IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2017-02-27
⏴ go to previous day
00:17:04 <Samu> bool loading_unloading = this->current_order.GetType() == OT_LOADING && IsStandardRoadStopTile(this->tile);
00:17:28 <Samu> if (!loading_unloading) this->profit_this_year -= cost.GetCost();
00:17:34 <Samu> if (!loading_unloading) SubtractMoneyFromCompanyFract(this->owner, cost);
00:22:33 <Samu> gonna see if it makes a real difference in a real game
00:22:55 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd
01:13:41 <Samu> in a ai game with 5,000 road vehicles, running costs went from -£4,959,499 to -£3,559,173
04:19:16 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd
04:19:16 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir
04:43:51 *** supermop has joined #openttd
04:57:31 *** markasoftware has joined #openttd
07:13:54 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
07:37:58 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd
07:51:13 *** Deactivated has joined #openttd
08:33:51 *** supermop has joined #openttd
09:34:50 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
09:34:50 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth
10:39:18 *** matt11235 has joined #openttd
11:04:19 *** Warrigal has joined #openttd
11:04:34 *** Smedles_ has joined #openttd
11:05:50 *** mikegrb_ has joined #openttd
11:07:21 *** supermop has joined #openttd
11:07:21 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd
11:07:21 *** blathijs has joined #openttd
11:07:21 *** techmagus has joined #openttd
11:07:34 *** greeter has joined #openttd
11:20:05 *** greeter has joined #openttd
11:20:09 *** supermop has joined #openttd
11:20:09 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd
11:20:09 *** blathijs has joined #openttd
11:20:09 *** techmagus has joined #openttd
11:22:52 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd
12:01:41 <Samu> year 1948, on the left with the running costs pausing while loading/unloading, on the right with default 1.6.1
12:02:22 <Samu> don't look at year 1947, only a few months were counted in that
12:08:49 <Samu> about 13%, 14% less running costs
12:14:39 <crem> Not that large difference.
12:21:02 <Samu> should benefit close distances much more than long distances
12:26:53 <Samu> i guess for busses, the costs would be about the double
12:27:12 <Samu> they have to unload, then load, they stay a bit longer
12:27:21 <peter1138> it was always by design that running costs continue
12:27:39 <peter1138> newgrfs can control it as well
12:28:29 <Samu> i only did this to non-drive through road stops
12:29:08 <Samu> bool pause_running_cost = this->current_order.GetType() == OT_LOADING && IsStandardRoadStopTile(this->tile);
12:29:31 <Samu> if (!pause_running_cost) { this->profit_this_year -= cost.GetCost(); SubtractMoneyFromCompanyFract(this->owner, cost);
12:31:49 <Samu> it does something strange in the vehicle details
12:32:12 <Samu> the running cost per year is changed
12:32:34 <Alberth> your code is wrong, openttd is not the place to solve these problems, a NewGRF must do it instead
12:32:38 <Samu> changes when it's loading/unloading train
12:33:39 <Alberth> a NewGRF author is in control how those costs work, so you cannot override that behavior
12:34:46 <Samu> i dunno how to make a newgrf, or maybe I know, but I'm not in the mood
12:34:59 <Samu> i made a few, simple newgrfs before
12:36:27 *** maciozo has joined #openttd
12:36:35 <Alberth> I am just saying that what you can technically do is not necessarily a good solution, or a viable solution
12:37:06 <Alberth> due to rules or agreements elsewhere made
12:39:40 <Samu> can I keep the running cost per year in the vehicle details with a newgrf, while still achieving the same behaviour of pausing running costs?
12:40:53 <Samu> if it's -£500/yr and the vehicle is loading, i'd still want it to display -£500/yr instead of £0/yr
12:47:46 <Alberth> if the vehicle loads for a whole year, you didn't pay 500 pound
12:53:18 <Samu> i guess it's never the correct value
12:55:28 <Samu> if the vehicle is stopped in the depot, it still says -£500/yr
12:57:01 <Samu> if I stop the vehicle manually, it still says the same
13:06:44 <Alberth> I do, Samu. I think the best you can do is show the current cost, which is also what openttd does
13:07:13 <Wolf01> Still trying to break grfs?
