IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2019-02-25
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00:00:42 <glx> ah no changing it doesn't solve so it should be correct
00:01:39 <TrueBrain> glx: still, in src/os/windows/ottdres.rc.in, please use CMAKE_SOURCE_DIR if possible
00:01:52 <TrueBrain> the variable you have there now is not what you should be using in cmake :)
00:02:12 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbgX
00:02:18 <TrueBrain> wrote it down so I don't forget :D
00:02:35 <glx> I used something I found in cache, I'm not a cmake specialist ;)
00:03:40 <TrueBrain> the cmake tutorials are short and often easy to understand
00:03:54 <TrueBrain> but in general, variables starting with 'openttd' are created because the project is called like that
00:03:59 <michi_cc> @topic set 1 1.9.0-beta3, 1.8.0
00:03:59 *** DorpsGek changes topic to "1.9.0-beta3, 1.8.0 | Website: *.openttd.org (source: github, translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only"
00:04:01 <TrueBrain> means that if you rename the project, the variable changes
00:04:09 <TrueBrain> so often it is better to avoid them
00:04:22 <TrueBrain> (and in fact, in 99% of the cases you can :D)
00:04:28 <drac_boy> mmm anyway need to broil some supper so ... have fun
00:04:47 <michi_cc> Somebody else do forum/news post this time. I'm off.
00:05:02 <peter1138> Broil... such an Americanism.
00:05:18 <TrueBrain> website is building as we speak, so I think Azure is doing fine .. it is GitHub that is acting up .. meh
00:07:10 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc
00:07:39 <TrueBrain> so happy with this automation :D
00:08:11 <TrueBrain> glx: don't bother too much with hashes; when we rebase to catch up with master, they will be invalid anyway :P (just as a FYI)
00:08:35 <TrueBrain> but nice work :D happy someone is tackling mingw :D
00:08:55 <TrueBrain> right, off to bed again; night :)
00:08:58 <glx> I have it installed, so not too hard to test
00:10:23 <peter1138> Hmm, how do I get the number of stations in a game?
00:11:12 <peter1138> Station::GetNumItems
00:12:03 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #6931: Change: Prevent town growth from blocking ships https://git.io/fhsRY
00:17:44 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbgp
00:20:03 <Samu> why not multi language names for towns?
00:20:13 <Samu> it's a world, not a country
00:22:32 <Samu> if it runs out of french names, then create towns from some other languague, and if that runs out of languagues, then pick yet another, and so on
00:24:32 <peter1138> nielsm, hmm, don't think it's worth it.
00:25:04 <peter1138> nielsm, in the case when scanning all stations is faster, it's very likely that the performance different is not noticable, because it'll be a tiny game.
00:25:53 <peter1138> it'll be about twice as fast as a map scan.
00:26:20 <peter1138> However in a save like wentbourne, station scan is about 10x slower than map scan.
00:26:33 <peter1138> and in the 50k stations map, station scan is... welll
00:27:24 <peter1138> map scan is slow due to overlapping stations in that save.
00:27:35 <peter1138> but it's still faster than station scan, heh.
00:31:56 <Samu> glx, the nsis installer text is blurry
00:32:08 <Samu> probably high dpi aware stuff
00:32:28 <glx> I don't know if we can do something about that
00:36:38 <Samu> not sure what I'm reading
00:37:11 <glx> yes that's what I'm reading
00:50:06 <peter1138> Ok, that resolves it.
00:59:41 <glx> and of course my nsis install is too old
01:02:43 <peter1138> Yellow plastic shoobedoobe?
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01:03:23 <Samu> will assert at 780 towns
01:04:58 <Samu> gonna move ClearTownVoronoiHold(); to below CommandCost rc = DoCommand(t->xy, t->index, 0, DC_EXEC, CMD_DELETE_TOWN);
01:08:46 <Samu> even if it's a 0 population town
01:09:30 <Samu> or ... try_clear = IsTileOwner(tile, OWNER_TOWN) && ClosestTownFromTile(tile, UINT_MAX) == t;
01:09:37 <Samu> this closesttownfromtile call
01:09:50 <Samu> must call using the old method
01:12:32 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN updated pull request #7235: Change: Non-rectangular sparse station catchment area https://git.io/fh5s1
01:14:37 <LordAro> oh hey, beta3 happened
01:14:51 * LordAro has been busy writing mediawiki plugins
01:14:58 <LordAro> shockingly, they now seem to work
01:18:16 <Samu> was looking at the wrong window
01:19:04 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7235: Change: Non-rectangular sparse station catchment area https://git.io/fhbae
01:19:32 <peter1138> That could've been an interesting desync to find :/
01:20:01 <peter1138> May not have done, mind.
01:20:12 <Samu> better test release build or I'm not finished today
01:22:27 <peter1138> Must remember to actually compile before committing.
01:22:35 <peter1138> It's not quite as bad as the SVN days :D
01:22:55 <LordAro> peter1138: didn't you add `make regression` to your precommit hooks?
01:24:56 <glx> no need to click on install on the last page
01:26:04 <Samu> this is the old one then?
01:26:51 <Samu> redownloading, gotta try again
01:26:56 <glx> it's the same installer version, but not the right exe
01:27:43 <glx> so don't click on "install" ;)
01:29:24 <glx> because it's a build I made, not the same as the compile farm
01:29:25 <peter1138> Because it's just a test of the installer.
01:29:47 <Samu> ok, but i uninstalled the real one :(
01:29:53 <glx> and I can't test dpi locally
01:30:17 <Samu> no more blurr, everything's looking neat now, albeit smaller
01:30:44 <glx> well reinstall the real one, not mine
01:30:56 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN updated pull request #7235: Change: Non-rectangular sparse station catchment area https://git.io/fh5s1
01:31:08 <peter1138> LordAro, I took it out cos it was slow ;(
01:31:16 <peter1138> LordAro, I should at least have it on pre-push hook.
01:34:20 <peter1138> Oh look, Azure blew up again :/
01:36:12 <LordAro> glx: windows -> Windows :>
01:36:35 <Samu> looks like voronoi won't assert, 9000 towns without asserting yet
01:36:36 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN approved pull request #7277: Fix: [windows] make the installer DPI aware https://git.io/fhbam
01:36:54 <peter1138> Better wait for that one to build as well :-)
01:36:57 <Samu> 3500 more towns to go :(
01:37:52 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 dismissed a review for pull request #7277: Fix: [windows] make the installer DPI aware https://git.io/fhbam
01:38:00 <peter1138> That's... quite mad :/
01:38:43 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #7277: Fix: [windows] make the installer DPI aware https://git.io/fhbaO
01:38:44 <peter1138> glx, if you do a "squash and merge" you can edit the commit message (and it includes in the PR# in it)
01:39:33 <glx> ah right, I always forget this option
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02:08:39 <Samu> removing assert, to see the new real time
02:14:07 <peter1138> Compared to... 40 minutes?
02:14:46 <Samu> 46-50, depending on cpu usage
02:15:19 <Samu> let me try kdtree without asserts
02:17:35 <Samu> the assert is gone already?
02:18:29 <peter1138> nielsm's is the preferred solution at this point.
02:18:58 <peter1138> The voronoi one adds a huge chunk of data to the map array.
02:22:46 <Samu> 6 more seconds... voronoi wins
02:24:07 <peter1138> Check the memory usage :-)
02:24:33 <peter1138> Hm, voronoi will add 32MB for that. Not massive, but still.
02:24:40 <glx> 6s diff is nothing on this scale
02:25:08 <peter1138> Yeah, both are way faster than without.
