IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-05-07
⏴ go to previous day
01:12:03 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
01:12:38 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd
01:19:05 *** _aD has quit IRC (Quit: leaving)
01:32:12 *** Wormnest has quit IRC (Quit: Leaving)
01:35:02 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd
01:35:02 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir
01:41:57 *** tokai has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
01:48:17 *** Cthulhux has quit IRC (Quit: Cthulhux)
02:12:54 *** OsteHovel has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
03:01:18 *** debdog has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
05:12:04 *** D-HUND is now known as debdog
05:15:12 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
05:15:25 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd
05:19:37 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
05:20:00 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd
05:45:31 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
06:04:42 *** andythenorth has quit IRC (Quit: andythenorth)
06:07:25 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
07:40:52 *** lobstarooo has joined #openttd
07:41:22 *** lobster has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
07:41:23 *** lobstarooo is now known as lobster
07:54:25 <andythenorth> I am really stuck on how to comply with the standardised railtype scheme without doing malicious compliance
07:54:50 <andythenorth> it's *required* to divide all the vehicles for a specific railtype into 5 groups by axle load
07:55:06 <andythenorth> I thought I could have 1 group with all the vehicles in, and 4 empty groups
07:55:31 <TrueBrain> I am pretty sure you are capable of doing that :P
07:56:14 <andythenorth> it's also not permitted by the scheme to just use the vehicle weight / number of axles
07:56:29 <andythenorth> specifically the 5 classes *cannot* just map to weight
07:57:23 <andythenorth> I could spend time making 2 or 3 plausible groups, but producing 5 will literally require malicious compliance, where a small number of vehicles get assigned to classes D and E, producing distorted gameplay
07:57:52 <andythenorth> then someone will point out I am just castrating the spec or something
08:00:41 <andythenorth> if I refuse to support the standardised scheme, that will cause some other nonsense
08:01:16 <TrueBrain> so basically, realism is trying to win from pixels? :D
08:15:12 <andythenorth> it's a pretty classic spec, v1, based on ideas not evidence
08:15:42 <andythenorth> nobody did anything stupid, but well intentioned drafting left some ambiguities
08:16:25 <andythenorth> 10 years later, we appear to have *1* vehicle set that implements the spec accurately
08:16:53 <andythenorth> so it's very 'standardised'
08:29:21 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
09:00:59 *** andythenorth has quit IRC (Quit: andythenorth)
09:55:45 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC ()
10:27:49 *** Westie has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
11:07:57 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai
11:13:54 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
11:17:16 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
12:16:19 *** Flygon_ has joined #openttd
12:17:19 *** Flygon has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
12:37:40 <nielsm> I don't understand why it doesn't visually turn
12:40:14 <TrueBrain> snap on snap off :D
12:52:14 <nielsm> next major issue is that the ship doesn't arrive correctly at a station
13:10:49 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
13:27:05 *** virtualrandomnumber has joined #openttd
13:34:50 <andythenorth> lol forgot that because of RAIL and ELRL, the actual use of standardised railtype scheme is minimal in vehicle grfs
13:36:46 <peter1138> RAIL and ELRL is the standardised railtype scheme ;D
13:37:38 <andythenorth> another thing I forgot
13:37:41 <andythenorth> mostly I forgot all of it
13:37:42 <peter1138> nielsm, I added some potential bad feature where ships turn slowly...
13:37:45 <andythenorth> even when the page is open
13:37:47 <peter1138> nielsm, so that's probably my fault.
13:38:15 <nielsm> well I've ripped everything up and tried to rearrange it into a new working order
13:38:36 <nielsm> the rotating on spot part seems to work, it's the rotating during motion that does not
13:38:45 * peter1138 ponders cracking open the scalable UI patch again...
13:39:58 *** Cthulhux has joined #openttd
13:40:01 <peter1138> I did a ride and a lunch, is it now dinner?
13:41:05 *** virtualrandomnumber has quit IRC (Quit: virtualrandomnumber)
13:41:15 <nielsm> okay ships seem to work during normal running, and able to start from a depo
13:42:02 <peter1138> Why use jQuery when browsers can to it all natively now... as long as you like to write 5x as much boilerplate code...