13:14:15 <Samu> uh, openttd doesn't always show the current cost
13:14:49 <Samu> the real running cost of a stopped vehicle in the depot is £0
13:15:15 <Samu> if it's stopped the entire year, it's still £0
13:15:27 <Samu> and yet it displays -£500/yr
13:48:07 <Samu> hmm, should the engines still be off when the vehicle is "Leaving" a station but is blocked by another road vehicle entering the station?
13:49:24 <Wolf01> Do you turn off the engine while waiting behind another vehicle?
13:50:03 <Samu> i don't know, i don't drive
13:50:37 <Samu> in the game is says "leaving" but it has yet to move or play the engine sound
13:51:11 <Samu> i think the engine is off
13:52:09 <peter1138> still requires maintenance
13:52:49 <peter1138> nah that's depot costs
13:52:53 <peter1138> whatever the reasoning was :p
13:55:57 <Wolf01> The drive through roadstops loading system should be reviewed, with 2 vehicles the one which is loading should always be the first one in line, if you are merging 2 lines on the same roadstop then you are doing it wrong :P
14:03:01 <Samu> this->current_order.GetType() == (OT_LOADING || OT_LEAVESTATION) - is this good coding?
14:03:40 <Samu> warning C4805: '==': unsafe mix of type 'OrderType' and type 'bool' in operation
14:06:02 <Samu> bool pause_running_cost = this->current_order.GetType() == OT_LOADING || this->current_order.GetType() == OT_LEAVESTATION && IsStandardRoadStopTile(this->tile);
14:06:50 <Wolf01> Is there a OrderTypeByte or something?
14:08:47 <Wolf01> Below that, there's some other definition?
14:09:35 <Samu> enum OrderType { OT_BEGIN = 0, OT_NOTHING = 0, OT_GOTO_STATION = 1, OT_GOTO_DEPOT = 2, OT_LOADING = 3, OT_LEAVESTATION = 4, OT_DUMMY = 5, OT_GOTO_WAYPOINT = 6, OT_CONDITIONAL = 7, OT_IMPLICIT = 8, OT_END };
14:10:14 <Wolf01> BTW, I would do this "this->current_order.GetType() && (OT_LOADING | OT_LEAVESTATION) > 0", but I don't know if it's really correct
14:13:00 <Wolf01> Also, I asked for this "typedef SimpleTinyEnumT<OrderType, byte> OrderTypeByte;"
14:13:20 <Wolf01> Which is 2 lines below
14:15:37 <Samu> testing the same savegame, now with OT_LEAVING as well
14:15:45 <Wolf01> Btw, it might need some bitshifting as they aren't flags
14:15:56 <Samu> running cost savings should increase
14:20:30 <Samu> from -£15,200 to -£13,160, to -£13,124 with OT_LEAVESTATION
14:20:59 <Samu> barelly a difference, because my road vehicles are actually not waiting much in the stations
14:23:11 <Samu> might need a heavily congestioned savegame, an AI perhaps
14:33:56 <Samu> nice, it works, i just had to simulate a vehicle blocking another from exiting the station
14:34:19 <Samu> this might happen more often when breakdowns are enabled
15:11:33 <Samu> tested a RoadAI savegame
15:12:11 <Samu> 5000 road vehicles, running costs went from -£4,959,499 to -£3,533,194
15:13:47 <Wolf01> Still think that is the AI which should be fixed
15:19:03 <Samu> hmm, buffing buses wasn't exactly what I had in mind...
15:20:24 <Samu> my idea was more of a short distance buff for road vehicles
15:20:55 <Samu> buses actually fit this criteria quite nicely :(
15:21:01 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
15:32:15 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
15:32:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth
15:37:09 <supermop__> ok i've drawn up trolleybus wires
15:37:31 <supermop__> as intended they make a huge mess at X junctions
15:40:22 <supermop__> now just need to code them
15:40:51 <supermop__> should it be a wire only grf? or part of a road set?
15:43:35 <Alberth> one grf for each vehicle :)
15:44:01 <Alberth> nah, just throw it all together, imho
15:44:21 <Alberth> you can always just disable the vehicles of it :)
15:46:03 <supermop__> ah i mean as part of a set of roadtypes
15:48:04 <supermop__> i wonder, is there or will there be a way to block a certain roadtype from having a certain tramtype, or vis versa?