02:27:55 <peter1138> Ok, double click in ottd is a fail, cos the single click even already fired :S
02:28:16 <peter1138> Can't do ctrl-click, cos that is already taken.
02:28:22 <peter1138> It's new button time I think :/
02:29:34 <peter1138> Yeah that's about right, but again, doesn't matter much for that size.
02:29:53 <peter1138> Pretty close to 32MB :-)
02:30:14 <DorpsGek> Samu: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number.
02:36:35 <Samu> 2.742.641 ms for the master, a few hours ago
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02:50:08 <Samu> and all this because I was testing my branch
02:50:37 <Samu> prevent-town-growth-from-blocking-ship
02:51:15 <Samu> i was generating big fat towns with tight water passages
02:51:28 <Samu> to investigate for possible problems
02:53:08 <Samu> actually, the assert test is really useful, gonna try it for this
02:54:44 <peter1138> That test is only useful in the case of changing how calcclosesttown works.
02:54:53 <peter1138> Otherwise it's irrelevant and a waste of your time.
02:55:14 <Samu> i changed GrowingBlocksblalbal
02:55:36 <Samu> let me assert whether it does the same as before
02:55:40 <peter1138> That doesn't change how calcclosesttown works.
03:07:18 <Samu> eww asserted rather quickly
03:07:25 <Samu> maybe 90 deg is enabled...
03:10:41 <Samu> does the same as the old one, provided forbid 90 degrees is disabled
03:10:53 <Samu> i mean just assert tested
03:11:52 <Samu> gonna test yours with an assert
03:12:07 <Samu> since there's no ship depots during world generation, it should not fail, right?
03:17:31 <Samu> bool old = OldGrowingBlocksWaterConnection(tile);
03:17:31 <Samu> bool petern = PeterNGrowingBlocksWaterConnection(tile);
03:42:28 <Samu> corner is only used once
03:42:46 <Samu> TileIndex tile_o = AddTileIndexDiffCWrap(tile, TileIndexDiffCByDir(corner_to_direction[OppositeCorner(GetHighestSlopeCorner(slope))]));
03:45:04 <Samu> you dont need to test if tile_a or tile_b are valid if you only test tile_o
03:45:12 <Samu> let me try make it even simpler
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03:52:38 <Samu> passed the assert tests! :)
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04:52:17 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir
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08:23:27 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on issue #7274: Very long stalls during town generation https://git.io/fhbrE
08:50:41 <andythenorth> beta 3 done then?
08:51:53 <andythenorth> or we do a new post, but I prefer betas all in one post
08:53:35 <LordAro> historically speaking, certainly
08:54:51 * andythenorth looks what changed
08:55:35 <andythenorth> github web UI is piss poor for looking at commits
08:56:04 <andythenorth> I have a work repo viewer configured to show 200 commits in a page :P
08:57:22 <LordAro> andythenorth: luckily there's a collated list of changes in a text file
08:59:13 <andythenorth> shall I do forums?
09:01:50 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7250: K-d tree data structure for spatial lookups https://git.io/fhboJ
09:02:43 <peter1138> Edit the title and bump the post.
09:03:12 <peter1138> Or do a new post. I don't care.
09:03:26 <peter1138> The beta2 post will get buried soon enough.
09:05:38 <LordAro> andythenorth: maybe a link to GH issues?
09:05:58 <LordAro> not that we want to encourage that sort of behaviour :p
09:06:29 <andythenorth> how do we do news posts?
09:06:36 <andythenorth> I'm editing one on the website repo right now :P
09:06:54 <andythenorth> we don't have a suitable branch thouhg
09:08:24 <andythenorth> ah fuck it, I'll do a PR from my repo
09:08:35 <andythenorth> does everyone have to have a fork just to do posts? :P
09:11:17 <andythenorth> commit style will fail :P
09:11:50 <LordAro> wait, does the website have those checks?
09:11:51 <andythenorth> I don't usually use github editing UI, I get confused between commit and PR title
09:12:11 <peter1138> I've locked the beta2 thread.
09:12:19 <andythenorth> dunno, azure is probably stuck
09:12:22 <andythenorth> waiting for login
09:12:27 <andythenorth> oh no, it's running
09:14:09 <andythenorth> then we all move on with our lives
09:14:56 <LordAro> andythenorth: i might suggest that "beta 2" should be "beta2"
09:15:28 <peter1138> Yes, we refered to beta1 and beta2 in the previous post.
09:15:48 <LordAro> also "font size" -> "font scaling", given changing font sise is a different setting
09:15:57 <LordAro> might be more of a changelog thing
09:33:04 <planetmaker> so... I even tagged that in the website repo... when does the website update? :)
10:04:19 <planetmaker> yay, website updated :)
10:04:43 <planetmaker> LordAro, so your next project is "introduce c++20 into OpenTTD code base"? ;)
10:04:48 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7250: K-d tree data structure for spatial lookups https://git.io/fhbox
10:05:40 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
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10:26:48 <peter1138> Oh balls, I broke font-scaling on bitmap fonts now :(
10:27:16 <peter1138> - GfxClearSpriteCache();
10:27:21 <peter1138> ^ needs to go back in. Oops.
10:40:23 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on issue #7062: Ship pathfinders ignore the max order distance https://git.io/fhbKi
10:47:44 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7250: K-d tree data structure for spatial lookups https://git.io/fhbK7
10:52:19 <crem2> Did you know that you have discord server? I just realized. :)
10:53:13 <planetmaker> crem2, as far as I know there's a few discord with OpenTTD theme
10:53:39 <crem2> No, there is an official! :) Hm, why am I 2.
10:53:47 <peter1138> We don't have a discord server.
10:53:54 <peter1138> Discord has Discord servers.
10:54:17 <Eddi|zuHause> do we have an azure cloud server?
10:54:26 <peter1138> You might know this as vendor lock in.
10:54:34 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, nope :(
10:54:38 <Eddi|zuHause> or a github server?
10:55:33 <peter1138> Of course, we don't have an IRC server either, but we easily could.
10:55:37 <Eddi|zuHause> IMHO, the vendor lock-in problem isn't that we don't own the discrod server, but that you can only use it with discord clients
10:55:46 <crem> Ok, I didn't expect that linguistic pedantism is hobby of this channel. :)
10:56:01 <peter1138> It's the Internet, of course it is.
10:56:18 <crem> Do you have a channel on oftc irc network?
10:56:22 <planetmaker> crem, anyway, which discord serverdo you refer to?
10:56:28 <Eddi|zuHause> crem: in my experience, pedantism and railway/transport-nerdism go very well together
10:56:34 <planetmaker> and... you're *in* the IRC channel on oftc
10:56:49 <planetmaker> or we wouldn't be talking right now
10:57:08 <peter1138> planetmaker, he's throwing back the pedanticism at me :-)
10:57:17 <crem> Yeah, but does someone of openttd community "has" it? :)
10:57:38 <peter1138> No, we use it based on the terms of OFTC.
10:57:52 <Eddi|zuHause> someone is listed as "owner" :p
10:58:11 <peter1138> "owner" means "can adminsitrate" in this case.
10:58:32 <peter1138> With IRC, we can easily switch to another IRC server/channel, and everything would be fine.
10:58:39 <peter1138> With discord... well it's discord or discord.
10:58:42 <crem> discord "server" also doesn't mean anything that is traditionally meant by word "server".
10:59:00 <peter1138> So they shouldn't use the term "server" then.
10:59:16 <peter1138> Maybe they don't, even.
10:59:20 <planetmaker> crem, anyway, which discord do you refer to?
