IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2022-03-17
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07:49:54 <LordAro> do you think it might be?
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09:28:38 <LordAro> it could be lunchtime, if you're somewhere in the middle east
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19:47:11 <Wolf01> So we have something ready for 1st april?
19:50:09 <nielsm> dunno a blog post about a fake release?
19:51:10 <Wolf01> Say that devs decided to draw back from steam and other stores
19:51:22 <Wolf01> Generate some havok :P
19:53:35 <frosch123> announce a new calendar
19:53:42 <frosch123> 1st april was already 6 months ago
19:54:36 <nielsm> the new multiplayer features have been such an overwhelming success that we're removing singleplayer because it's obsolete
19:54:40 <Wolf01> Switch to napoleonic calendar?
19:55:00 <Wolf01> That's wonderful, nielsm :D
19:58:49 <TrueBrain> a true 1st of April's joke .. now that would be refreshing :P
20:00:36 <nielsm> also make a build of the game with singleplayer actually removed (from the main menu) for screenshots
20:01:00 <nielsm> "improved usability by removing redundant choices"
20:01:23 <TrueBrain> well, I expect this in a PR by the end of the month :P
20:01:25 <frosch123> just a single big "play" button
20:02:07 <frosch123> people kept on complaining/asking about past jokes months after april
20:05:29 <andythenorth> I have a better idea
20:05:38 <TrueBrain> that was the best idea there was
20:05:40 <andythenorth> game is WASM only and requires a network connection
20:05:43 <andythenorth> but we remove multiplayer
20:06:13 <TrueBrain> "Going out of 'Free' on Steam; now €12,99"
20:06:45 <andythenorth> all funds go to truebrain, to convert Iron Horse to truegrf
20:06:46 <TrueBrain> OpenTTD DLC, to unlock trams
20:07:15 <andythenorth> lol 'train whack' is top google serps
20:07:27 <TrueBrain> Subscriptions, for just 5 euro a month you get unlimited rail tracks!
20:08:03 <frosch123> yeah, 5 euro/month to disable the in-game ads
20:08:12 <frosch123> i think that is standard now
20:08:19 <TrueBrain> haha, "WE ADDED ADS! To give you a better player experience! Integrates with Facebook!"
20:08:37 <TrueBrain> for those people who truly don't care about privacy :D
20:08:51 <andythenorth> we harvest your data, for better experience
20:09:01 <TrueBrain> "This tracker is fine!"
20:09:17 <TrueBrain> "Okay, for 5 euro a month you can disable the tracker! If privacy matters to you!"
20:09:34 <TrueBrain> I should work for Google / Facebook / <insert any other evil corp>
20:10:46 <andythenorth> how much do we have to charge to make a living on it?
20:11:05 <TrueBrain> close to 1M people who claimed the game
20:11:17 <TrueBrain> so ... depends on how many people will be living of it for what period of their life :P
20:11:37 <andythenorth> you can do grf, frosch123 can be sysadmin, I will do customer service
20:12:00 <TrueBrain> something tells me that list is in the wrong order :P
20:12:42 <andythenorth> maybe we can make a youtube channel
20:13:04 <andythenorth> so if we can convert 50% of 1 million players
20:13:11 <andythenorth> to say....$12 / year
20:13:17 <andythenorth> $6m should be enough?
20:13:49 <andythenorth> I know engineer salaries are now ridiculously high, according to recruiter emails I get sent
20:14:49 <frosch123> there are certainly huge regional differences :)
20:15:05 <frosch123> which becomes even more weird when working remote
20:15:39 <andythenorth> I am being offered engineers with 10 year experience in the local market
20:15:52 <andythenorth> at salaries higher than local average MD / CEO / Sales Director salary
20:16:10 <andythenorth> not CTO either, engineer
20:17:06 <frosch123> do they have experience with blockchain and nft though?
20:19:01 <andythenorth> " C#, ASP.NET MVC, .NET Core, ADO.NET, JavaScript, Entity Framework, and SQ"
20:20:11 <TrueBrain> @calc 65000 * 1.18 / 12
20:20:11 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 6391.666666666667
20:20:25 <TrueBrain> that is steep even for over here :P
20:20:49 <andythenorth> that is the salary of a sales director
20:20:57 <andythenorth> " 4 years extensive hands-on experience Python developing and modelling data centric applications, involved in system architecture, tackling scalability and performance challenges"
20:21:04 <andythenorth> expected salary of £90,000
20:21:19 <TrueBrain> well, amazon might pay that, honestly
20:21:24 <TrueBrain> they pay crazy amounts
20:21:37 <TrueBrain> which is not helping the job market, may I add :P
20:21:38 <andythenorth> Average Managing Director Salary £80,750
20:21:53 <andythenorth> there is a lot of easy money in scaleups
20:21:54 <TrueBrain> but, I am not the kind of person that believes a manager should earn more than a developer
20:22:04 <TrueBrain> a good developer is more valuable than most managers
20:22:24 <andythenorth> good developers have always been well paid the local market here
20:22:28 <frosch123> you can still apply for that pl/1 job in frankfurt :) i did not take it
20:22:43 <andythenorth> even 15 years ago sysadmin or DBA was £50k her minimum
20:23:05 <TrueBrain> normally over here there are more people looking for a job than there is supply .. but the last few months that is flipped
20:23:08 <TrueBrain> which is completely insane
20:23:23 <andythenorth> same here, Australia, New Zealand etc
20:23:47 <TrueBrain> so if your recruitment doesn't tackle a person instantly, and shows they how awesome the company is ... another recruiter has already
20:24:03 <TrueBrain> what is funny, how quickly recruitment got more professional
20:24:06 <frosch123> TrueBrain: isn't "people looking for a job" and "supply" the same thing?