15:49:36 <supermop__> eg no tram on highway, no dirt road on higher speed light rail etc
15:53:28 <Alberth> there is this "powerdness" concept, that decides when a vehicle has power, not sure if that extends between trams and roads
15:53:58 <Wolf01> I think he means to not being able to build a tramway over a highway
15:54:19 <Alberth> not so much tram/road combinations are forbidden, more that some combinations are utterly useless :)
15:54:53 <supermop__> yes, what Wolf01 is saying
15:55:27 <Alberth> don't remember discussions about this aspect, but that doesn't mean much
15:56:22 <supermop__> also, currently trolleywire just seems to be front and back, whereas i vaguely recall that train catenary has the wire itself/ and the supports
15:56:41 <Wolf01> It's a huge compatibility-shit, but in future it should be done
15:56:55 <Alberth> also not sure what the point is of forbidding it; sure it'll look weird, but if that bothers you, don't do it?
15:57:22 <supermop__> in the future i might be interested in differentiating the support pylons a bit -
15:57:23 <Wolf01> Could say the same of disabling level crossings
15:58:16 <supermop__> i drew my wires as the kind you see in older towns, where a hanger wire is strung across the street and holds the conducting wire
15:59:00 <supermop__> as opposed to the sort of high tension with strut in the ogfx/foobar's trollewire
16:00:11 <supermop__> it might be nice to have light rail, and modern trolley trucks have that more catenary type look, whereas mining roads and old streetcar lines have the hung wire
16:00:49 <supermop__> problem is, what if i build modern light rail over old fashioned trolley bus street
16:01:28 <supermop__> there is no way to change the trolleybus wire to be more modern - so maybe better to disallow and avoid mess of pixels
16:07:21 <supermop__> it's academic at the moment as i have not drawn any 'fancier' wires yet
16:07:50 <supermop__> but thinking about it led me to ponder other cases, like the tram on a highway
16:08:43 <supermop__> or - what if i abuse tram to make a gondola. you could of course build roads under a cable path, but maybe it looks bad in some cases
16:13:21 <supermop__> if i have a grf that defines a new catenary for ELRD and ELRL, any other new roadtypes defined by a later grf in the list will not use the new wires, right?
16:19:48 <supermop__> anyone know of a gpl set with nice looking tram tracks i can steal?
16:27:28 <Samu> i have another idea, which I had years ago
16:27:52 <Samu> by increasing running costs based on the number of wagons
16:28:25 <Samu> or perhaps based on train size
16:29:07 *** UntouchedWagons has joined #openttd
16:29:43 <Wolf01> It's already done through power, more wagons, more power required to move them, not enough HP? The train won't reach full speed (maybe even half of that) and you pay the same for a slower train
16:30:18 <UntouchedWagons> Hi there, what environment do you guys use to compile openttd?
16:32:09 <UntouchedWagons> I've tried to compile openttd on anything that'll work and it's driving me up the wall
16:37:02 <LordAro> UntouchedWagons: what have you tried?
16:37:18 <UntouchedWagons> I've tried cygwin32, cygwin64, mingw32, mingw64 and visual studio
16:37:48 <UntouchedWagons> the first four all fail to compile because the compiler can't find various networking related data structures. Visual studio fails with over 600 errors
16:39:04 <LordAro> i probably can't help much more then, given i'm currently lacking any windows programming environment
16:39:16 <LordAro> it *does* work though, i assure you
16:39:24 <LordAro> although it's definitely not the easiest to set up
16:41:12 <UntouchedWagons> compiling on windows has never struck me as remotely easy
16:41:22 *** ConductCat has joined #openttd
16:45:42 <UntouchedWagons> I think this is how alcohol abuse starts
16:53:08 <Samu> microsoft visual studio 2015
16:54:36 <Samu> it compiles fine for me, but sometimes visual studio is dumb
16:55:22 <LordAro> UntouchedWagons: that's very curious set of error messages
16:55:32 <LordAro> looks like some sort of defines are being set when they shouldn't be
16:55:57 <LordAro> i don't know enough of the details though, you'd be best waiting for frosch or similar to appear
16:56:10 <supermop__> trolleywire grf name: "Spool" or "Unspoolled"?
16:56:17 <Samu> when visual studio is acting stupid, i sometimes resort to starting everything all over, delete entire folders, etc..., from scratch
16:56:59 <Samu> visual studio caches many crap, and sometimes this cache is wrong, outdated or whatever...
