IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2021-08-18
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00:22:49 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #9492: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt pops out for no apparent reason. https://git.io/J0m3k
00:37:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on issue #9492: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt pops out for no apparent reason. https://git.io/J0m3k
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06:51:58 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #9490: [Bug]: Refreshing a full server gives an error https://git.io/J0mTG
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06:55:02 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #9491: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt can timeout with a weird error https://git.io/J0mIJ
06:58:31 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on issue #9492: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt pops out for no apparent reason. https://git.io/J0m3k
06:59:31 <TrueBrain> right, all three are rather minor, so lets update the beta2 PR, see if it can get an approval today ;)
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07:06:33 <Gustavo6046> I wish road vehicles (cars and trucks specifically) could occupy both lanes of a one-way road, at least the intersection-to-intersection stretch.
07:11:49 <TrueBrain> funny, so far nobody seems to have made a direct IPv6 connection to a server :D
07:11:56 <TrueBrain> for some reason I am also not really surprised :P
07:21:55 <Gustavo6046> And why do tramways not have one-way tracks too? They could be single- or double-lane, and single-lane would allow railways through.
07:22:21 <Gustavo6046> would automatically become mini-bridges past constructed canals (but not natural ones, or natural/dug water)
07:32:15 <andythenorth> 'why do ... ?' is not a useful question for about 90% of this game
07:33:19 <andythenorth> everything to do with roads 'why...?' can be answered with 'not possible', or more often 'nobody is interested in programming it'
07:38:48 <Gustavo6046> andythenorth: you mean simply a truck being able to turn into the lane opposite the configured one if it is free, when turning into a one-way stretch of road, and yielding if there are other road vehicles in the way in its current intersection, is hard to implement?
07:38:52 <Gustavo6046> I mean, it might be
07:39:02 <Gustavo6046> Also, is aircraft a bad way to transport freight?
07:39:12 <Gustavo6046> I mean relative to using aircraft for passengers
07:39:30 <andythenorth> freight aircraft is a winning strategy in transport goal games
07:40:08 <andythenorth> whether it's a good idea generally...depends on how you like to play, and which aircraft grf
07:40:34 <Gustavo6046> What if it's a high volume of freight? I can't have multiple airports, so it's prone to clogging, right?
07:40:48 <Gustavo6046> As in can't have multiple airports to load from the same station
07:40:55 <andythenorth> you would have to use transfers
07:40:59 <Gustavo6046> Maybe I can distribute across different airports somehow
07:41:08 <Gustavo6046> Like a tree of freight trucks?
07:42:12 <andythenorth> some airports perform better than others also
07:42:32 <Gustavo6046> Well duh, like the intercontinental one
07:45:59 <andythenorth> somebody measured it, but I can't find results
07:47:36 <andythenorth> ok, commuter airport has highest throughput vs size
07:48:08 <andythenorth> but only works for small planes
07:48:48 <andythenorth> 2x commuter airport has higher throughput of planes than international or intercontinental
07:50:25 <andythenorth> there is a freighter in AV9.8 which is 'small' but 200t of freight
07:52:25 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/py-protocol] TrueBrain opened pull request #15: Fix: support for Game Coordinator protocol 6 on STUN and TURN server https://git.io/J0OHy
07:53:19 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/py-protocol] TrueBrain merged pull request #15: Fix: support for Game Coordinator protocol 6 on STUN and TURN server https://git.io/J0OHy
07:54:19 <peter1138> TrueBrain, your stats are wrong then, because glx and I have.
07:54:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/game-coordinator] TrueBrain opened pull request #45: Update: bump openttd-protocol for latest bug-fixes https://git.io/J0OQ8
07:54:58 <TrueBrain> you are right, they are wrong :D
07:56:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/game-coordinator] TrueBrain opened pull request #46: Fix: stats were tracking "direct-ipv6" connections wrong https://git.io/J0OQF
07:56:55 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] ldpl commented on issue #9492: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt pops out for no apparent reason. https://git.io/J0m3k
07:57:00 <TrueBrain> stats-issue only, so that is okay :)
07:57:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/game-coordinator] LordAro approved pull request #46: Fix: stats were tracking "direct-ipv6" connections wrong https://git.io/J0O7O
07:58:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/game-coordinator] TrueBrain merged pull request #46: Fix: stats were tracking "direct-ipv6" connections wrong https://git.io/J0OQF
07:58:33 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/game-coordinator] TrueBrain merged pull request #45: Update: bump openttd-protocol for latest bug-fixes https://git.io/J0OQ8
07:58:44 <TrueBrain> right, lets run tons of tests a second time :)
07:59:02 <TrueBrain> I was wondering why my smoketest was failing heavily .. :D
08:00:26 <Gustavo6046> if I have a bus or truck station as a long line, buses/trucks will often wait after loading till the one at the front starts going
08:00:27 <TrueBrain> but the STUN and TURN server were like: LALALALA, I don't hear you!!! :D
08:00:59 <Gustavo6046> eventually the bus/truck waiting will be at the middle
08:01:36 <Gustavo6046> then the ones at the start
08:01:38 <Gustavo6046> and those coming in will have to wait, possibly blocking road as they do
08:02:06 <Gustavo6046> even though their orders tell them to wait at the end, because there is never a path to the very end, even if it's just one truck waiting in the middle or start
08:02:56 <Gustavo6046> until the one at the start moves away, then if if manages to leave the station before the next one arrives, the next one will finally be able to wait at the end, as all things should be.