10:59:23 <LordAro> interestingly, apparently the channel masters are peter1138, DarkSSH & Bjarni
10:59:26 <LordAro> whoever those guys are
10:59:40 <planetmaker> maybe... peter should add at least one other master
10:59:43 <crem> They do use name "server" for that "group of channels" thingy.
10:59:48 <planetmaker> to increase bus factor
10:59:55 <peter1138> I didn't know I was a master!
11:00:17 <crem> Reddit's /r/openTTD one. I cannot generate the invite link.
11:00:25 <Eddi|zuHause> uhm, there's a step above "master"?
11:01:18 <peter1138> crem, Reddit's /r/openTTD... is not anything to do with us.
11:01:18 <planetmaker> crem, yes, ok. That's ok. They talked to us
11:01:27 <peter1138> So how can that be "our" discord "server"?
11:02:17 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, what's that, and how do I see it?
11:02:22 <crem> There is a channel #development, I thought there's some intersection between you and them. :)
11:02:36 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: dunno
11:02:38 <peter1138> They can develop their own stuff, I'm sure.
11:02:51 <peter1138> Like their stupid rules :D
11:02:55 <crem> Good, leaving that "server" then.
11:03:08 <planetmaker> crem: well... we talked about having an irc 2 discord bridge. It's still somewhat in test phase
11:03:27 <planetmaker> no need to leave that server... they're good guys there and helpful, I guess, too
11:03:28 <peter1138> We're not having an irc 2 discord bridge.
11:03:56 <crem> Bridges are popular but I don't find them that nice. They add lots of noise in text flow.
11:04:13 <peter1138> Quite, the examples that were given were hideous.
11:04:23 <peter1138> And if it happens, I'm out. Again.
11:05:07 <peter1138> Embrace, extend, extinguish, etc...
11:06:01 <planetmaker> you think they can do that?
11:06:21 <peter1138> That happens when people using IRC channels decide to switch to Discord.
11:07:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm almost certainly not following to discord, and i'll probably set the noisy "repeat stuff" bot on ignore
11:07:45 <peter1138> I heard something about them already nerfing bridges.
11:08:30 <planetmaker> I heard / read that they removed the official bridge which used to exist. Not sure it's true, but sure there's no officially supported one
11:08:30 <peter1138> As channel master, I can silence it anyway ;)
11:08:52 <peter1138> (I'm joking, I'm not *that* much of a tyrant.)
11:09:21 <crem> The discord is IRC done right actually. :) Two major drawbacks are closed protocol so that custom clients are not possible, and lost history in various events (left server, discord went bankrupt, server deleted, etc).
11:09:49 <planetmaker> *the* major drawback is the closed protocol
11:09:51 <Eddi|zuHause> how is that "right" in any sense of the word?
11:10:49 <planetmaker> and yes, it looks nicer than IRC. Though IRC can be very appealing in its simple text form. Less clutter. More information density. Easier searched
11:10:50 <peter1138> I bet they still have Discord-Twitch bridging, cos you know, that's not a direct competitor.
11:11:09 <peter1138> Looking nice is a client feature.
11:11:29 <planetmaker> So given the choice, I probably mostly would use IRC. And quite true, peter1138
11:12:27 <peter1138> That fact that many people use text-based clients deliberately says something about the userbase. We don't actually want the fancy web-based shit that Discord is.
11:12:34 <crem> "right" being not missing things when you offline, being able to edit mistakes, being able to have "info" channels (read only with static test), easy way to embed things like images. Also "reactions" are convenient for votings, although usefullness of their primary purpose is questionable.
11:13:16 <crem> Also easy to post code snippets inline.
11:14:39 <crem> But also everyone in one place (whether it's irc or discord) is much better than split with bridge.
11:14:41 <planetmaker> peter1138, *that* is an inference which is not exactly logical. The userbase interested in communication and capable of valuable contributions might be much broader - but is deterred by the lack of "suitable" means
11:15:00 <planetmaker> It's just that *we* are happy to exist in our own bubble, shielded from the rest
11:15:11 <planetmaker> by technical means, so to say
11:16:48 <crem> I also know a few examples of communities who went from irc to discord and active participation went from ~20 people to ~200.
11:17:19 <peter1138> Great, we'd never be able to have coherent conversations.
11:17:24 <planetmaker> it's somewhat the same argument as switching from our own hosted source to hosting it on github
11:17:57 <planetmaker> and our own hosted CI
11:18:43 <peter1138> github is a no brainer, you still have total clones of the repo. Issues/PRs not quite, of course.
11:20:46 <planetmaker> which kinda proves the embrace, extend,... thing right there
11:21:20 <crem> Why is there no open source replacement of discord.. IRC seems to be stuck in 1980s. There are some jabber channels, but all in all jabber was a failure.
11:25:28 <planetmaker> /join #/r/openttd ;)
11:25:43 <Eddi|zuHause> too many slashes :p
11:27:13 <peter1138> I need to find an EBCDIC to ASCII converter...
11:27:34 <peter1138> Not even sure it's EBCDIC.
11:27:43 <Eddi|zuHause> that's just a simple table lookup? can't be that hard
11:28:29 <peter1138> Yes, not that hard, just a bit obsolete.
11:29:33 <peter1138> Fixed width 132 characters, nice.
11:29:52 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds normal for something that uses EBCDIC :p
11:31:34 <peter1138> "Sending data set P.FTP.xxxxxxxxxxx FIXrecfm 132"
11:31:40 <peter1138> Yeah, it even says there.
11:34:33 <_dp_> btw, can discord bridge add some extra ui? like show players and companies connected to openttd server?
11:34:59 <_dp_> having just a repeat bot is kinda boring :(
11:35:06 <LordAro> 10:09:21 < crem> The discord is IRC done right actually.
11:35:09 <Eddi|zuHause> _dp_: if you make an admin port library
11:35:38 <peter1138> _dp_, I ditched the station-scan version of finding nearby stations. It had a flaw :p
11:35:51 <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, yeah, I have admin port (or so) but not sure how to add things to discord
11:36:16 <peter1138> So we now have the relatively fast map-scan, along with cached nearby station lists, and the explicit catchment tiles.
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11:36:29 <Eddi|zuHause> _dp_: you'd have to read up on their protocol
11:37:01 <peter1138> Oh, it was an Azure fail.
11:39:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i should work on something, but i can't get started...
11:40:24 <peter1138> for (Station * const *st_iter = all_stations->Begin(); st_iter != all_stations->End(); ++st_iter) {
11:40:29 <peter1138> Station *st = *st_iter;
11:40:35 <peter1138> for (auto st : *all_stations) {
11:42:28 <_dp_> peter1138, why do you still need stations_near then (for towns)?
11:43:21 <_dp_> peter1138, any instance, if you do tilescan for nearest sations anyway why even bother maintaining that cache?
11:44:00 <peter1138> _dp_, oh! I only do the tilescan when adding buildings or industries.
11:45:57 <peter1138> If we didn't have the nearby list, we'd need to tilescan every time a house tile/industry tile wanted to produce cargo, even if there are no stations around.
11:47:06 <_dp_> peter1138, oh, so you mean it's faster to use in worldgen as area is smaller and slower for cargo production?
11:47:26 <_dp_> peter1138, FindStationsAroundTiles looks like two functions smashed together btw
11:47:30 <peter1138> For world gen I don't do it at all. There's no stations.
11:47:56 <_dp_> peter1138, oh, right, it's !_generating_world...
11:48:03 <_dp_> peter1138, where am I even looking then xD
11:48:10 <peter1138> I dunno what you're asking :D
11:49:11 <peter1138> So FindStationsAroundTiles can use the nearby lists as well.