20:24:09 <TrueBrain> (over the whole industry)
20:24:18 <TrueBrain> frosch123: supply -> vacancies
20:24:26 <TrueBrain> depends on which side of the desk you are what "supply" is :P
20:24:36 <TrueBrain> supply of job, or supply of people :D
20:25:06 <frosch123> there have been more job offers than applicants here for years
20:26:00 <frosch123> but the rule of thumb applies: if a company has too many open positions, it means people are leaving too fast, so you should avoid them
20:26:30 <TrueBrain> I do wonder when this bubble goes BOOM .. will it ever?
20:27:43 <frosch123> i guess the question is which bubble will replace it
20:28:15 <frosch123> ah, gh copilot will burst it?
20:28:16 <andythenorth> but my twitter also contains a whole pool of developers who are really scared about losing their jobs
20:28:51 <andythenorth> anyway, is $2m each enough, after tax?
20:28:56 <TrueBrain> automation causes "jobloss" .. but are replaced by others, so .. just keep up :P
20:29:23 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 833333.3333333334
20:29:23 <andythenorth> maybe we should charge more
20:29:30 <andythenorth> will people pay $15 / year for OpenTTD?
20:29:51 <frosch123> TrueBrain: isn't the usual utopia, that people do not longer have to work, if machines serve?
20:30:06 <TrueBrain> guess 2M results in ~100k from interest each year? Should be enough, I guess ..
20:30:25 <andythenorth> oh you'd bank the capital, we get paid the interest?
20:30:35 <frosch123> andythenorth: no two digit number, 15/year is way to high, rather go for 5/month :p
20:30:37 <andythenorth> "OpenTTD foundation"
20:30:55 <andythenorth> we could start bankrolling things
20:31:25 * andythenorth only slightly joking, Yogscast made insane amount for charity with Jingle Jam
20:31:31 <andythenorth> £12m or something last time I added it up
20:32:16 <frosch123> how does that relate? did you get percentages from that?
20:33:53 <andythenorth> shows that games will support charity, and OpenTTD is a big component of Jingle Jam
20:34:11 <andythenorth> so we could charge on Steam -> 100% donate to something
20:34:33 <andythenorth> in this model, we don't get paid $2m each sorry :P
20:36:35 <TrueBrain> how many people visit our www. you think, daily?
20:37:02 <andythenorth> order of magnitude wrong?
20:37:33 <TrueBrain> US alone produces that many visitors frosch123
20:38:04 <frosch123> hmm, US used to be a minority, but maybe that changed with steam
20:38:14 <TrueBrain> well, EU is not an entry
20:38:16 <frosch123> though i would not expect steam players to visit the website
20:38:35 <TrueBrain> so they are cheating
20:38:40 <TrueBrain> Germany is #2, and Netherlands #3
20:38:56 <TrueBrain> but yeah, 5k+ visits per day
20:39:41 <frosch123> frontpage, wiki, or everything?
20:39:41 <andythenorth> we should put more ads on the site
20:39:46 <andythenorth> we'd earn as much as $2
20:39:51 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I was rather explicit about www. :)
20:40:07 <TrueBrain> @calc 180000 / 24 / 60 / 60
20:40:07 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 2.0833333333333335
20:40:14 <TrueBrain> 2 requests per second on wiki :P
20:40:45 <andythenorth> "why aren't we rich?"
20:40:48 <frosch123> andythenorth: head of it security complained today, that their browser extention that is supposed to trigger on dodgy websites, triggered on our software :p
20:41:39 <TrueBrain> Cloudflare caches 50% for us, which is kinda nice :D
20:42:24 <TrueBrain> now I want them to release R2 (or give me access), so I can also get stats on BaNaNaS :P
20:43:05 <andythenorth> we did a thing on Monday which was top 3 on BBC news website for 24 hours, and all other UK news, and we put through 5x more workload more than the performance tests anticipate
20:43:11 <frosch123> is R2 a competitor to S3? and when is Q1?
20:43:30 <TrueBrain> frosch123: yes, R2 is like S3, but .. you can point it to an S3, and Cloudflare kicks in
20:43:34 <TrueBrain> basically, a giant cacher in front of your S3
20:43:37 <TrueBrain> heavily reducing cost
20:43:49 <TrueBrain> means we can move BaNaNaS to S3 / R2, and get ride of the 2 OVH VPSes we have running
20:44:01 <TrueBrain> should improve download speeds, and reduce cost :D
20:44:04 <andythenorth> Cloudflare seem to be really aggressive now about reducing AWS egress costs
20:44:12 <andythenorth> this is good for the rest of us, I think?
20:44:24 <TrueBrain> yeah ... AWS is stupid insane about the cost they charge
20:44:29 <TrueBrain> it is nowhere near realistic
20:44:33 <andythenorth> well Jeff has rockets to fund
20:44:33 <TrueBrain> but .. they can ask, and everyone pays
20:44:40 <frosch123> andythenorth: the top two topics are constant, so really you were on top
20:44:55 <TrueBrain> 1mbit/s used to be 15 euro a month, when I started in this industry .. 15+? years ago
20:45:03 <TrueBrain> 1mbit/s is ~300GB in 95% percentile
20:45:05 <TrueBrain> which costs 27 euro a month on AWS
20:45:06 <andythenorth> @frosch123 we were also quite 503 for some of it :P
20:45:38 <andythenorth> money printing machine
20:46:16 <TrueBrain> it is just silly .. so I am happy Cloudflare is saying: no more
20:46:21 <TrueBrain> they just have to hurry up a bit with actually releasing it
20:46:26 <TrueBrain> almost 6 months since they announced it
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21:05:38 <andythenorth> ok Horse making time
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