IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2020-09-09
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13:08:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-api] FilmBoy84 commented on issue #59: Base-music tarballs created are incompatible with OpenTTD client https://git.io/JJuy0
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15:18:45 <Timberwolf> andythenorth: That whole series was so well observed. Even the incidental props like the Look Around You textbook were exactly right.
15:20:07 <andythenorth> I don't remember ever watching Look Around You though
15:23:52 <Timberwolf> Do they still have the old public information films in schools, or did someone realise that showing something like "Apaches" to 6 year old children is a bit on the strong side?
16:12:01 <andythenorth> we had one about not playing on the pit tips
16:12:14 <andythenorth> and they used to send a train driver round to talk to us about not playing on the train lines
16:12:22 <andythenorth> with graphic stories of running someone over
16:17:03 <FLHerne> Hm, I'm sure there was another bit
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19:26:19 <andythenorth> I read an interesting forest management post
19:26:25 <andythenorth> might be nonsense
19:26:49 <andythenorth> but analyses the lack of natural burning in California in the last ~100 years due to human fire suppression
19:26:56 <andythenorth> and the resulting fuel load that has stockpiled
19:27:13 <andythenorth> and the fire-suppression-contractor business in CA
20:13:30 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: "man's very existence is linked to the white element"... maybe they're gonna want to redo that sencence? :p
20:18:07 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i'm not convinced i'm learning anything from that video
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20:24:54 <andythenorth> you are doing it correctly
20:28:28 <Eddi|zuHause> well, they did mispronounce "milchig"
20:30:26 <Eddi|zuHause> i like the "can you guess <X>? [small pause] Correct." thing, which nobody viewing can possibly be correct about :p
20:34:26 <Eddi|zuHause> also, that probably 30-something year old guy posing as a student. :)
20:36:35 <supermop_Home> hi andythenorth
20:38:13 <TrueBrain> frosch123: would you be able to look over the bugs_in_prod branches of yesterday, so I can move the new master-server to production for testing tomorrow? :D
20:38:35 <supermop_Home> andythenorth there's at least one kind of bunk climatologist post making the rounds lately on that, if that's the one you're talking about
20:38:37 <TrueBrain> s/production/pre-production/ :)
20:39:35 <andythenorth> supermop_Home this was from a forest manager advocating that CA forests naturally burnt on an annual basis
20:39:43 <andythenorth> and that we have suppressed that
20:39:50 <andythenorth> and we're not practicing controlled burn
20:40:02 <supermop_Home> wondering - hinoki soap smells good, but kind of like creosote... can you make anti-inflamatories out of pine tar/creosote? or does it have to be coal?
20:40:22 <andythenorth> there is a lot on wikipedia about creosote / tar
20:40:29 <andythenorth> I read it for FIRS, but I forget the details
20:40:39 <TrueBrain> owh, wait, that BaNaNaS PR I can overrule, w00p, good enough :)
20:40:41 <supermop_Home> i want my fancy artisanal hinoki acetaminophen
20:41:07 <frosch123> TrueBrain: just curious, did you reupload the tarball?
20:41:11 <frosch123> or did the author do that
20:41:37 <TrueBrain> I created the tarball on my local machine by running a dev-version of BaNaNaS, and overwrote the S3 file
20:41:42 <TrueBrain> I forgot the filesize was slightly bigger :P
20:41:56 <TrueBrain> ty kind frosch123 :)
20:41:57 <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_Home: it's organic chemistry. you can transform everything to everything, it's just carbon and hydrogen in various structures, sprinkled in with a bit of oxygen and nitrogen
20:42:06 <supermop_Home> Neutrogena makes a coal tar dandruff shampoo.... i feel like that would sell a lot better if it was 'pine extract' or whatever
20:42:30 <TrueBrain> I am about to reply to him about it, so no :P
20:42:38 <TrueBrain> there is a reason why I was doing this ;)
20:42:57 <andythenorth> organic chemistry is nuts
20:43:20 <andythenorth> I really didn't understand the extent that we can A <-> B <-> C in industrial processes
20:43:36 <andythenorth> as long as we have catalysts and energy
20:43:58 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/master-server] frosch123 approved pull request #4: Several bugs found while bringing this to production https://git.io/JUc7N
20:44:16 <frosch123> i think i already looked at that the other day... and forgot to press the approve button :p
20:44:26 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-api] TrueBrain commented on issue #59: Base-music tarballs created are incompatible with OpenTTD client https://git.io/JJuy0
20:44:33 <frosch123> or you had a very similar PR in some other repo
20:44:42 <TrueBrain> master-server-web has one too :D
20:48:44 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/master-server-web] frosch123 commented on pull request #5: Several bugs found while bringing this to production https://git.io/JUc5k
20:49:39 <TrueBrain> frosch123: in this case I used "None", as "filter" can never be None if the function was called via Flask
20:49:48 <TrueBrain> it can only be None if it is called via the other function
20:49:58 <TrueBrain> but I can split it in a new function, and call that from both
20:50:11 <frosch123> what does flask for "/listing/" ?
