IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2021-08-08
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03:26:50 <Gustavo6046> Also, how about being able to plant trees diagonally? Since that's the shape of most local authorities (by the very nature of capped Voronoi floodfilling) anyway.
03:34:18 <Gustavo6046> Also, do hotels make more people if you feed them food and alcohol?
03:34:37 <Gustavo6046> Hotels, making more people if you give them alcohol?... I mean...
03:34:45 <Gustavo6046> Ehh, I'll just not think too hard about it. Game logic! :D
03:34:54 <Gustavo6046> (if it did happen)
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06:03:23 <LordAro> Gustavo6046: you should be able to fill diagonally by holding ctrl
06:03:31 <LordAro> most fill operations work like that
06:09:12 <Gustavo6046> LordAro: I am aware, but foresting does not include that feature
06:09:49 <Gustavo6046> Maybe it's just a different fill operation implementation for some reason
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06:56:57 <LordAro> Gustavo6046: mm, feels like an issue that it doesn't do that
06:58:06 <Gustavo6046> LordAro: i think it's because it acts on whole squares
06:58:15 <Gustavo6046> the other filling operations (like terrain ones) operate on corners
06:58:57 <LordAro> i'm sure you can do diagonal for demolision
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08:36:07 <peter1138> Yesterday was okay, today is ... wet.
08:39:08 <Eddi|zuHause> some people might think wet is good
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12:02:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/BaNaNaS] TrueBrain opened pull request #102: Fix: [Actions] "aws lambda invoke" times out before the Lambda does https://git.io/JR4Op
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12:08:19 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/BaNaNaS] TrueBrain merged pull request #102: Fix: [Actions] "aws lambda invoke" times out before the Lambda does https://git.io/JR4Op
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12:11:20 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: TrueBrain
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12:44:42 <Samu> what's the screenshot hotkey?
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13:24:41 <glx> logs are so useless today
13:27:02 <TrueBrain> wauw, thjat is impressive
13:27:55 <TrueBrain> this netsplit was a bit weird, honestly
13:28:12 <TrueBrain> as I saw DorpsGek talking, but he didn't see me talking
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13:37:16 <andythenorth> can industry names be pluralised using string codes?
13:37:31 <andythenorth> e.g. "1 Builders Yard" -> "2 Builders Yards"
13:39:15 <andythenorth> goes it reimplement grf in javascript?
13:40:28 <TrueBrain> owh, I know why I could see DorpsGek, but he couldn't see me .. that is the Matrix bridge being a nice boy :)
13:40:36 <TrueBrain> some Matrix users were on one side of the netsplit, some on the other side
13:40:43 <TrueBrain> so on Matrix, you saw both sides of the conversation
13:41:12 <TrueBrain> it was a bit confusing why DorpsGek refused to listen to me :P
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16:25:33 <TrueBrain> lot nicer than yesterdays
16:26:20 <andythenorth> yeah, but all this metadata crap
16:26:27 <andythenorth> is potentially making it worse
16:26:36 <andythenorth> does it look like the goal is please ALL industries?
16:26:43 <andythenorth> cos that's not the goal :|
16:26:53 * andythenorth goes it throw out metadata crap
16:27:35 <TrueBrain> so if I understand you correctly, you want that the player satisfies some industries, but not all
16:27:44 <TrueBrain> I am still missing what the amount of a single industry does, how it influences it
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16:27:56 <TrueBrain> can I have 20 power plants in 1 town, and nothing else
16:28:29 <andythenorth> but you might only need 4
16:28:36 <andythenorth> depends on population and crap
16:28:41 <andythenorth> I think I have the wrong metadata
16:28:47 <andythenorth> the missing part of the story is 'why?'
16:28:57 <TrueBrain> for me it is: what does it influence?
16:29:43 <TrueBrain> Power Plant: contributes 4% to living standard
16:30:25 <TrueBrain> dunno, I am not sure what you want to do mechanic wise
16:31:08 <andythenorth> pleasing e.g. 1 industry gives x% of standard of living
16:31:09 <glx> I still thinks it's a GS job
16:31:22 <andythenorth> if it is, please explain how
16:31:40 <andythenorth> I proposed doing this in GS and I was explained computer science
16:31:44 <TrueBrain> I think it is a rather irrelevant discussion who should be in charge; rather what you want, and how to get there :D
16:32:11 <TrueBrain> andythenorth: so you do need to do like 3 different types of industries to get 100%?