13:42:23 <nielsm> they can even leave depot one at a time, and sail back into depot
13:42:36 <nielsm> although haven't tried aqueducts yet
13:43:09 <peter1138> If it's parallelized surely they should all leave together ;)
13:43:29 <peter1138> (I should be a Dad...)
13:44:23 <nielsm> okay, aqueducts don't work
13:44:38 <peter1138> Just get rid of them. Bad feature.
13:45:45 <nielsm> I do agree they are silly
13:47:50 <peter1138> Bootstrap is also silly.
13:47:57 <peter1138> It's like they forgot about the C in CSS.
13:48:28 <peter1138> So you end up with every element having a thousand(* not quite) classes...
13:52:03 <andythenorth> C means 'Compositional' nowadays
13:52:45 <andythenorth> I used to get in a lot of fights about using inline styles for small utilities (margin tweaks etc)
13:53:07 <andythenorth> so I proposed generating lots of utility classes like m15 or whatever for margins
13:53:27 <andythenorth> Bootstrap 5 seems to have taken the troll suggestion and doubled down on it
13:55:08 <FLHerne> peter1138: I went over an aqueduct the day before yesterday
13:55:28 <FLHerne> removing it as a Bad Feature would have made my current journey very inconvenient :p
13:56:20 <andythenorth> walking over aqueducts freaks me out a bit
13:56:29 <andythenorth> water on both sides, of quite uneven depth and distance
13:56:57 <peter1138> <button class="btn" /> yeah.. I suppose I may have wanted a button that doesn't look like a button? I dunno...
13:57:17 <andythenorth> restyling <button> is an anti-pattern though
13:57:38 <andythenorth> and you often do want a button that doesn't look like button :D
13:57:44 <FLHerne> peter1138: well, yeah, the new style is to have "buttons" that are flat grey icons indistinguishable from the surrounding text
13:57:46 <andythenorth> although that's also controversial
13:58:09 <peter1138> andythenorth, it should be enough to provide a class to the form and let CSS do its thing.
13:58:32 <peter1138> Although you can also break that by putting controls outside the form, with the form= attribute.
13:58:42 <andythenorth> depends if you also want to use any plugins, etc
13:58:58 <andythenorth> or things you depend on the CMS for etc
13:59:16 <andythenorth> anyway, other frameworks are available besides Bootstrap
13:59:25 <andythenorth> it's pretty Marmite
14:00:02 <andythenorth> if you want to enjoy grumbling about Bootstrap, the usual entry point is 'divs, so many divs'
14:01:08 <andythenorth> don't just have an input, wrap it in some divs
14:42:19 *** Cthulhux has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
14:51:17 *** argoneus has quit IRC (Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds))
14:51:26 *** argoneus has joined #openttd
14:55:09 *** skrzyp has quit IRC (Remote host closed the connection)
15:10:35 <nielsm> they can travel on aqueducts now, but I'm not sure they leave the aqueducts correctly
15:12:52 <nielsm> since right now it just continues straight ahead into the land and crashes
15:13:01 <nielsm> not the ship that crashes, the game does
15:13:19 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC ()
15:18:50 <andythenorth> has frosch done a blog yet?
15:22:26 <peter1138> Something strange just happened to my bike.
15:22:52 <nielsm> oh hey, now it properly leaves the bridge and stuff
15:22:53 <peter1138> I wiped down the cassette and it came out clean and shiny. Instead of just spreading the dirt and oil around... Magic?
15:23:31 <peter1138> So tomorrow I'll be one of those smug riders with the shiny cassette (for the first few miles...)
15:25:56 <nielsm> okay I think stopped everything but the ships in Wentbourne and going to try loading that now
15:26:36 <nielsm> ah okay, got a NOT_REACHED error right away
15:28:19 <nielsm> hmm... it looks like it's trying to get the water class of a water-less tile
15:39:36 <nielsm> the issue probably relates to ships occasionally teleporting around, so I should fix that
16:02:54 <andythenorth> teleporting ships would be so OP
16:18:24 <peter1138> It would make up for all the bad features that keep making them worse...