08:03:03 <Gustavo6046> if not, it'll just wait somewhere in the middle again!
08:03:12 <Gustavo6046> so maybe a line of stations isn't the best way
08:03:42 <Gustavo6046> presumably two less long (but still like 3 or 4 tiles long) parallel lines would half this problem as there would always be two ways to go to (or near) the end
08:04:14 <Gustavo6046> but the issue would stlil remain if at least two road vehicles wait at the same time across both stations
08:05:35 <Gustavo6046> although it'd be less likely to actually persist since the inflow of cars would be able to pick the line with the least waiting vehicles each time it found somewhere to park, so from the perspective of each line the inflow would be in half
08:06:22 <Gustavo6046> but then again, so would be the outflow, as the incoming cargo would simply be split between both, alternating between the first-in vehicle in line 1, then line 2, then 1 then 2 then 1 then 2 then so and so and so and so and aaaaaaaugh! I wanna pull my hairs off! I can't work this out!
08:06:29 <Gustavo6046> Maybe you guys already know the answer!
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08:11:24 <_dp_> Gustavo6046, you just need enough space before the station for them to wait
08:11:43 <_dp_> yes, they load in waves but it's still faster than anything else afaik
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08:12:52 <Gustavo6046> _dp_: I get what you mean, but it seems like having them be able to reach the end (assuming that, at all times, the amount of station space occupied is below 100%) seems impossible. It bothers me. Then again I guess you're right.
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08:13:14 <Gustavo6046> And, what about the extra distance they have to cover once they reach the other end? Maybe I just connect a road perpendicular to this station?
08:13:35 <Gustavo6046> Or add two roads, one plugged to each end of the station, then to each of the other
08:13:36 <_dp_> Gustavo6046, yeah, they can't overtake on stations and can't back up to that free space either
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08:28:23 <TrueBrain> okay, all green on smoketest again, pfew :) That was a weird boo-boo :D
08:36:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #9494: Fix #9492: show for what server a relay session is being created https://git.io/J03e8
08:36:58 <TrueBrain> funny how of little importance the "invite code" is for the network protocol :) Took a bit of effort to get the information in the place it had to go :P
08:40:06 <LordAro> hang on, so does this mean that if there are multiple TURN-only servers, you would end up with a relay session (and a new message) for each one ?
08:40:11 <LordAro> that seems... suboptimal
08:40:43 <LordAro> oh wait, no, this is just for all previously-connected-to servers, right?
08:41:45 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #9495: Fix #9491: reword "no connection" error message https://git.io/J03ff
08:42:10 <TrueBrain> LordAro: the whole window is of course a nag-screen.
08:43:14 <TrueBrain> oof, forgot that GitHub linked commits to issues, instead of PRs
08:43:16 <TrueBrain> I find that so annoying
08:43:49 <TrueBrain> now to find who the fuck closes the multiplayer window at the weirdest moments
08:44:03 <TrueBrain> "_switch_mode = SM_MENU;"
08:46:34 <TrueBrain> you have no idea how many times I misspelled that word ...
08:46:37 <TrueBrain> will fix in a sec, tnx Heiki :)
08:50:24 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain opened pull request #9496: Fix: typo in the word "spectator" (tnx Heiki) https://git.io/J03UD
08:56:47 <TrueBrain> okay, fixing that switch-mode is not in the realm of possibilities for me today :D Lolz .. that is a deeeeeep rabbithole
08:57:32 <TrueBrain> all 3 PRs are like: I have no clue what this does for eints :D
08:57:40 <TrueBrain> I know frosch keeps telling me the rules, and I notice I keep forgetting them :P
08:57:46 <LordAro> really should work that out and document it somewhere :p
08:57:51 <LordAro> probably in the PR template
08:57:59 <TrueBrain> work what out, sorry?
08:58:10 <LordAro> what to do when modifying strings :p
08:58:22 <TrueBrain> wow, your reply was so quick, I didn't expect it to be a reply on my lines
08:58:37 <LordAro> it was a whole 14 seconds!