11:49:54 <_dp_> in MakeTownHouse you added FindStationsAroundTiles, I'm struggling to understand what is it for :)
11:50:47 <peter1138> So if a town expands, that will find any new nearby stations for the town.
11:52:27 <peter1138> So now the map scan is done on tile creation (once) rather than cargo creation (every time)
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11:53:15 <peter1138> Most of the time that scan won't find anything new.
11:53:19 <_dp_> peter1138, yeah, I didn't notice at first that FindStationsAroundTiles outputs into it's second argument
11:54:50 <peter1138> stations = &Industry::GetByTile(location.tile)->stations_near;
11:55:01 <peter1138> That's looking wrong at the moment. Thanks for making me review it.
11:55:21 <_dp_> peter1138, yeah, noticed that too xD
11:55:39 <peter1138> Unnoticed because that case is pretty rare.
11:56:19 <peter1138> Fun fact: Industry::location.tile is not necessarily an industry tile.
11:57:02 <peter1138> I did a TIC/TOC on the 50k stations save.
11:57:30 <_dp_> peter1138, is it just a top tile of a bounding rect?
11:57:45 <peter1138> Yup, and industries aren't square.
11:58:30 <peter1138> I did a TIC/TOC test. In the 50k stations save, the old FOR_ALL_STATIONS scan took... around 1800000 cycles to perform.
11:58:38 <peter1138> The map-scan took 38000 cycles.
11:59:04 <_dp_> peter1138, yeah, I used to know a trick to build ecs mammoth coal mine xD
11:59:19 <peter1138> Yeah, your stations look illegal :p
12:00:05 <peter1138> Map-scan normally takes abour 3500 cycles, but overlapping stations increase that fairly linearly.
12:00:56 <peter1138> In a normal but busy save a FOR_ALL_STATIONS scan took about 9000 cycles, which is not horrendous but still slower.
12:01:42 <_dp_> peter1138, what cycles are you measuring btw?
12:04:52 <_dp_> peter1138, something like rdtsc you mean?
12:05:16 <peter1138> It's good enough for a rough indication.
12:06:09 <_dp_> peter1138, yeah, never actually worked with it but looks like it's good enough
12:28:09 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] auge8472 commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbi0
12:32:35 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Berbe commented on issue #7268: Suggestion: Option not to disclose server information when password-protected https://git.io/fhbiz
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12:35:00 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbig
12:46:12 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Berbe commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbi1
12:56:20 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbi5
13:05:15 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbPq
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13:21:50 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN opened pull request #7278: Fix 195fd0dc60: Sprite cache must still be cleared when using bitmap fonts. https://git.io/fhbP8
13:55:01 <_dp_> when clicking on openttd logo
13:55:43 <peter1138> Hmm, that's an odd place for it to link to :)
13:56:12 <_dp_> servers page seem kinda broken overall
13:57:02 <_dp_> no menu, empty footer, etc.
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14:14:15 <planetmaker> _dp_, you speak of OpenTTD main page?
14:14:52 <planetmaker> or just that sub-page... hm
14:15:57 <peter1138> It's because it's one of the last remaining dynamic pages.
14:17:30 <peter1138> Hmm, removing (error) strings that are referenced in the squirrel API...
14:18:35 <planetmaker> he... 83 clients. 336 servers. Somewhat a mis-match :P
14:19:45 <drac_boy> planetmaker depends .. does "clients" mean hosts too or only non-host players?
14:19:54 <drac_boy> I dunno where it counts from tho so don't ask me :)
14:20:17 <planetmaker> it counts from what the online servers report
14:20:35 <planetmaker> all which are publicly visible, i.e. can be found when ingame searching for servers
14:20:58 <planetmaker> the servers know how many people are playing - which is reported to the master server
14:21:20 <planetmaker> as players want to see the info when joining servers
14:21:22 <drac_boy> mm guess I don't know any better then :)
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14:21:58 <planetmaker> we funnily had yesterday a request that servers don't send those info... kinda stupid
14:22:33 <drac_boy> hmm yeah stupid indeed
14:23:04 <planetmaker> if you want your server stats not being public, it's simple: don't talk to our master server. That's a valid config option you can use as server owner
14:24:05 <drac_boy> theres only one thing I don't like about the multiplayer window but .. umm I dunno how it can be changed tho so .. meh not bothered reporting it :)
14:24:20 <planetmaker> then the answer is of course 'no' ;)
14:25:11 <drac_boy> very funny .. are you the type that prefer to look for servers that have non-vanilla vehicles or not so much?
14:25:50 <planetmaker> it depends very much on the moon phase. Or my mood etc.
14:26:44 <planetmaker> usually I play with some NewGRFs
14:27:10 <planetmaker> which most of the time means vehicle NewGRFs included
14:27:30 <peter1138> Woo, 1.9.0-beta3 now reports as such ;)
14:27:41 <peter1138> And there's one on the server list.
14:27:54 <peter1138> And it's got some weird settings that makes it a bit hard :p
14:28:33 <peter1138> infrastructure costs, disasters, inflation, breakdowns...
14:30:21 <drac_boy> planetmarker nice. so anyway the complain is not being able to find newgrf-only servers after the initial install of various grfs .. and well its been a while ago so I dunno if anything has been altered or not but: why can't the window filter out these non-newgrf that seem to somewhat make a dirty list to trawl through .. I mean exactly how is "lukk trainset" a grf when it seem to have nothing
14:30:23 <peter1138> Should be good for ships, though.
14:30:53 <planetmaker> funny you say that right now when I logged into my server to update it :)
14:32:31 <planetmaker> drac_boy, but... the server listing shows an icon for NewGRFs being used.
14:32:41 <planetmaker> It's nothing you can filter on, though
14:33:19 <planetmaker> and... an empty NewGRF is a NewGRF nonetheless. You cannot join without it
14:33:40 <planetmaker> it is a queer way to make sure that people visit a certain website, I guess
14:34:27 <planetmaker> it's another way to track how many unique clients you have. For instance
14:36:10 <planetmaker> I'd say: that is a problem which is very hard do solve (if at all)
14:36:39 <planetmaker> Should be possible to filter the server list though for certain NewGRFs
14:36:49 <planetmaker> pull-requests welcome :)
14:37:34 <_dp_> drac_boy, luuk trainset adds some locos
14:37:42 <peter1138> Oh, cargo-dist too.
14:40:28 <_dp_> there are some newgrfs that seem empty because for some stuff making newgrf is the only way to configure a server
14:40:38 <drac_boy> planetmaker hmm I was just thinking about you saying 'certain' and I wonder now about a slight wild idea .. optionally 'tag' a grf with one hex number thats only used to sort the multiplayer window .. lets say for example all vehicle grfs uses '1' and infrastructures is '2' so if someone wanted to try find vanilla maps first (no basecost/firs) they can tell the window to filter any post-tagged grfs to exclude such servers
14:41:10 <drac_boy> might not have much uptake tho so :)
14:42:11 <planetmaker> any such categorization of NewGRFs is difficult... both automatic and manual ways have ways to fail
14:42:39 <planetmaker> NewGRFs are too complex to make this easy
14:43:16 <planetmaker> filtering for or filtering out a particular NewGRF (if you know the grfID), is relatively straight forward, though
14:43:52 <planetmaker> basically it's already done to some extend to show you which servers you have matching NewGRFs, which you are missing some (and which you have the wrong OpenTTD version for)
14:51:57 <drac_boy> anyway whats 'new' about disasters/etc? or am I just dreaming? :P
14:52:04 * drac_boy is just wondering about peter's remark
14:52:54 <drac_boy> hi samu, anything new to fix?