16:57:15 <Samu> if i start over from scratc,, i usually succeed
16:58:35 <UntouchedWagons> In the tutorial on the wiki for VS2015, it says to put the headers/libraries for openttd-useful before the default ones which I've done, but I still get the C4430 error
16:58:43 <UntouchedWagons> among other numerous errors
16:59:10 <Alberth> it seems you're missing a network library
16:59:21 <Wolf01> The default ones must be replaced, it won't work with those
17:00:05 <Alberth> or rather, an include file, but it picks up a different file with the same name, or you'd get "missing include file"
17:01:00 <UntouchedWagons> I don't think I follow Wolf01
17:01:13 <UntouchedWagons> I'll check for any network libraries in the cygwin repos
17:03:34 <UntouchedWagons> when I run "./configure --with-lzo2=/usr/lib/liblzo2.dll.a", it does say "checking network... found" so I don't know what's going on
17:04:11 <Wolf01> Or the best you can do is to make a .user file where you load the openttd-useful, so you can share it between project without editing the project files
17:04:28 <Alberth> it does find something network, or #include of the network file would fail
17:04:50 <Alberth> instead, it fails to know stuff that is supposed to be defined in that included file
17:05:25 <Alberth> that means, it considers a file to be a network-related file, which is not actually a network file
17:06:25 <Wolf01> Replace the ENV vars I used with the actual paths
17:07:13 <Wolf01> $(VC_LibraryPath_x86);$(WindowsSDK_LibraryPath_x86);$(NETFXKitsDir)Lib\um\x86 <- these always break things
17:07:29 <Samu> Money Train::GetRunningCost() const - MUAHhahahahah
17:08:05 <Wolf01> I used to get rid of them and magically the build succeeded
17:08:08 <UntouchedWagons> so what where would I put this file?
17:08:46 <Wolf01> Name it vs140.vcxproj.user and put it in the project folder
17:08:57 <UntouchedWagons> oh okay. I'll try that
17:09:00 <Wolf01> VS automatically loads it
17:09:29 <UntouchedWagons> I'd still open the sln file right?
17:09:52 <UntouchedWagons> all right, I'll give it another go
17:10:10 <Wolf01> Oh, also you need to use openttd-useful 6.1 iirc
17:11:09 <UntouchedWagons> I've got 6.0 already
17:12:08 <Wolf01> 5.1 doesn't work with VS14
17:12:21 <Samu> multi-headed, multi-engine, consist
17:13:00 <Samu> i need to familiarize with these terms
17:13:29 <Samu> "Get the next real (non-articulated part) vehicle in the consist."
17:13:56 <Wolf01> (]-[]-[]-[]-[) - multi-headed
17:14:14 <Wolf01> (]-(]-[]-[] - multi-engine
17:14:54 <Alberth> who needs 2.5D ghraphics if lines of ASCII art suffices :)
17:15:10 <Wolf01> /¯¯¯¯||¯¯¯¯||¯¯¯¯||¯¯¯¯||¯¯¯¯\
17:16:16 <Samu> i wonder what exactly a "vehicle" is in train language
17:16:33 <Samu> are there articulated wagons?
17:16:41 <UntouchedWagons> yeah there's articulared wagons
17:16:55 <UntouchedWagons> those flatbed cars that hold the shipping containers share boggies
17:17:24 <Samu> i need a newgrf with an articulated wagon, for testing
17:17:29 <Wolf01> Vehicle is almost anything not tied to the map
17:17:58 <Wolf01> Trains, buses, ships, shadows, sparks, smoke...
17:20:41 <Wolf01> An articulated wagon/engine is composed by multiple vehicles
17:21:27 <Wolf01> So "Get the next real (non-articulated part) vehicle in the consist." means the next wagon/engine, not the next vehicle (which could be the other half of the engine)
17:25:19 <UntouchedWagons> all right I'm gonna try compiling openttd with that .user file
17:26:20 <UntouchedWagons> 655 errors...