08:58:38 <TrueBrain> and yeah ... I guess one of us should
08:58:48 <TrueBrain> as I guess none of us really knows :D
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08:59:15 <TrueBrain> so I choose to read "I" in front of your "really should work that out" sentence, and await the result :D
08:59:46 <TrueBrain> right, that was what I could contribute today. The "full server" problem is nasty to resolve
08:59:58 <TrueBrain> we basically hardcoded at the start of the connection that there is a client-slow available
09:00:09 <TrueBrain> so hopefully someone else is going to dive into that soon :)
09:00:29 <TrueBrain> I still think we should release beta2 asap, with the stuff we have now, but in the end, one of you guys also has to agree on that :D
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09:09:20 <Gustavo6046> I tried doing freight aircraft lines
09:09:24 <Gustavo6046> look at those numbers
09:11:00 <Gustavo6046> It might be because all the airplanes refit then "bring something back" (of a different cargo type), even though in the return trip they don't wait for a full load.
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09:23:59 <TrueBrain> almost forgot to press that button .. oops
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09:51:28 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #9496: Fix: typo in the word "spectator" (tnx Heiki) https://git.io/J03CG
09:52:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #9495: Fix #9491: reword "no connection" error message https://git.io/J03CB
09:57:51 <michi_cc> TrueBrain: I have no clue about the network stuff, so if somebody would tell me that this is all we get for now, I'll happily hit approve somewhere :)
09:59:48 <TrueBrain> sorry, what do you mean, "all we got for now"? In terms of beta2 release?
10:00:21 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #9496: Fix: typo in the word "spectator" (tnx Heiki) https://git.io/J03UD
10:00:40 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #9495: Fix #9491: reword "no connection" error message https://git.io/J03ff
10:00:43 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed issue #9491: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt can timeout with a weird error https://git.io/J0mIJ
10:00:52 <michi_cc> Yes. No clue at all if anything of the open issues really would need to be addressed or not.
10:01:15 <TrueBrain> the "server is full" is annoying, but not as annoying as people being able to remotely deadlock a server
10:01:26 <TrueBrain> and I do not think anyone will dive into it any time soon
10:02:33 <TrueBrain> it mitigates 9492, I think (open for opinions, ofc :D)
10:03:02 <michi_cc> TrueBrain: I only didn't hit approve on that exactly because of the limitation you mentioned (got no clue either :)
10:03:27 <TrueBrain> I think I just remove the old strings .. sad for translators, but at least we know that will work for sure :P
10:04:13 <michi_cc> So if the general opinion is that networking is good enough, I'm quite willing to approve "the" PR tonight.
10:04:19 <TrueBrain> 10-ish already translated .. meh
10:04:35 <TrueBrain> michi_cc: I have not received any breaking errors
10:04:41 <TrueBrain> well, on the GC, but that already has been fixed :P
10:04:53 <TrueBrain> that ofc doesn't mean there aren't any
10:05:45 <TrueBrain> or, we can merge 9494, and run eints to see what it does ..
10:05:50 <TrueBrain> if it breaks, we can make a PR to remove the broken strings?
10:06:03 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #9494: Fix #9492: show for what server a relay session is being created https://git.io/J0347
10:06:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #9494: Fix #9492: show for what server a relay session is being created https://git.io/J03e8
10:06:20 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain closed issue #9492: [Bug]: "Use relay?" prompt pops out for no apparent reason. https://git.io/J0m3k
10:08:44 <TrueBrain> does any of these fixes need mentioning in the changelog I wonder ..
10:08:53 <TrueBrain> they are more in the world of polishing
10:10:30 <michi_cc> Maybe just one entry like: "Improved wording of network-related messages"?
10:11:58 <TrueBrain> the "no connection" error has bugged me for so long .. happy there was finally a good reason to change it :D
10:13:20 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
10:13:36 <TrueBrain> okay, eints removed the strings
10:14:06 <TrueBrain> happy it is "doing the right thing" :D
10:51:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep opened pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J03Fe
10:53:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J03Nt
10:59:17 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc commented on pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J0sek
10:59:50 <glx> As I understand it, when you commit any change to english.txt, manually triggering eints is required for the changes appear
11:00:53 <michi_cc> Really? Or only if you don't want to wait till the next scheduled run?