15:01:50 <planetmaker> so, peter1138 any wishes on settings and NewGRFs for 1.9.0-beta3 server?
15:05:38 <drac_boy> silly question .. would you not mind seeing random wagons showing up with brakecabs on them or would you had rather liked the grf had a parameter to disable that for your own gameplay preference?
15:06:18 <planetmaker> I would not want a NewGRF with break cabs
15:06:38 <planetmaker> or some which disabled them via parameter, if needed
15:08:41 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhb1a
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15:11:20 * drac_boy goes back to splashing sprites now
15:23:35 <Samu> going to upload v9 of my ai, i nearly forgot about it
15:24:05 <peter1138> Samu, yes but I didn't like it much :p
15:24:17 <peter1138> Samu, I found a case I didn't handle which made me LOL. I don't know if you handle it.
15:24:34 <peter1138> If either of the two adjacent tiles is an actual *river* slope, it would block that...
15:24:50 <peter1138> As there's not track on them.
15:25:04 <peter1138> So the river flowed into the side of a house.
15:25:16 <Samu> ships dont walk on river
15:25:19 <peter1138> That actually doesn't affect you because it's not navigable, but it does in my interpretation of it.
15:25:35 <peter1138> Yeah, I want it to be a "towns don't block rivers" thing.
15:26:02 <peter1138> It looks better though :D
15:27:22 <Samu> or at least I think I see what you mean
15:28:06 <Samu> gonna force a scenario with that
15:28:30 <Samu> but first, let me upload v9
15:28:31 <peter1138> Well, easy to build a river.
15:37:33 <Samu> so, locks are making it hard
15:43:32 <Samu> is this what u meant peter1138 ?
15:43:52 <Samu> lock couldn't be build there anyway
15:46:59 <Samu> I confirm, it also affects mine, but...
15:48:21 <Samu> even if I prevent town from growing in front of a river
15:48:36 <Samu> i wouldn't still be able to build a lock
15:48:44 <Samu> so i dunno what to say in this case
15:49:20 <peter1138> I'd forget about it.
15:49:59 <peter1138> It only applies to my version specifically because of its intention.
15:50:16 <Samu> it happens on my version too
15:50:41 <peter1138> That's up to you if you care.
15:52:32 <Samu> if it's combined with this one, then rivers won't end facing a tile with a corner
15:53:20 <Samu> yep, combining both patches
15:53:56 <peter1138> Ok but I don't think that one is likely either.
15:57:11 <Samu> tile t_dm is enforced to be flat
16:02:33 <Samu> let me see what kind of checks do I do to t_2dm
16:03:37 <Samu> if (IsValidTile(t_2dm)) {
16:03:37 <Samu> if (!IsTileFlat(t_2dm)) return false;
16:05:54 <Samu> both t_dm and t_2dm are forced to be flat
16:06:44 <Samu> means that I'm always ensuring a water connection towards a possible lock tile at the lower part
16:07:07 <Samu> funny that I thought of this already
16:07:30 <Samu> i should haven known that I had taken care of it
16:07:39 <Samu> i keep forgetting things i do
16:09:38 <Samu> with both patches combined
16:09:49 <Samu> the flat tile is fully water
16:09:57 <Samu> no house is ever built there
16:10:22 <Samu> which means, passages is possible if a lock is built afterwards, after town growth
16:19:18 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbDO
16:26:05 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbDC
16:33:00 <Samu> just hide the server from being listed
16:36:08 <Samu> will there ever be a matchmaking system on openttd?
16:37:34 <Samu> fill in your criteria! i wanna join a game with x * y map size, abc landscape, started at max, n years ago, etc...
16:38:16 <Samu> and then master servers points u to the right server for u to join
16:39:21 <nielsm> that's not matchmaking, that's just server filtering
16:40:09 <nielsm> matchmaking would imply multiple players independently indicating wanting to play, a central service collecting those intents, and the central service then provisioning a new server instance for those players to join
16:40:53 <nielsm> and during the game possibly run a GS rating the players' performance and recording that in a ranking system to later set up players with other players of similar skill
16:42:24 <nielsm> and well, with the current number of public servers, it's not difficult to browse them them all manually
16:45:12 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7279: Fix #7062: Remove ship max order distance. https://git.io/fhbDF
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16:47:51 <nielsm> anyone want to join one of the beta3 servers and play the game for a change? :)
16:50:04 * _dp_ wants to set up a beta3 server and forget about this game for a while xD
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16:53:49 * nielsm decides to actually use the danish translation for once and then fix poor strings along the way
17:01:12 <peter1138> Ok, I think I need another bread maker.
17:01:56 <nielsm> actually, I should also not be starting/joining a game right now, my laundry room time is coming up
17:06:33 <nielsm> I tried connecting to the openttdcoop nightly server, and downloading the map timed out...
17:06:47 <nielsm> appears to have crashed now even
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17:28:09 <FLHerne> nielsm: I'd be interested in that sometime, ping me if you start that :-)
17:28:36 <planetmaker> well... an oom crash. So nothing to worry about (here).
17:33:10 <Eddi|zuHause> <nielsm> anyone want to [...] play the game for a change? :) <-- what blasphemy is this? :p
17:33:46 <nielsm> let's save the 4096 maps for when kdtree or similar is in :P
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17:34:21 <Eddi|zuHause> what happened to "don't play more than 1024^2 in MP"?
17:39:25 <Samu> peter1138, there are some ship max order distance ai/gs script functions
17:41:35 <planetmaker> who said 4096² on my servers? :P
17:43:40 <FLHerne> "don't play more than 512^2 at any time" is probably better advice, just from a gameplay standpoint :P
17:43:42 <peter1138> Nice bit of duplication there.
17:46:43 <Samu> /* static */ uint ScriptVehicle::GetMaximumOrderDistance(VehicleID vehicle_id)
17:47:13 <Samu> /* static */ uint ScriptEngine::GetMaximumOrderDistance(EngineID engine_id)
17:48:48 <peter1138> Yes, already go it, thanks.
17:55:56 <_dp_> is it possible to set a max size for the widget?
17:56:19 <_dp_> trying to make new cargo list with scrollbar not show ugly orange empty space
17:57:26 <planetmaker> _dp_, I don't think. And I'm not sure it makes sense for widgets which contain text: translations, font size and GUI settings might change that
17:57:40 <planetmaker> and the required space depending on client-side settings
17:57:54 <peter1138> This would be a number-of-rows limit.
17:58:50 <Eddi|zuHause> you need to handle automatic line breaks then
17:58:59 <peter1138> There's no line breaks.
17:59:30 <_dp_> peter1138, hmm, but it has SetCount(_sorted_standard_cargo_specs_size) already
17:59:31 <Eddi|zuHause> that's not a contradiction :p
17:59:49 <peter1138> _dp_, that sets the capacity of the scrollbar, yes, not the widget-size.
18:00:30 <Samu> what's the opposite of main_track_1 && main_track_2
18:00:53 <Samu> !main_track1 || !_main_track2 ?
18:01:21 <Samu> !(main_track_1 && main_track_2)
18:01:41 <_dp_> so, how to set widget size then?
18:02:03 <Samu> im trying to code peter style
18:03:31 <_dp_> Samu, !a||!b and !(a&&b) are equivalent
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18:04:18 <Eddi|zuHause> DeMorgan to the rescue!
18:16:54 <milek7> vcpkg is some microsoft NIH?
18:18:46 <milek7> why we need another package manager
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18:23:06 <nielsm> can you name a package manager that actually runs in the environment vcpkc does?