17:27:40 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
17:28:20 <Alberth> error count has not much meaning, most errors are caused by earlier ones
17:31:27 <Samu> if (e->u.rail.running_cost_class == INVALID_PRICE) continue;
17:31:33 <Samu> so, wagons have INVALID_PRICE
17:36:07 *** supermop has joined #openttd
17:40:44 <UntouchedWagons> so yeah Wolf01 that file didn't work
17:51:39 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd
18:04:56 <supermop__> can i just set ELRD and ELRL catenary without setting all the other properties for the roadtype
18:09:36 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
18:13:11 <DorpsGek> frosch123: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 19 hours, 9 minutes, and 0 seconds ago: <andythenorth> also bed
18:13:20 <frosch123> i guess the sharks got him
18:15:53 <frosch123> i wonder whether or*dge will ban everyone who posted in the change-username topic :)
18:37:38 <Samu> calculating train vehicle lenght is hard
18:37:50 <Samu> it must have been done before, have to find
18:41:24 <Samu> CeilDiv(u->gcache.cached_total_length * 10, TILE_SIZE)
18:49:43 <Samu> hmm so, a train of size 0,5, is actually size 5
18:49:46 *** Progman has joined #openttd
19:04:20 *** NGC3982 has joined #openttd
19:04:50 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd
19:12:41 <Samu> how do i calculate the lenght of a multi-headed train?
19:12:54 <Samu> or are both parts always the same lenght?
19:13:22 <Samu> if one is 5, the other is also 5?
19:27:36 <supermop__> if i define a new catenary for ELRD in one grf, and then load another grf that defines a roadtype that uses default catenary, there is no way to make that subsequent roadtype use the special catenary i defined?
19:28:55 <frosch123> there is only one global catenary
19:29:03 <frosch123> and then catenary per road/tram type
19:30:05 <Samu> so, a single headed engine can be articulated
19:30:19 <Samu> this is a mess for me :(
19:30:34 <UntouchedWagons> try compiling openttd and you'll see what a mess is
19:31:10 <ST2> I use VS 2013 and compiles like a charm
19:31:34 <ST2> some warnings, but expected, due the applied changes
19:31:34 <Samu> are there multi-headed engines that are not articulated?
19:31:56 <Samu> isn't it inherently articulated if it's multi-headed?
19:32:18 <UntouchedWagons> I've tried 5 different build environments and I can't get it to compile
19:33:18 <Samu> multi-articulated-headed engines
19:35:36 <Samu> this is harder than i initially thought
19:37:50 <Samu> cached_veh_length is not the lenght of the vehicle, but the lenght of the articulated part of this vehicle
19:38:14 <Samu> if there are 2 parts, i only get the lenght of 1
19:39:44 <peter1138> it's definitely already calculated
19:40:33 <Samu> hmm then im doing this wrong
19:40:51 <supermop__> can i just replace the global cat?
19:41:08 <Samu> uint16 veh_len = CeilDiv(v->gcache.cached_total_length * 10, TILE_SIZE);
19:41:14 <Samu> uint16 unc_len = CeilDiv(v->gcache.cached_veh_length * 10, TILE_SIZE);
19:41:22 <frosch123> you can via action5
19:41:30 <Samu> i got a single headed articulated train from NARS
19:42:20 <frosch123> but there is only one newgrf that wins :)
19:42:49 <frosch123> the catenary is also shared for road and tram
19:42:58 <Samu> unc_len is 4, actually, my bad
19:45:49 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: Commit by translators :: r27761 /trunk/src/lang (4 files) (2017-02-27 19:45:37 +0100 )
19:45:50 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: -Update from Eints:
19:45:51 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: croatian: 3 changes by VoyagerOne
19:45:52 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: italian: 5 changes by lorenzodv
19:45:53 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: english (us): 4 changes by Supercheese
19:46:46 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd
19:47:37 <Samu> i'm trying to come up with a way to get a sum_len of parts of the train that do not have running costs attached to them
19:48:42 <supermop__> you guys have an idea for a standard label for dirt roards or highways yet?
19:49:12 <frosch123> "DIRT" would be obvious :p
19:49:36 <frosch123> i recall "HWAY" from somewhere
19:58:20 <supermop__> i wonder what andy want's his trolley assist mining trucks to drive on
19:59:06 <supermop__> some kind of electric HAUL?