11:01:07 <glx> And eints will then remove/rename
11:01:24 <glx> Yes the next schedule will do it to
11:02:53 <TrueBrain> glx: in this case it was more a question of: does it notice I added a {RAW_STRING} and does it invalidate correctly :)
11:02:59 <TrueBrain> but the answer appears to be: yes, yes it does
11:04:10 <TrueBrain> too used to WT2 and WT3 which didn't :P
11:06:40 <LordAro> how long has eints been used now? :p
11:07:06 <TrueBrain> like you knew the answer :P
11:07:35 <TrueBrain> at least I have an excuse: I didn't do any C++ development for years; how about yours? :D :D :D
11:08:38 <LordAro> eints isn't C++ and i've had very little involvement in the project :p
11:09:52 <TrueBrain> you only interact with eints when doing C++ work, is what I meant of course :P You silly :)
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11:40:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep dismissed a review for pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J03Nt
11:40:07 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep updated pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J03Fe
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11:57:53 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] J0anJosep opened pull request #9498: Fix a18188a: "Meaningful" is misspelled in landscape grid documentation. https://git.io/J0Gcl
11:59:35 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain approved pull request #9498: Fix a18188a: "Meaningful" is misspelled in landscape grid documentation. https://git.io/J0G8p
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12:15:05 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #9498: Fix a18188a: "Meaningful" is misspelled in landscape grid documentation. https://git.io/J0Gcl
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12:24:46 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J0ZcT
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12:33:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #9497: Fix 659989af45: Set appropriate town window dirty when building/removing airports. https://git.io/J03Fe
12:39:32 <peter1138> Urgh, when someone video calls you and expects you to be reading the email they just sent.
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15:06:43 <Samu> i updated visual studio and now im unable to select a startup item
15:17:00 <Samu> stupid visual studio, sometimes it sucks
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15:29:38 <Samu> i tried to generate the configurations again but the targets are still empty
15:29:50 <Samu> select startup item still empty
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15:40:14 <glx> under project menu, you can delete cmake cache
15:58:15 <Samu> Delete Cache is grayed out
15:59:18 <glx> seems cache generation is not really finished
16:00:14 <Samu> really? i went to eat these last 20 minutes
16:00:26 <Samu> left visual studio open, didn't seem to be doing anything
16:01:09 <Samu> C++ IntelliSense information will refresh after gathering information from CMake. Cancel - Settings
16:04:31 <glx> ahah I have the same after updating, I should be on x64-debug (as selected in msvc), but cmake ran for arm64 (I have more than 10 cmake configurations)
16:05:09 <Samu> so, microsoft screwed up
16:05:37 <Samu> i clicked Cancel, nothing happens
16:06:01 <glx> yeah seems they manage to break cmake support in 16.11.1, 16.11.0 worked fine
16:06:25 <michi_cc> Well, now I know why I always let cmake generate the solution for me :D
16:11:15 <Samu> im doing a Repair Visual studio
16:12:14 <Samu> or maybe i'll just download visual studio 2022
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16:17:11 <Samu> "C++ IntelliSense information will refresh after gathering information from CMake. Cancel - Settings " this message is stuck
16:17:25 <Samu> after a repair, still stuck
16:17:48 <glx> yes it's a bug in 16.11.1 so repairing won't fix it
16:19:07 <Samu> ok, will wait for a fix then
16:19:40 <Samu> if it still doesn't get fixed, i'll try vs2022
16:27:21 <Samu> wow, my ai works on 12.0
16:27:55 <glx> it's just a promoted nightly :)
16:28:00 <LordAro> were you expecting it not to?
16:28:34 <Samu> it is using some api functions that were merged just last week
16:28:53 <glx> yes, as said it's a promoted nightly
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17:00:09 <Samu> ppl join my game but get general timeout
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17:07:52 <Samu> can i make a request? when i create a server, i should be put into spectator
17:09:27 <glx> create a dedicated server then
17:09:38 <Samu> ...and show up the Online Players window
17:09:56 <glx> when creating a non dedicated you are expected to want to play
17:11:37 <Samu> doesn't do the same as join server
17:15:20 <glx> haha drop message in your screeshot are funny, string parameters are not replaced
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17:46:14 <Samu> the Alex client seems to be playing without connection issues now
17:47:02 <Gustavo6046> Vomiting trees always works :D
17:50:20 <Samu> ai/game script debug is available in multiplayer?
17:50:56 <Samu> if some AI uses Break, it will pause for everyone, seems bad
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18:53:05 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nchappe opened pull request #9499: Fix 2f9c48b: [Linkgraph] Delete links served only by stopped or crashed vehicles https://git.io/J0uol
18:53:49 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators)
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19:13:57 <Samu> strange, in multiplayer, AIs look as if they're idle for long periods
19:16:13 <Samu> hmm, need to test this in singleplayer
19:16:31 <Samu> there's something strange with my AI, idling for too long
19:20:23 <Samu> it's something in the aircraft code that's taking too much time, I wonder what
19:40:37 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc commented on pull request #9499: Fix 2f9c48b: [Linkgraph] Delete links served only by stopped or crashed vehicles https://git.io/J0zBK
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