18:30:28 <Eddi|zuHause> microsoft is the very definition of NIH?
18:32:55 <planetmaker> "national institute of health" didn't quite fit :P
18:33:14 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean, just look at \ vs /
18:33:31 <Eddi|zuHause> and that was what? 40 years ago?
18:34:21 <nielsm> you know the story behind that is someone at MS demanded that / be the option character for commands and not - and so it could not be the path separator
18:34:25 <milek7> CP/M is probably responsible for \
18:35:00 <nielsm> the earliest dos versions had a config.sys flag to control whether the option character was / or -
18:38:06 <Eddi|zuHause> nielsm: but that is also a form of NIH
18:41:31 <_dp_> and damn scrollbar can't work with non-resizing widgets coz it uses resize_y as row height :(
18:42:04 <peter1138> Well it can, but...
18:42:15 <nielsm> you have to do a bit more on your own
18:42:26 <peter1138> Actually are you sure about that?
18:42:48 <_dp_> peter1138, it crashes when I do SetResize(0, 0) so yeah...
18:42:49 <peter1138> Scrollbars don't have a row height.
18:42:51 <nielsm> the resizing I did in the framerate window manually configures the scrollbar
18:43:08 <milek7> ok, vcpkg looks unique in that all portfiles are in cmake
18:43:10 <nielsm> setting max, visible, and current top
18:43:11 <peter1138> They have a capacity, a row count, and a position.
18:43:22 <milek7> though i think using eg. sh would be more portable with other systems
18:43:48 <nielsm> vcpkg is not intended to be portable, it's intended to work with visual c++
18:43:56 <Eddi|zuHause> milek7: i'm not following your reasoning
18:44:14 <nielsm> unless you argue that microsoft should port cl to non-windows systems as well
18:44:27 <milek7> and it should be aware of pkg-config
18:44:32 <milek7> "Vcpkg helps you manage C and C++ libraries on Windows, Linux and MacOS. "
18:44:36 <milek7> looks like trying to be portable
18:45:10 <peter1138> Could an icon work for "show catchment"?
18:45:16 <peter1138> Or is that too vague? :/
18:45:48 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: got something more specific in mind than "any random icon"?
18:46:07 <peter1138> I'm wondering about just a # sign :p
18:46:20 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think that would work :p
18:46:50 <_dp_> peter1138, it does this->SetCapacity(((int)nwid->current_y - padding) / (int)nwid->resize_y);
18:46:57 <Eddi|zuHause> what size are the toolbar icons? 20x20? 32x32?
18:47:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i think anything below that would be a random character that nobody would associate with "catchment area"
18:47:53 <_dp_> peter1138, so don't have row height but they use resize_y instead
18:48:14 <peter1138> Oh, right, so when you resize it it automatically gets the correct capacity. Sorry.
18:49:32 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, it's not a toolbar icon.
18:49:51 <peter1138> But I can't think of anything that would represent catchment area anyway
18:50:14 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: so size more like the train/truck/whatever icons?
18:50:20 <peter1138> Shift-click on Location button?
18:50:31 <Eddi|zuHause> nobody would ever find that.
18:50:48 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, yeah, that sorta size.
18:51:03 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: maybe a dot with a circle around it? (sorta like a bullseye?)
18:51:50 <_dp_> also crashes with SetResize(0, 1000) btw
18:52:05 <_dp_> so yeah, scrollbars assume a lot about widgets :(
18:55:57 <milek7> eh, it tries to do something obviously windows-specific
18:56:03 <milek7> i'm supposed to if() vcpkg only for windows, and use other dependecies for linux, or what?
18:56:57 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, heh, that actually worked. Switched me to a truefont font, of course :p
18:57:15 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: add the glyph to openttd.grf :)
18:57:29 <peter1138> Yeah, then OpenGFX can have 5 missing sprites :D
18:57:53 <Eddi|zuHause> do we meanwhile use openttd.grf as fallback for missing sprites?
18:58:13 <peter1138> It gives a warning but otherwise seems to work okay.
18:59:01 <Eddi|zuHause> better than having random oversized ? everywhere :p
18:59:43 <peter1138> Way better than the purple/black chequerboard that everything uses these days.
19:01:09 <peter1138> Bottom button row, or top button row (in the caption)?
19:04:59 <peter1138> Hmm, tempting to draw a double-size version while I'm at it :p
19:05:39 <Eddi|zuHause> i feel that might escalate in the wrong direction :p
19:07:54 <peter1138> Well it would show how it's meant to done.
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19:10:38 <peter1138> Can be quite hard to see the overlay...
19:11:05 <Eddi|zuHause> that's what we have the X button for?
19:11:52 <Eddi|zuHause> i should be heading out...
19:14:51 <peter1138> milek7, I was going to say it's only for Windows but apparently you found something that says that's not the case.
19:15:31 <peter1138> Hmm, I guess I can't use U+2299, as then almost no TTF font will work :/
19:15:33 <milek7> it looks that only some packages works on linux
19:15:53 <peter1138> Isn't typeface fallback supposed to be per-glyph?
19:16:45 <Eddi|zuHause> milek7: how is that a problem, we don't really need vcpgk on linux. but we needed soemthing for windows
19:18:11 <milek7> i hoped to use it in other project to get rid of platform if() in cmake
19:18:13 <milek7> but apparently it's not done yet
19:20:22 <Eddi|zuHause> but you could nag them about including the packages that you need, maybe they help you?
19:21:57 <_dp_> ok, I've had enough of scrollbars, so I'll just leave it here and hope someone can make a proper pr like that %)
19:22:32 <Eddi|zuHause> <peter1138> Isn't typeface fallback supposed to be per-glyph? <-- iirc we reject fonts before any fallback can be established. but i have no clue how it actually works
19:23:09 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe we should relax that a bit
19:23:12 <peter1138> _dp_, I gave up trying to make the livery window behave like it used to, and only have a scrollbar in groups view...
19:23:25 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, should do, it's the cause of that "ignoring fonts" "bug"
19:25:09 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain opened pull request #64: Fix 7038a71: link to changelog was incorrectly pointing to the CDN directly https://git.io/fhbQD
19:25:37 <Eddi|zuHause> it might also help if we keep a fallback font around even if people use the sprite font, for when they join servers which have chinese characters in the town names and stuff
19:25:49 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] PeterN approved pull request #64: Fix 7038a71: link to changelog was incorrectly pointing to the CDN directly https://git.io/fhbQS
19:26:18 <peter1138> Oh wow, that does look bad with the supersize GUI :/
19:26:42 <TrueBrain> tnx peter1138; that was quick :D
19:26:54 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: that looks somewhat horrible
19:27:12 <planetmaker> at least the rhs one
19:27:13 <peter1138> planetmaker, oh... sorry!
19:27:25 <peter1138> planetmaker, the button goes in windows, not toolbars.
19:27:42 <_dp_> peter1138, yeah, and that's improved version already
19:27:48 <planetmaker> I probably should have read more than one word :P
19:27:51 <peter1138> So needs to be just black.
19:28:00 <planetmaker> makes it.. easier :)
19:28:21 <planetmaker> but needs another symbol then... station in black only... hm
19:28:59 <peter1138> u2299 looks... okay.
19:29:05 <peter1138> Not quite the right fit, but works for me.
19:29:33 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain merged pull request #64: Fix 7038a71: link to changelog was incorrectly pointing to the CDN directly https://git.io/fhbQD
19:29:40 <peter1138> yeah, those other sprites are text.