20:03:00 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd
20:06:49 <Wolf01> You could leave RD RL parts of, as they are already split, DIRT and HWAY are good
20:07:31 <supermop__> need more letters for ELDIRT and ELHWAY
20:11:41 <supermop__> ok i might put together a grf with dirt, cobble streets, asphalt roads, and highways/ all with and without wires
20:12:18 <frosch123> railtypes usually shorten electrified to just "E"
20:12:51 <Wolf01> Then let's keep the same syntax
20:13:37 <Wolf01> More than half of the slots :D
20:14:26 <Wolf01> 10 if you count the hardcoded ones
20:14:41 <supermop__> Wolf01: this is just to show people a variety of types
20:15:10 <supermop__> cobblestone kind of worthless though
20:16:14 <supermop__> because either cobble or asphalt will be built by towns, not both
20:18:44 <UntouchedWagons> I'm gonna try disabling networking because this is stupid. I've spent 10 hours trying to get this game to compile
20:19:30 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
20:20:24 <UntouchedWagons> and compilation still failed
20:20:37 <andythenorth> so it seems I didn’t break FIRS <-> eints
20:20:51 <Wolf01> Did you try with clean trunk or with a patch?
20:20:52 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd
20:21:08 <Wolf01> Better try with clean trunk first
20:21:10 <UntouchedWagons> it's failing on the music stuff now
20:22:37 <UntouchedWagons> Okay I'll try that
20:25:57 <UntouchedWagons> it fails to compile if networking is enabled for the same reason
20:26:11 <UntouchedWagons> >error: ‘SetNonBlocking’ declared as an ‘inline’ variable
20:26:46 <Wolf01> IMHO it collides with windows' libraries
20:27:54 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest118
20:27:56 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd
20:29:46 <UntouchedWagons> I'm using cygwin again at the moment
20:30:10 <Samu> Build > Clean Solution, then Build > Rebuild All
20:30:30 <UntouchedWagons> all right I'll try visual studio again
20:30:59 <frosch123> eints is inactive for firs currently
20:32:02 <UntouchedWagons> Visual studio still fails to compile with 635 errors
20:36:18 <UntouchedWagons> I'm gonna try rebooting
20:36:20 *** UntouchedWagons has quit IRC
20:37:45 *** supermop has joined #openttd
20:38:08 *** UntouchedWagons has joined #openttd
20:38:56 <UntouchedWagons> No, rebooting didn't do anything
20:45:59 *** Lejving has joined #openttd
20:46:37 <glx> UntouchedWagons: VS version and OTTD useful version ?
20:47:15 <UntouchedWagons> visual studio community 2015 update 3, useful 6.0
20:50:41 <andythenorth> frosch123: interestingly, .devzone/translations/langdir exists for me locally
20:50:47 <andythenorth> but not in the repo
20:50:57 <andythenorth> and hg does not see the file
20:51:34 <andythenorth> file is untracked by hg
20:52:02 <andythenorth> translations/ is in .hgignore
20:52:14 <andythenorth> glob syntax will match that in a subpath?
20:53:02 <andythenorth> anyway, fixed and pushed
20:54:23 <Samu> question again: are there multi-headed articulated engines?
20:54:51 <Samu> or maybe i'm asking the wrong question
20:55:08 <glx> UntouchedWagons: same version here and it builds fine
20:55:09 <andythenorth> it’s a valid question
20:56:44 <UntouchedWagons> it's like visual studio can't see useful's header files or something dumb like that
20:57:00 <UntouchedWagons> can I see your project properties for openttd?
20:58:07 <glx> you must tell VS where useful headers and libs are
20:59:12 <Samu> my include directories : D:\OpenTTD\OpenTTD essentials\shared\include;$(IncludePath)
20:59:29 <andythenorth> dual_headed = engine at front and rear
20:59:31 <Samu> for configuration debug x64
20:59:58 <Samu> my library directories: D:\OpenTTD\OpenTTD essentials\win64\library;$(LibraryPath)
21:00:28 <glx> and it's better to set them in a custom property page
21:01:08 <Samu> i made a copy paste of trunk\projects instead
21:01:26 <Samu> i use trunk\projects Cópia
21:01:33 <Samu> and leave the original one untouched
21:01:54 <Samu> can't be arsed to create a custom user thingy thing
21:02:07 <Samu> dont even know how it works
21:02:46 <glx> seems correct UntouchedWagons
21:04:44 <UntouchedWagons> well it's still not working after trying for 10 hours
21:05:50 *** supermop has joined #openttd
21:07:53 <Samu> try Tools > Import and Export Settings, then Reset all settings
21:09:59 <UntouchedWagons> still fails to compile
21:10:35 <UntouchedWagons> Severity Code Description Project File Line Suppression State
21:10:35 <UntouchedWagons> Error C2061 syntax error: identifier 'ssize_t' (compiling source file ..\src\airport.cpp) openttd c:\users\jordan\documents\projects\openttd-patches\src\3rdparty\cpp-btree\btree.h 889
21:11:06 <UntouchedWagons> dunno where that first line came from
21:12:16 <michi_cc> Whatever patch or patch pack that is, it seems somewhat broken.