20:50:26 <frosch123> is it servers_all, servers("") or 404?
20:51:15 <TrueBrain> but in my new code it will list all :P
20:51:52 <frosch123> sure, but some places test for " != None", while other just do the bool test
20:52:34 <frosch123> or "== None" in one place even
20:52:58 <frosch123> does jinja compare with None?
20:53:01 <TrueBrain> ah, no /listing/ gives a 404
20:53:04 <TrueBrain> Flask is rather strict it seems :)
20:53:32 <TrueBrain> "== None" is because Jinja is odd .. but I am going to remove the Nones :)
20:53:52 <frosch123> i would have expected the "", not the 404 :)
20:54:51 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/master-server-web] TrueBrain updated pull request #5: Several bugs found while bringing this to production https://git.io/JUn7G
20:55:04 <TrueBrain> there, that should be a bit more clean
20:55:31 <TrueBrain> it was indeed a bit messy :)
20:57:08 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/master-server-web] frosch123 approved pull request #5: Several bugs found while bringing this to production https://git.io/JUc5l
20:57:27 <TrueBrain> ty frosch123 , much appreciated! Going to merge them tomorrow if I enabled auto-deployments on them :)
20:57:55 <TrueBrain> I am going to be so happy if I can disable the old master-server .. means only very minor things are running on the old old old VM :)
20:58:03 <TrueBrain> which are easy to migrate away :)
20:58:29 <TrueBrain> with its last entry from 2013 ..
20:59:07 <TrueBrain> going to add it to the main website I think
20:59:28 <frosch123> i thought it was already there :o
21:00:04 <TrueBrain> and I think, except for some redirect domains, that is everything there is on the old old old VM .. hmm .. that will be interesting to investigate if that is true :P
21:00:23 <TrueBrain> well, I only have to check the web-server config and the router configuration
21:00:31 <TrueBrain> but I am unsure about all the cronjobs etc etc :P
21:01:15 <frosch123> i guess svn-archive is on the old old vm :p
21:01:26 <TrueBrain> it is .. I just wanted to silently make it die
21:01:36 <TrueBrain> it is now, what, 3 years? since we migrated to GitHub
21:02:03 <frosch123> it's the only place that still has pngcodec :p
21:02:27 <frosch123> and the old old website :p
21:02:44 <TrueBrain> do you want to keep it around?
21:02:51 <TrueBrain> (either of the two, or the svn-archive?)
21:02:56 <frosch123> do you think it can deal with the heat of the fire?
21:03:11 <frosch123> TrueBrain: no. otherwise i would have ported it to git
21:03:20 <TrueBrain> okay, so we burn it with some fire :)
21:03:24 <TrueBrain> I do have backups btw ;)
21:03:35 <TrueBrain> I have backups of really everything :P
21:03:51 <TrueBrain> which reminds me, I should setup an automated off-site (off-AWS) backup for BaNaNaS content
21:03:54 <frosch123> be careful with the backup wifes
21:04:11 <TrueBrain> I don't have a wife, so that solved that issue :D
21:04:26 <TrueBrain> it was a close call, I have to say :P
21:04:48 <TrueBrain> nice troll btw, I have to remember that one :)
21:05:42 <TrueBrain> right, hopefully I can finish that this weekend :D After that .. eints and wiki :P
21:06:27 <TrueBrain> owh, and DorpsGek ! That will be a fun project :D
21:06:33 <frosch123> i should look into eints. next week is cppcon, after the videos are uploaded i will spend too much time watching them :p
21:07:04 <frosch123> did we find anyone who likes ruby yet?