19:29:49 <_dp_> hm, just noticed scrollbar is already extending in the master so I ended up doing nothing... great xD
19:29:49 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: well, the train/truck/whatever sprites are also glyphs
19:29:53 <peter1138> This one probably should be because otherwise with the separate gui/font scaling it won't match.
19:30:08 <planetmaker> it needs to be, yes
19:30:36 <planetmaker> though... is the border there, too?
19:30:53 <planetmaker> anyhow... no harm in making it a glyph
19:31:09 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: you mean the resize button?
19:31:21 <Eddi|zuHause> never wondered about that one :)
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19:32:18 <Eddi|zuHause> unrelated: the train/truck/whatever icons could use some vertical centering?
19:33:55 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, can't, it's a glyph.
19:34:32 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: i mean, on widget level, not on sprite level
19:35:04 <peter1138> Text is always drawn from the top.
19:35:06 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas updated pull request #7086: Change #6173: Update SDL driver to use SDL 2.0 https://git.io/fhamZ
19:35:18 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... ok, i see how that might be a problem
19:35:24 <peter1138> Also I'm tempted to revert the gui/font scaling separation, it's causing issues.
19:35:40 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, we'd have to duplicate the sprites to use them as ... sprites.
19:35:58 <peter1138> They're used as text in station signs.
19:36:01 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: that doesn't sound like the right approach
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19:36:42 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: more like the sprite font needs some hinting on what the writing line is, and the font rendering engine needs to take that into account to align it
19:37:33 <_dp_> peter1138, normal size is too small, I'd rather have a slightly ugly game than constantly missing those tiny buttons :(
19:38:04 <_dp_> smth like 1.5x would be perfect actually
19:38:12 <planetmaker> OpenTTD needs font and GUI scaling in non-integer multiples of 1x
19:38:32 <peter1138> Sure but our sprite scaling as no capability for that.
19:38:34 <planetmaker> which actually is 2.25x the area
19:39:02 <_dp_> Eddi|zuHause, dow does that make anything easier? xD
19:40:31 <peter1138> Basically all the power-of-two scaling would have to be replaced.
19:41:08 <peter1138> Of course, at that point, maybe we're doing it at the wrong level.
19:41:26 <peter1138> You get scaling for free with something like OpenGL ;)
19:42:29 <nielsm> okay I'm done with laundry and food, and going to resume playing on #openttdcoop.nightly :)
19:42:51 <_dp_> or we can wait till everyone switches to 4k monitors and problem will solve itself xD
19:44:44 * peter1138 downloads all the NewGRFs...
19:45:09 <peter1138> Mine's the only ipv6 beta3? Hmm.
19:46:22 <peter1138> I'm sure the zoomed-out wind noise is 1) too loud 2) too frequent
19:47:06 <peter1138> Error: Chips custom docks must be loaded after chips station set.
19:47:11 <peter1138> Is that still a thing? o_O
19:47:23 <TrueBrain> really not sure what you are seeing there planetmaker; I don't see anything wrong on the servers site ..
19:47:45 <TrueBrain> but given the description is very short and no screenshots, I had to guess a bit in my reply :D
19:49:05 <_dp_> TrueBrain, servers page is in the menu of openttd.org, looks really weird when you click on it and menu disappears
19:49:45 <TrueBrain> _dp_: ah, is that what was meant. I really did not pick up on that :D
19:49:54 <TrueBrain> such minor additions to issues really help :P
19:50:15 <TrueBrain> but yeah, that is new infrastructure vs old. Not much I want to do about that currently
19:50:29 <TrueBrain> when the MSU moves to the new infrastructure, it should be fixed, I guess
19:50:38 <peter1138> Oh right, cargo-dist is not on :(
19:50:48 <_dp_> TrueBrain, tbh whole page looks broken to me
19:50:58 <peter1138> I can't play without that now, just building random routes and letting it all link up is my style.
19:51:02 <TrueBrain> _dp_: define "broken"
19:51:06 <_dp_> TrueBrain, disappearing menu, empty footer, logo linking non-existing website
19:51:10 <nnyby> also clicking the header of that site takes you to binaries.openttd.org which is kinda empty
19:51:17 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, also a completely empty footer
19:51:18 <TrueBrain> _dp_: footers are empty EVERYWHERE :P
19:51:27 <TrueBrain> so I wonder why only the server page make you see that :D
19:51:41 <TrueBrain> we only removed it on the main page now
19:51:50 <peter1138> Hmm, CHIPS stations are way too manual.
19:51:50 <TrueBrain> also empty footer :D
19:51:51 <_dp_> TrueBrain, footer is fine on openttd.org
19:51:54 <planetmaker> no such separate footer on main, screenshots, developers,...
19:52:08 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: the difference is on subdomain level
19:52:20 <TrueBrain> bananas, security, servers, .. all the old HTML pages have this empty footer
19:52:28 <TrueBrain> www is ported, so we fixed those minor details too :)
19:52:34 <TrueBrain> logo linking non-existing, let me see ..
19:52:51 <TrueBrain> LOL .. where does it redirect to? Lol!
19:52:55 <TrueBrain> see, that is a bug :D
19:53:05 <TrueBrain> what else was there to unfold ..
19:53:12 <TrueBrain> no menu, yeah, new subdomain
19:53:21 <TrueBrain> guess it looks too much the same
19:53:32 <TrueBrain> for me, it is like saying that the menu disappears ifyou go to the wiki :D
19:53:39 <TrueBrain> not sure that is an easy fix ..
19:54:09 <TrueBrain> something simple one can do to make that less weird? (Compare it to clicking on Community)
19:57:18 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas commented on pull request #7254: Codechange: introduce a few unit tests https://git.io/fhb7X
19:59:09 <TrueBrain> and please PLEASE be more descriptive in issues :) This guessing game is fun, but we could do more efficient :P
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20:02:04 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas commented on pull request #7254: Codechange: introduce a few unit tests https://git.io/fhb7N
20:04:45 <TrueBrain> okay, fixed most issues just mentioned
20:08:15 <TrueBrain> and tnx _dp_ , for specifying "broken" :D Let me know if you find more issues!
20:08:21 <TrueBrain> (and also tnx nnyby :))
20:08:32 <Samu> I'm re-re-rewritting prevent town growth from blocking ships a 4th or 5th time
20:09:03 <Samu> can't make it simpler than that
20:10:17 <Samu> comments may need editing
20:12:35 <Samu> passed the assert test, which means it works correctly
20:13:30 <Samu> tile_1, tile_2 don't exist anymore
20:13:39 <Samu> need to comment that out
20:19:33 <Samu> TrackStatusToTrackBits(GetTileTrackStatus(... can be simplified if I can call a function that is on ship_cmd.cpp
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20:27:31 <Beerbelott> Is there a possibility to generate a new game based on a downloaded heightmap on a dedicated server?
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20:37:25 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #6931: Change: Prevent town growth from blocking ships https://git.io/fhsRY
20:42:04 <Samu> you know what? the voronoi "failure" to match master, I've been thinking about it
20:42:29 <Samu> it is deleting the just created town with 0 population
20:43:01 <Samu> removing bridgues requires it to calc the closest town to get who owns it
20:43:34 <Samu> it actually makes sense that it gets the closest town "other than self"
20:44:11 <Samu> it's not a failure, it's actually solving 2 problems in 1 go
20:46:02 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #7278: Fix 195fd0dc60: Sprite cache must still be cleared when using bitmap fonts. https://git.io/fhb5g
20:46:07 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #7278: Fix 195fd0dc60: Sprite cache must still be cleared when using bitmap fonts. https://git.io/fhbP8
21:24:11 <nielsm> a k-d tree is actually not very good at getting the 2nd or 3rd (or nth) nearest, only the absolutely nearest
21:24:34 <nielsm> or "any one approximately nearby" if you use an inaccurate lookup algorithm
21:24:54 <peter1138> I don't think the voronoi map is either?