21:12:39 <UntouchedWagons> It's the jgrpp pack
21:12:56 <UntouchedWagons> I'll try with the openttd 1.6.1 code
21:13:03 <glx> first try to compile clean trunk without any patch
21:14:41 <frosch123> andythenorth: is 2048 strings enough for firs?
21:14:56 <UntouchedWagons> okay 1.6.1 code seems to be compiling
21:15:15 <frosch123> raising the DCxx limit from 256 to 2048 seems to be a piece of cake
21:17:54 <andythenorth> frosch123: 640K is probably enough for anyone, tbh
21:19:09 <frosch123> i already had fun reading ttdp source today :)
21:19:55 <andythenorth> apparently gates never said 640k was enough
21:20:29 <andythenorth> DCxx strings used: 233/256
21:20:56 <andythenorth> unless we add random station names and go nuts with them, 2048 should be more than enough
21:21:13 <V453000> one doesn't simply go nuts
21:21:20 <V453000> I don't have a highlight on nuts btw
21:21:28 <UntouchedWagons> Okay it's done compiling. Why is openttd.exe not put in the bin folder?
21:21:29 <andythenorth> what do you have highlights on?
21:21:36 <andythenorth> that I could plausibly use in normal conversation
21:21:49 * andythenorth used to have highlights, but deleted most of them
21:22:11 <frosch123> i used to get highlighted by earth-quak-e, but i fixed the rules
21:23:29 <andythenorth> FIRS is definitely not ‘done’, but I think I can see ‘done’ from here
21:23:58 <andythenorth> it has 6 economies, I plan to have about 9
21:24:27 <andythenorth> then I just spend a year animating all industries, then drop the mic
21:24:46 <andythenorth> there’s no need to change industry spec ever, except to plant fields
21:25:00 <andythenorth> probably be done around v5 or v6
21:25:06 <andythenorth> maybe I should stop at V453000
21:25:10 <UntouchedWagons> oh are you the firs dev andy?
21:25:33 <andythenorth> I wasn’t the only one, there used to be more
21:25:34 <UntouchedWagons> I wasn't really paying attention to your conversation tbh
21:25:47 <andythenorth> but somehow my style causes contributors to…find other things to do :P
21:25:48 <Alberth> he's also makefile dev
21:27:05 <andythenorth> but not newgrf wiki maintainer
21:27:44 <andythenorth> even after creating entirely new accounts, using a different browser
21:27:47 <andythenorth> maybe I’m banned :D
21:28:03 <Alberth> IP address is considered dangerous :)
21:28:19 <frosch123> andythenorth: do not forget to request nick changes for your unused accounts
21:28:52 <andythenorth> the more I look like a sock puppet, the more likely I am to get unbanned? o_O
21:29:59 <frosch123> V453000: some douchebag registered to forums just to request a nickchange (nick change post 3 minutes after registration)
21:30:04 <frosch123> i bet it was thar worly guy
21:30:13 <ST2> who's not affraid of Wiki when the head admins are pompuosly called "Bureaucrat" - imo it's the fear of the term :P
21:46:25 <Wolf01> So it seem I came back early
21:51:56 <supermop_> autocad just makes me very enthusiastic in IRC at times
21:53:05 <supermop_> is there any use for stone paved roads in game
21:54:14 <frosch123> isnt't that just a more modern version of cobblestone?
21:54:21 <supermop_> spent like 2 weeks in history class when i lived in england in middle school on british road paving developments in the early industrial period
21:58:19 <andythenorth> roman road, with camber
21:58:37 <andythenorth> if you change school, like I did, you get to do that twice
21:58:43 <andythenorth> also canals, at least twice
21:59:09 <andythenorth> and the romans, twice. under-floor heating such
22:03:04 <supermop_> all the variations of composition of rocks in cross section
22:03:30 <supermop_> roads to move armies around scottland
22:04:23 <supermop_> all of the improvements to looms
22:09:05 <supermop_> so i've drawn all the trolleywire sprites, i've got a perfectly functioning bit of code for defining different road types, and i've got good looking GPL compliant graphics i can lift from ARRS,
22:09:48 <supermop_> but i cant bring myself to make a grf because i cant decide what types of shittier roads i want to define
22:10:35 <frosch123> supermop_: make them date dependent
22:10:57 <supermop_> supermop_: towns can't really make use of that yet though, right?