21:07:05 <TrueBrain> the Team repo is ready too; there too I only have to configure GitHub permissions
21:07:22 <TrueBrain> everyone ran away :( You can make an issue out of it on the gollum repo, see if they can help
21:07:45 <frosch123> haha, that's the problem. there are at least 3 repos involved
21:07:58 <frosch123> gollum, github-markup and wikicloth
21:07:59 <TrueBrain> you can always ask them :)
21:08:18 <TrueBrain> at least you know they know Ruby :)
21:08:32 <TrueBrain> and if they want people to use their software, they might help out a bit, even outside the scope of their own code
21:08:32 <frosch123> and for some reason i found no logs or anything, so i only have the top-level "it does not work" :(
21:08:52 <TrueBrain> minimal test setup? And if you describe what you tried, mostly people will feel sorry for you and help :D
21:09:16 <TrueBrain> otherwise, share with us what you are trying and what is failing, maybe one of us can take a look
21:10:21 <TrueBrain> make a nice gist out of your problem description :
21:16:08 <frosch123> that creates a gollum wiki mediawiki support
21:16:22 <TrueBrain> I will check it out tomorrow :)
21:16:32 <frosch123> but it fails for any type of template inclusion, even for templates without parameters
21:16:39 <andythenorth> wiki -> fandom :P
21:16:50 <TrueBrain> an example of that is in there?
21:24:04 <TrueBrain> would you mind adding one? :D
21:24:14 <TrueBrain> as asking me to figure that out ... I am not sure I will ever :P
21:24:24 <TrueBrain> (never did anything with mediawiki)
21:24:33 <TrueBrain> well, install the software, ofc :D
21:31:32 <frosch123> TrueBrain: in addition to that. i already have a bot that crawls the entire current wiki, and converts it into a gollum compatible git repo
21:31:52 <frosch123> it needs some fine tuning and testing whether all the templates work. but the api queries work
21:34:07 <frosch123> TrueBrain: oh, in case you wonder. above docker does not auth stuff. that's yet another plugin/gollum fork, that i did not try yet
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21:40:10 <TrueBrain> I was not :P But tnx :D
21:40:17 <TrueBrain> I will check how rusty my Ruby knowledge is :P
21:51:35 <andythenorth> MDM is so fucked up
21:51:51 <andythenorth> in the name of security, it puts huge back doors into your devices
21:52:18 <andythenorth> and then you have the choice of use the vendor's SaaS in the cloud (yay!)
21:52:29 <andythenorth> or Run It On Premise Because Security
21:52:42 <andythenorth> which will probably get fucked up, and you own yourself
21:53:05 <andythenorth> MDM vendor: remotely observe the screen of any managed device on demand
22:13:19 <andythenorth> oh some of this is quite cool though
22:13:26 <andythenorth> there are some neat BYOD solutions
22:13:37 <andythenorth> or I am falling for vendor marketing
22:36:53 <frosch123> andythenorth: tell your kids to stop emailing info@ottd
22:37:03 <frosch123> "Hey! I've been playing the game for multiple years, and I've really been impressed with your coding for the train pathfinding and signalling. Would it be possible for you to make a version of that for DCC model railroads?"
22:37:45 <andythenorth> well it would be a project
22:38:10 * andythenorth currently reading many enterprise IT security tutorials
22:38:19 <andythenorth> a world I have successfully avoided so far
22:40:08 <frosch123> i think "enterprise linux" means: we use versions that are so old, that we can use the fixes of later versions to list known bugs. a known documented bug is better than a fixed bug or so
22:44:43 <andythenorth> frosch123 I used to use that approach :|
22:44:56 <andythenorth> but now I am contractually obliged to install updates rapidly
22:45:10 <andythenorth> which is somewhat optimistic about the quality of OS and application vendors
22:45:27 <andythenorth> like the Apple OS update that enabled root with no password needed
22:45:37 <TrueBrain> FLHerne: he cheats with IoT, that is unfair!
22:46:16 <frosch123> andythenorth: or the rapid os updates that distributed the rapid intel patches, which bricked the cpus
23:13:05 <FLHerne> "While our app waits for that API response the user is entertained by a spinning beach ball whose movements are simulated by an embedded physics engine compiled to WebASM and rendered using WebGL. Of course there's a fall back to a purely JavaScript and <marquee> based implementation transpiled from ES 6 to something that works on IE11 because that's the majority of our user base."
23:15:15 <andythenorth> I think they missed the opportunity to use animated SVG
23:15:22 <andythenorth> or is marquee doing that?
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