16:32:23 <andythenorth> TrueBrain depends on population I think
16:32:26 <andythenorth> this needs testing
16:32:36 <andythenorth> I might have bikeshedded words enough
16:32:50 <andythenorth> satisfy, like a sastuma
16:32:52 <glx> but if you manage to handle that in newgrf it's good
16:32:55 <TrueBrain> if you don't know how you want the mechanics to be, it is hard to make words for it :)
16:32:57 <andythenorth> but not a satsaphone
16:33:18 <TrueBrain> so yeah, first try out some forms of mechanics, and make words about it after :P
16:33:21 <andythenorth> well yes, but I've found that design works the opposite
16:33:31 <andythenorth> if the words can't make sense, it's not a valid mechanic
16:33:39 <andythenorth> anyway onwards :D
16:33:42 <TrueBrain> its a chicken/egg problem :P
16:34:22 <glx> just hide important info in small lines of your description
16:34:29 <andythenorth> I was going to do like arbitrary 'living standard points'
16:34:37 <andythenorth> then each industry might do say 4 points
16:34:45 <andythenorth> and the number of points needed increases with population
16:34:52 <TrueBrain> that is what a lot of games do
16:34:55 <andythenorth> but points seems more confusing than %
16:34:58 <TrueBrain> so that will make sense to a lot of people
16:35:02 <andythenorth> maybe points are fine
16:35:14 <andythenorth> % is unitless, which is appealing
16:35:22 <andythenorth> but harder to explain the actual maths
16:35:32 <TrueBrain> 2TallTyler is trying the same approach, in a way .. you are both trying to add additional resources to a game that doesn't facilitate it :)
16:35:41 <andythenorth> and the % from each industry would annoyingly change as population increases
16:35:45 <glx> points or % are fine, as long as it's clear how a small change in satisfied industries affects it
16:36:01 <andythenorth> we are also both trying to control town growth from grf
16:36:14 <andythenorth> which is only possibly by over-riding every single town building and adding a callback to it
16:36:21 <andythenorth> I have to do that for all base set buildings next
16:36:26 <andythenorth> I am hoping I can automate it somehow
16:36:27 <TrueBrain> Town has 2 / 4 satisfactory points; cannot grow further
16:36:34 <TrueBrain> Power Plant: contributing 2 points
16:36:38 <glx> yeah and grf are not intended for town growth control
16:36:46 <andythenorth> well it was specced
16:36:50 <andythenorth> then it was deleted because GS
16:36:54 <glx> you can end up fighting with GS
16:37:23 <TrueBrain> and put on each industry why they are or aren't contributing points
16:37:31 <TrueBrain> Power Plant isn't receiving coal, and as such not contributing points
16:37:32 <andythenorth> ok let's try points
16:37:37 <TrueBrain> that would make total sense to me, honestly
16:37:41 <TrueBrain> better than % indeed
16:37:52 <TrueBrain> as I understand if the 2 / 4 becomes 4 / 6, because the town grew bigger
16:37:59 <TrueBrain> I wouldn't understand 100% going to 60% :P
16:39:00 <TrueBrain> "Town has 2 out of 4 points needed to grow" :P
16:39:16 <glx> like noise thing for airports
16:39:34 <TrueBrain> "Town has 2 out of 4 QoL points; growing halted"
16:39:38 <TrueBrain> also weird, but meh, you figure it out :P :P
16:42:08 <andythenorth> "Earn standard-of-living points by satisfying local tertiary industries'
16:42:15 <andythenorth> how about I just call it "gems" and be done with it
16:42:24 <andythenorth> "Earn 4 gems for delivering beer"
16:43:12 <TrueBrain> Looks a lot better, points
16:43:32 <TrueBrain> But yeah, you need to name this resource :)
16:44:02 <TrueBrain> Or, make it overly complex, and make it 2/4 food, 1/1 beer, etc :p
16:44:37 <andythenorth> growpoints could be a winner
17:01:58 <glx> after looking at steam forums, I wonder how achievements could work for an open source game, anyone could just modify the source to unlock them
17:02:25 <Rubidium> just add one achievement... hacking ;)
17:02:47 <Rubidium> only way to unlock it... by modifying the source
17:04:19 <michi_cc> In this sense they don't work for closed-source games either, for almost any game that allows code mods, there are mods to enable/get all achievements.
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17:14:57 <Timberwolf> Stanley Parable had an achievement where the method to gain it changed every time someone uncovered it, iirc.
17:15:23 <Timberwolf> Which involved doing weird things like changing values in config files using a text editor.
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20:09:55 <Samu> I am finalizing migration of my ais' aircraft code to the new code structure
20:10:26 <Samu> now I'm comparing the performance of old vs new
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20:24:17 <Samu> the old code was WrightAI based with heavy modifications
20:24:37 <Samu> it was becoming a big mess
20:25:28 <Samu> the new code is actually LuDi's structure, based on how he had it for his road vehicles
20:26:56 <Samu> split into several classes
20:27:24 <Samu> each route is manageable and structured
20:28:13 <Samu> i had to rebuild lists over lists over lists based on each aircraft orders
20:28:28 <Samu> and that's where the cpu spikes were originating from
20:35:24 <Samu> ultimately, I will attempt to get rid of WrightAI code alltogether, but I still rely on some functions in there
20:36:05 <Samu> i may migrate some functions to Utils
20:36:27 <Samu> undecided how to clean up this yet
20:38:00 <Samu> there are still some peculiar features of the old code that I can't migrate too well to the new code
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