37:55 <wallabra> By providing looong stretches of road with interchanges here and there.
23:41:45 <wallabra> inb4 someoe invents a hexagonal city layout with roundabout intersections
23:44:23 <FLHerne> hexagons in OpenTTD would be a neat trick
23:44:57 <FLHerne> I do tend to build little roundabouts (just a crossroads with one extra corner piece, or equivalent) in cities
23:45:22 <FLHerne> they're good for allowing buses to make a U-turn without disappearing off down random streets
23:55:25 <wallabra> yeah, I just make dead end roads :p
23:55:33 <wallabra> in the middle of the city
23:55:41 <wallabra> just pretend it's a cul-de-sac!
23:56:20 <wallabra> I usually prefer using a loop of road if I'm going to use a through station, because then buses may enter from both sides, using all 4 slots.
23:56:40 <wallabra> But it's pretty hard to achieve that in a pleasant way sometimes.
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