IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2018-06-27
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11:51:26 <rima> which room is reddit room?
11:51:30 <peter1138> There's a hole in the ground.
11:53:08 <rima> do you know any other ottd room ?
11:53:24 <peter1138> I don't know the reddit openttd room.
11:53:52 <peter1138> It'll probably tell you on reddit?
11:55:46 <rima> is that a room? or web link? how to join it? im not connecting with a browser
11:56:14 <ST2> here type /join #/r/openttd
11:58:20 <ST2> whatever, type what I said ^^
11:59:47 <rima> idk y im lagging so much inside game
12:10:40 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you've been eaten by a grue
12:11:15 <Eddi|zuHause> rima: i think what you're looking for is #/r/openttd
12:11:56 <andythenorth> what date is the grue?
12:12:49 <andythenorth> tbh, grue and bleen weren't the most interesting things in my philosophy degree
12:12:55 <andythenorth> which wasn't in itself, very interesting
12:13:05 <andythenorth> but possibly they were just badly taught
12:17:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure what the problem is
12:22:36 <andythenorth> that's linguistic philosophy :P
12:23:07 <andythenorth> I don't know if anyone knows what the problem is
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12:59:00 <Eddi|zuHause> if the problem is "how can we be sure about predictions of the future?", then the answer is "we can't"... that's why we have statistics, and why most of the great minds of history were wrong about most things (Aristotle, Freud, ...)
13:00:54 <andythenorth> statistics isn't really valid in philosophical discussions
13:00:59 <andythenorth> "that's just empiricism"
13:01:21 <andythenorth> other things not valid: the scientific method, and all French philosophy ever
13:03:00 <Eddi|zuHause> of course statistics isn't "valid", that's why "we can't"
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13:11:44 <andythenorth> however bayesian statistics are allowed in philosophical discussions
13:12:10 <andythenorth> probably papers can be written about that
13:12:31 <andythenorth> academic undergraduate philosophy is frankly weird
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15:28:14 <Borg> hi.. I got hit by weird issue a min ago..
15:28:19 <Borg> on my long running server..1.8.0
15:28:58 <Borg> I tried to send 2 trains to depot.. small railroad track.. for transfer station for monorail...
15:29:12 <Borg> and... it said it was unable to find route to depot!
15:29:29 <Borg> with is nonsense.. at least 2 path were available to 2 different depots..
15:29:42 <Borg> anyone else noticed such weird situation?
15:29:52 <andythenorth> any signals on the route?
15:30:18 <Borg> one to one depot, none.. to other.. few signals, one-way
15:30:33 <Borg> I boight another train there.. on depot
15:30:42 <Borg> put in on track.. in same place.. asked to find depot..
15:30:51 <Borg> and it went to it just fine
15:31:06 <Borg> BUT!! we cannot reproduce it now.. because nother weird thing happened
15:31:17 <Borg> one train was stopped.. second was waiting for free path on PBS signal
15:31:25 <Borg> I have 255 time so it should wait forever
15:31:39 <Borg> but sudently.. that bitch.. bypassed signal and crashed to waiting train..
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15:35:07 <Borg> or im doing something completly wrong :( or dunno
15:35:18 <Borg> its on my server, so if someone wanna take a look... would be nice
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15:36:30 <Borg> train is like 6 tiles from the depot
15:36:43 <Borg> and he said he cannot find route to local depot..
15:36:49 <Borg> total bullshit in my opinion..
15:38:07 <nielsm> do you have path reservations visible? because if the train has a path reserved that goes past the depot it won't be able to find it
15:38:29 <LordAro> Borg: without seeing anything resembling a save game or even a screenshot it's impossible to say anything one way or the other
15:38:33 <nielsm> (it doesn't try de-allocating the path and searching for a depot instead)
15:38:43 <LordAro> it's usually a missi g section of electrified rail
15:38:49 <nielsm> (there is an open bug report about that behavior)
15:39:25 <Borg> LordAro: its server, you can join anytime..
15:39:31 <Borg> anyway, I enabled path reservation
15:39:49 <Borg> train is stopped.. path is still reserved.. skipping depot to next PBS
15:39:59 <LordAro> Borg: i could, but i won't
15:40:06 <LordAro> not least because i'm at work
15:40:10 <Borg> when I hit depot button, it says no route to it..
15:40:17 <Borg> LordAro: okey, I will give you screenshot..
15:40:43 <peter1138> cue LordAro trying to scroll the screenshot :D
15:43:59 <LordAro> it's searching as if it's at the signal already
15:44:32 <Borg> okey.. so lets wait for 1.8.1 ;)
15:50:01 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd say not unreserving the path is a feature ;)
15:50:15 <Eddi|zuHause> put a signal right before the depot
15:50:39 <Eddi|zuHause> or reverse the train
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18:56:17 <Wolf01> This evening, in the last hour of work, in my usual hallucinatory state, I was trying to figure out a way to integrate custom functions on a data extraction for a chart... tomorrow I'll read the notes and I'll say "wtf I wrote yesterday?"
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19:44:59 <andythenorth> so when NRT is merged, is that OpenTTD 2.0? o_O
19:51:31 <Wolf01> But I would lock the camera to keep the current visual
19:52:31 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, all the hassle of porting to a 3d engine, but none of the benefits :p
19:52:55 <Wolf01> Not even the map rotation
19:53:41 <andythenorth> no pm or alberth? o_O
20:02:23 <andythenorth> that was the review
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20:10:44 <andythenorth> nml could use a release maybe
20:11:08 <frosch123> devzone could use a reboot :)
20:11:11 <andythenorth> what I want to do is draw sprites, play tanks, and wreck FIRS for 64 cargos
20:11:16 <andythenorth> frosch123: a literal reboot?