22:12:01 <supermop_> __ln__: looks dangerous
22:12:18 <supermop_> frosch123: towns can only build ROAD so far
22:12:46 <supermop_> so is ROAD stone paved streets, or asphalt roads?
22:13:13 <frosch123> both, depending on town zone?
22:15:04 <supermop_> we don't want any asphalt in the 1600s or so
22:15:15 <frosch123> noone plays in 1600
22:15:36 <supermop_> but it would also be odd to have stone outside of city center in 2000
22:15:54 <supermop_> and i want to avoid the save and reload to switch thing
22:16:13 *** supermop has joined #openttd
22:16:15 <frosch123> it can convert on the fly
22:16:25 <frosch123> unless you mind the instant switch
22:17:36 <frosch123> yes, 1969-12-31 cobble stone -> 1970-01-01 asphalt, no problem
22:17:50 <frosch123> may look weird though :)
22:18:07 <supermop_> then on january 1 at 00:00 all stones turn to asphalt?
22:18:56 <frosch123> it may also glitch a little bit since ottd does not redraw everything immediately
22:19:08 <Samu> a multi-headed vehicle is actually 2 vehicles, right?
22:19:18 <frosch123> so it will convert while scrolling :)
22:19:31 <frosch123> or when stuff moves on it
22:19:46 <supermop_> road doesn't know when it was built, right?
22:20:43 <supermop_> what if i just make ROAD asphalt from 0 CE, and hope that NRT in the future allows towns to build other types than only ROAD
22:21:14 <Wolf01> <frosch123> unless you mind the instant switch <- imho we need to introduce some automatic roadworks
22:21:21 <frosch123> i rate that one of the least likely things
22:21:43 <frosch123> there is just no good criterion for towns to decide which type to build
22:24:10 <supermop_> add a value of desirability, town build road with highest value thats available?
22:24:19 <Wolf01> And something like the factory fields?
22:27:29 <Samu> how many heads can a vehicle actually have?
22:27:49 <supermop_> or just town build the latest defined available roadtype that is flagged as buildable by toown
22:28:01 <Samu> "multiheaded" term is a bit ambiguous
22:30:06 <Wolf01> I would make town pick randomly for available flagged roadtypes, and make them available only at certain dates, so you can even have 2 towns with a different roadtype
22:33:59 *** gelignite has joined #openttd
22:35:12 <andythenorth> underwater tunnels eh? o_O
22:36:12 <Wolf01> With the sealevel patch it should be possible
22:36:34 <andythenorth> there was chunnel patch also
22:37:20 *** gelignite has joined #openttd
22:39:08 <frosch123> Wolf01: there is also another option for tunnels
22:39:24 <frosch123> there are two ways to build bridges: with ramp or flat
22:39:38 <frosch123> but there is only one way to build tunnels (essentially flat only)
22:40:12 <frosch123> we could add a tunnelentry with a downhill stope into the tunnel
22:40:27 <frosch123> which may not require a real height level below it
22:51:32 *** supermop has joined #openttd
22:54:42 <UntouchedWagons> I need a company name
23:05:29 <Wolf01> Transporter McTransportface
23:29:54 <supermop_> Wolf01: those seem interesting
23:44:04 <supermop_> is powered list the types that can drive on this road, or the roads that vehicles of this type can drive on?
23:45:30 <Wolf01> Lol, I'll never understand that well
23:52:37 <Samu> how do I compute the lenght of an articulated vehicle?
23:53:07 <Samu> the game doesn't do it correctly, or I'm missing something
23:53:36 <Wolf01> Isn't it just the classic tramway on grass?
23:54:04 <Samu> there is this: static uint GetLengthOfArticulatedVehicle(const Train *v)
23:54:11 <Samu> but it's only for the GUI
23:55:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i get the image of some hastily placed rails in swamp areas which can only be passed at walk speed
23:55:32 <Eddi|zuHause> because they're not exactly what you would call... straight
23:55:35 <Wolf01> Pointless, there are no swamps on OTTD
23:59:16 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that was probably the one i had in my head at first
continue to next day ⏵