16:20:27 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
16:31:51 <nielsm> ofc making them rotate properly would probably be the first step
16:32:02 <nielsm> I don't really understand what makes them not rotate atm
17:36:40 *** gelignite has joined #openttd
17:54:34 <andythenorth> is it too late to add railtype classes as well as labels? :P
17:54:40 <andythenorth> where's frosch when needed? :)
17:54:53 <TrueBrain> hiding; can't blame him :P
18:00:54 <andythenorth> I was going to do my garden and use my hot tub today
18:01:07 <andythenorth> instead I watched TV and learnt about the standardised railtype scheme, again :P
18:07:32 *** Flygon_ has quit IRC (Quit: A toaster's basically a soldering iron designed to toast bread)
18:08:04 <TrueBrain> I actually did my garden
18:18:36 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
18:28:16 <michi_cc> I did my garden, too. It was very fast and quick, because it is non-existent :p
18:45:04 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
18:47:48 *** Wormnest has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
18:52:37 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
18:52:51 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd
19:29:22 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
19:45:56 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd
19:48:25 *** OsteHovel has joined #openttd
19:57:10 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
19:57:47 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd
20:02:07 *** supermop_Home has joined #openttd
20:22:43 <supermop_Home> should I draw another Hawaii building?
20:24:37 <supermop_Home> been stuck inside all week with ba2 variant, but until today haven't had the energy to do anything with that time
21:00:04 * andythenorth thinks of drawing
21:06:36 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC (Quit: snail_UES_)
21:30:59 <supermop_Home> no sketchbooks here
21:32:17 *** gelignite has quit IRC (Quit: Stay safe!)
21:35:27 *** andythenorth has quit IRC (Quit: andythenorth)
21:51:12 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC ()
22:03:39 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd
22:15:43 *** nielsm has quit IRC (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
23:16:14 <TrueBrain> I forgot to add a regression .. incoming fix :P
23:16:44 <glx> with header it's simpler to read savegame data
23:17:33 <TrueBrain> it is 200000x simpler .. it really surprised me, honestly
23:17:39 <TrueBrain> much less .... error-prune :P
23:18:07 <TrueBrain> I am really happy with that result :) Also the docs someone made me write was really useful :D
23:19:09 <glx> less magic in byte reading
23:19:29 <glx> where a unfortunate offset could mess a lot
23:19:47 <TrueBrain> and mostly, this makes adding other things so much easier :)
23:20:06 <TrueBrain> but, a bit ironic ... none of this savegame analysis is used currently :P
23:20:14 <TrueBrain> it just does it for ... "future plans" :D
23:20:23 <glx> well it is used by bananas ;)
23:20:43 <TrueBrain> only in that file :D
23:21:34 <TrueBrain> from reporting a bug to fixing it in .. a bit over an hour
23:21:54 <glx> codebase is quite clean, helps a lot
23:22:20 <TrueBrain> yeah, the time spend on creating this paid off :)
23:23:12 <glx> too bad it was an uncatchable crash
23:23:44 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC (Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.)
23:25:57 <glx> (nasty forgotten raise for unknown chunk types)
23:26:13 <TrueBrain> yeah ... and that turns out to not actually be the problem :P
23:29:19 <TrueBrain> I wonder why it keeps everything in memory .. I am processing it in a streaming fashion ..
23:31:21 <TrueBrain> the ... MAP1 chunks ofc
23:38:46 <TrueBrain> okay ... from 14MB RAM usage to 3MB for this 4k map
23:38:52 <TrueBrain> that hopefully does the trick
23:43:59 <TrueBrain> see if it actually helps
23:44:09 <TrueBrain> locally it does, so maybe this is enough to stop the instance from OOMing? :D
23:45:31 <TrueBrain> now waiting for glx to press the button! :P
23:47:55 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC (Quit: snail_UES_)
23:49:30 <glx> why duplicate tags in the list ?
23:49:44 <TrueBrain> I do not know what you are talking about
23:51:26 <glx> I actually read the code before approving ;)
23:51:29 <TrueBrain> let's hope it fixes the issue ........ fingers crossed!
23:51:41 <TrueBrain> as you should! If you didn't, I could just have squashed it without approval :P
23:52:05 <TrueBrain> but these extra pair of eyes on these things help :) So it is appreciated!
continue to next day ⏵