20:11:35 <frosch123> nah, just some container
20:11:40 <andythenorth> or a metaphorical, "why is it not all on github" reboot?
20:11:53 <andythenorth> "why does frosch123 have to restart rhodecode so often" reboot
20:11:54 <frosch123> andythenorth: nml compile failed
20:12:20 <frosch123> nah, just devzone issues
20:12:58 <andythenorth> devzone aside, nml is a candidate for github imho
20:14:01 <andythenorth> wonder if I can persuade pm to help tidy nml issues
20:14:05 <frosch123> i doubt that would attract contributors in this case
20:14:41 <Eddi|zuHause> what's wrong with the current repo?
20:14:48 <Eddi|zuHause> it's not like it's svn
20:14:57 <andythenorth> it's hg, it can't take PRs, the infra crashes a lot
20:15:15 <frosch123> there is only one commit a year either way
20:15:38 <andythenorth> the problem with nml isn't contributors, it's lack of BDFL :)
20:15:51 <andythenorth> the maintenance commits against openttd are rarely hard
20:17:21 <Eddi|zuHause> well, what needs doing anyway? every time openttd adds something to grf specs, nml needs an update. and missing parts like stations, bridges, ...
20:17:42 <andythenorth> it's usually trivial, but I dislike making those commits without review
20:18:22 <andythenorth> also dunno what the release process is, if any
20:18:36 <andythenorth> we seem to have pushed to pypi historically, but lapsed
20:18:44 <andythenorth> and there's some magic to generate the windows .exe
20:18:56 <frosch123> ammler pushed to pypi
20:19:06 <andythenorth> embed nml into some C wrapper, and ship binaries with OpenTTD? o_O
20:19:19 <frosch123> some years ago pm recovered the login for pypi, but we never pushed
20:19:59 <frosch123> i have no idea what you want to achieve with that
20:20:06 <frosch123> nml is already a debian package
20:20:32 <andythenorth> avoiding python package install hell? o_O
20:20:41 <frosch123> you are the only one with that problem
20:20:50 <andythenorth> I don't have that problem
20:20:58 <frosch123> then there is no problem
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20:22:43 <andythenorth> I'm going to close some issues
20:24:06 <andythenorth> I ran into that recently
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21:02:29 <frosch123> is it ok to compile squirrel into python just to run info.nut?
21:05:22 <Wolf01> You can put a squirrel in a python, but not the inverse :P
21:06:21 <andythenorth> what's the objective? o_O
21:07:05 <frosch123> earlier i wrote bananas2 modules to parse newgrf and savegames to extract dependencies and some meta data
21:07:13 <frosch123> next i need that for ai and gs
21:07:46 <frosch123> the existing stuff like musa tries to parse the file directly by grepping for stuff like "return"
21:07:52 <frosch123> but that does not work with all scripts
21:09:34 <frosch123> in retrospect it was probably bad design to make ai and gs specify their meta data as a script
21:10:41 <Eddi|zuHause> most designs are bad in retrospect :p
21:13:42 <andythenorth> json manifest? o_O
21:14:01 <andythenorth> some kind of yaml nonsense?
21:14:42 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause is quite right, although I find it hard to reconcile with his 'but you must have a good spec' advice :P
21:16:18 <Eddi|zuHause> <frosch123> is it ok to compile squirrel into python just to run info.nut? <-- i can't see any situation where your automatted script running arbitrary user code would cause a problem...
21:17:36 <frosch123> it does that just before shipping it to your computer to run it there
21:17:54 <Eddi|zuHause> there's probably someone out there who wrote a squirrel parser for python, so you can do a static analysis
21:18:27 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: uhm, yeah, but the squirrel "vm" in openttd is probably a bit more limited than your python interpreter
21:20:29 <andythenorth> run it all in docker
21:20:33 <andythenorth> docker is secure!
21:21:06 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: i just want to put the ottd squirrel into a shared libary and bind that to python
21:21:22 <frosch123> so, ottd code in native python wrapper
21:22:03 <Eddi|zuHause> is that easier than running openttd directly and poking it with the admin port?
21:24:28 <Eddi|zuHause> well, there are automatted wrapper generators for C(++) modules
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21:29:44 <frosch123> not in the info.nut
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22:18:13 <LordAro> frosch123: so how about my PRs? :p
22:22:34 <frosch123> no idea, i think i did not check ottd for a month?
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22:26:58 <frosch123> to get anything going with bananas, i have to essentially retire ottd
22:27:49 <andythenorth> one thing at a time
22:27:56 <frosch123> one can spent all evening reviewing stuff or checking issues, and then never anything happens
22:28:07 <andythenorth> to get anything going with 64-cargo FIRS, I need to stop playing tanks :P
22:28:22 <andythenorth> ottd is in quite good shape anyway
22:28:31 <andythenorth> maybe TB will go on a review spree
22:29:26 <andythenorth> one reason I quit forums was to avoid spending time talking **** about stuff that will never actually happen :)
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23:11:25 <andythenorth> hello planetmaker_ :)
23:15:00 <andythenorth> it's pretty good guide
23:15:38 <planetmaker_> it is. And it's kinda funny. Not a boring tutorial
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23:27:52 <andythenorth> did the video end there because his CPU was pegged? o_O
continue to next day ⏵