21:25:03 <nielsm> but then you won't know if what rank it is in distance
21:36:59 <_dp_> k-d can find k-nearest just fine
21:40:48 <nielsm> it can, but eventually it'll just degenerate into an inefficient quicksort
21:41:35 <_dp_> nielsm, well, sure, there is no beating quicksort in sorting
21:43:02 <_dp_> nielsm, when k ~= n there isn't much point talking about k-nearest in general
22:03:03 <_dp_> oh, and I just understood why that voronoi initialization looked wrong
22:03:18 <_dp_> why do all that weird stuff when you can just bfs it in like 5 lines
22:07:13 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbd9
22:26:00 <Samu> the town generator creates towns, and before they're added to voronoi, it is ensured it has more than 0 population
22:26:39 <Samu> the code that deletes 0 population towns will use CalcClosestTown
22:26:51 <Samu> but since this town is not yet on voronoi
22:27:56 <Samu> CalcClosestTown won't see it
22:30:28 <Samu> could kdtree do something similar?
22:31:04 <Samu> or kdtree is not a database?
22:33:36 <_dp_> Samu, I meant BuildVoronoiDiagram and dozen of functions used by it
22:33:50 <_dp_> Samu, town hold is separate issue and can be done with any data structure
22:38:18 <Samu> must investigate how kdtree do its stuff
22:38:50 <nielsm> you should start with the wikipedia page then
22:38:54 <nielsm> if you want to know how it works
22:39:40 <_dp_> didn't read it fully but looks good
22:41:39 <Samu> "That is O(n) complexity."
22:44:18 <_dp_> that's computer science :p
22:44:28 <nielsm> okay, two things: 1) got a desync playing beta3 on the #openttdcoop.nightly server
22:44:47 <nielsm> 2) emergency netsave did not work as intended, it got me a save copy of the title game
22:48:47 <_dp_> oh, it probably loads title game and then saves it
22:49:45 <Samu> that article doesn't tell how are the points added
22:50:22 <peter1138> Maybe I blew up ships :p
22:50:29 <Samu> "How do we split the points?" :|
22:50:48 <Samu> i want an article that goes about "How do we add the points to kdtree"
22:50:54 <nielsm> Samu: the article assumes you know what a binary search tree is and how you construct one
22:51:09 <nielsm> and uses that basis to explain how to construct a multi-dimensional search tree
22:52:06 <peter1138> Probably just the usual NewGRF desyncs though.
22:54:06 <peter1138> LordAro, well... buggy newgrf. Hmm.
22:54:33 <peter1138> It's annoying that that is even possible :(
22:55:42 <_dp_> yeah, how do you even bug a newgrfs to that extent?
22:55:55 <_dp_> shouldn't it run on vm and have same bugs both sides?
22:56:02 <planetmaker> There's FIRS. And IronHorse as the complex ones. Maybe FISH
22:56:36 <planetmaker> I could turn on the desync debugging...
22:56:38 <_dp_> though I remember some bug in cl that crashed ecs
22:56:59 <peter1138> _dp_, usually means some data that gets cached is different depending on circumstances.
22:57:05 <milek7> how are binary releases on mac generally done? (not necessarily about ottd)
22:57:09 <milek7> static linking, or including .so with app, or user installing necessary dependencies?
22:57:48 <peter1138> _dp_, so it's not a crash, but it results in different game-state.
22:57:53 <nielsm> combination of static linking and including non-system shared libraries in the app bundle
22:58:03 <peter1138> Difficult to find because you only have the one state locally.
22:58:23 <_dp_> peter1138, so you mean it's a vm bug basically?
22:58:46 <peter1138> If it was an actual VM, that'd be nice :/
22:59:28 <planetmaker> peter1138, and nielsm you wanna continue on the beta3 server? Then I can enable desync debugging server-side. And we might have the logs tomorrow... heading for bed myself now soonish, though
22:59:32 <nielsm> GRF programming really falls into the "esoteric language" category
22:59:53 <planetmaker> if no-one is going to continue there... I might enable it only tomorrow
23:00:06 <nielsm> I'm going to bed very soon
23:00:15 <peter1138> But yeah, maybe not that much longer.
23:00:22 <peter1138> (When it gets to 2am, I'll change my mind)
23:00:42 <planetmaker> enabling means: save, enable desync debugging, loading the saved game so that initial state is known
23:01:07 <Samu> _town_kdtree.Insert(t->index);
23:01:17 <planetmaker> and spamming the HDD with... loads of logs and saves
23:01:25 <Samu> gonna experiment inserting towns later
23:01:29 <peter1138> planetmaker, have you got space? :D
23:02:56 <planetmaker> 7G space on the VM. Should suffice
23:03:46 <peter1138> Whether it'll help is another matter...
23:04:23 <planetmaker> if it happens quickly, it's possible to replay it. If it takes long... it's a PITA
23:05:07 <planetmaker> nielsm, did you do anything in between to your settings before you re-joined?
23:08:55 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh opened issue #7281: Group selection not enabled in livery window when creating first group https://git.io/fhbbZ
23:11:19 <LordAro> today on "Samu randomly plays with something he doesn't understand"
23:12:08 <Samu> HoldNextAddTownToKdTree();
23:13:25 <Samu> to solve the bridge issue
23:19:40 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on pull request #7254: Codechange: introduce a few unit tests https://git.io/fhbbw
23:24:10 <Samu> windows builds, linux fail
23:25:04 <LordAro> linux errors are a bit unclear
23:25:06 <LordAro> /home/vsts/work/1/s/src/ship.h:61:18: warning: inline function 'GetTileShipTrackStatus' is not defined [-Wundefined-inline]
23:25:20 <LordAro> /home/vsts/work/1/s/src/ship.h:61:18: warning: inline function 'GetTileShipTrackStatus' is not defined [-Wundefined-inline]
23:27:49 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas updated pull request #7086: Change #6173: Update SDL driver to use SDL 2.0 https://git.io/fhamZ
23:27:51 <planetmaker> why do my trains complain that they cannot find a way to a station when they wait in front of it (for longer time, but yes)?
23:28:49 <planetmaker> they should only, if there is no path...
23:28:56 <Samu> how come it's not defined in Linux but it is in Windows?
23:29:04 <peter1138> Train is lost messages?
23:29:14 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on issue #7059: Town name language choice affects number of towns / world population https://git.io/fhbbH
23:31:11 <Eddi|zuHause> time for NoTowns?
23:31:41 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: they turn around at red signal?
23:32:02 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: and because now they're facing a dead end, they throw a message and turn back?
23:33:27 <Eddi|zuHause> (personally, i always disable turning around this way, because it never really solves any problems)
23:33:50 <Eddi|zuHause> (or, the kind of problems that it would solve are not appearing in my network designs anyway)
23:33:53 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #6931: Change: Prevent town growth from blocking ships https://git.io/fhsRY
23:37:49 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #6931: Change: Prevent town growth from blocking ships https://git.io/fhbbh
23:44:58 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, maybe... but it faced still the right direction when I looked
23:45:10 <planetmaker> by default it should be off :)
23:45:37 <Eddi|zuHause> not entirely sure about that...
23:46:23 <planetmaker> openttd defaults... it probably is on
23:46:55 <Eddi|zuHause> also, there might have been changes in that piece of code
23:49:46 <peter1138> There was a timing change.
23:50:42 <peter1138> Maybe it's still not right?
continue to next day ⏵
