IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2016-12-26
⏴ go to previous day
00:13:51 <_dp_> omg, how come I didn't ever notice fizzy drinks construction animation
00:16:09 <Eddi|zuHause> because no sane person ever played toyland for more than 3 minutes? :p
00:28:48 <Eddi|zuHause> some rumors about george michael falling victim to the 2016 curse
00:34:11 *** FLHerne_ has joined #openttd
00:52:21 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd
03:16:33 *** gelignite_ has joined #openttd
04:08:45 *** chomwitt1 has joined #openttd
05:45:15 *** chomwitt2 has joined #openttd
05:52:46 *** chomwitt3 has joined #openttd
05:56:12 *** chomwitt4 has joined #openttd
06:00:39 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd
06:14:06 *** chomwitt1 has joined #openttd
06:18:33 *** chomwitt2 has joined #openttd
07:19:08 *** gelignite_ is now known as gelignite
09:23:25 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd
09:56:22 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
10:45:13 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd
10:48:58 <Wolf01> So it is then... Eddi was right
10:50:40 <andythenorth> what was he right about?
10:51:24 <andythenorth> also, shall we fix tooltips for main toolbar? o_O
10:51:36 <andythenorth> (try them for tramtype onwards)
10:51:54 <Wolf01> Nah, I like how they are ;)
10:59:01 *** Progman has joined #openttd
11:00:12 <Wolf01> Uhm, it's me or the scenario editor tramway button is missing?
11:00:31 *** FLHerne_ has joined #openttd
11:01:41 <andythenorth> Wolf01: it’s missing :)
11:01:52 <Wolf01> I was sure I pushed it
11:02:57 <andythenorth> is the commit just for the roadtypes?
11:03:02 <andythenorth> and not the tramtypes/
11:03:23 <andythenorth> also, mine includes ‘electrified roads’, which is curious
11:05:50 <Wolf01> Also roadtypes different from normal road can't be built on editor... I wonder why, it worked
11:09:54 <andythenorth> ‘many eyes make shallow bugs’ etc :P
11:26:43 <Wolf01> Mmmh, I need to hide some roadtypes from editor dropdown
11:56:15 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd
12:05:31 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd
12:20:49 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd
12:32:33 *** gelignite has joined #openttd
12:34:25 *** ZirconiumX has joined #openttd
12:43:03 *** Alberth has joined #openttd
12:43:03 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth
12:53:27 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
12:56:33 <frosch123> let's see how upgrading roads works
12:58:06 <andythenorth> probably better than this wifi
12:58:22 <andythenorth> probably better than this wifi network
12:59:09 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
13:01:00 <frosch123> thanks for the demonstration
13:05:23 <Alberth> congrats with the christmas present, all!
13:18:50 * andythenorth wonders what to do next
13:20:02 <frosch123> should road and tram depots look differently?
13:20:31 <andythenorth> I dislike the electric tram depot quite a bit
13:20:41 <andythenorth> but for consistencies sake I wondered about keeping it unchanged
13:22:53 <andythenorth> the HAUL depot would make a better tram depot
13:23:03 <andythenorth> and HAUL should look more like it fits with a mine or quarry or such
13:26:59 <Eddi|zuHause> i always used a tram grf with slightly wider rails, which also came with a tram depot
13:35:34 * andythenorth used Light-rail/Tramtracks grf
13:35:42 <andythenorth> which has nice catenary, but horrible depot
13:35:53 <andythenorth> default catenary is really horrible
13:59:41 <Wolf01> I was about to see how I could fix the editor roadtypes dropdown before lunch, any suggestion?
14:07:04 <frosch123> what is it supposed to show?
14:07:45 <Wolf01> No loaded grf with vehicles for it
14:08:12 <frosch123> then compare GetScenRoadTypeDropDownList with GetRoadTypeDropDownList :)
14:08:40 <frosch123> also i believe HasRoadTypeAvail disallows all roadtypes but normal road
14:09:39 <Wolf01> Yes, you see them but you can't effectively build them
14:17:00 <frosch> the other one was jelly of andy's wifi or so
14:24:39 <Wolf01> Ha! Removed haul but kept elroad
14:54:23 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
14:59:26 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd
15:09:43 *** maciozo has joined #openttd
15:13:20 *** maciozo_ has joined #openttd
15:17:50 *** maciozo_ is now known as maciozo
15:30:51 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd
15:45:29 <andythenorth> big broken FIRS patch, big unfinished Iron Horse change
15:45:37 <andythenorth> unfinished Road Hog
15:45:48 <andythenorth> and Unsinkable Sam is barely a prototype
15:46:03 <Wolf01> Did they already start to ask for more features on NRT?
15:46:10 <andythenorth> it’s a good sign
15:46:14 <andythenorth> means it’s not ‘meh'
15:58:00 <frosch> gah, i can't decide whether overbuilding roadstop/bridges/tunnels with different roadtypes should error, convert or upgrade
15:58:18 <frosch> and it is so inconsistent for railtypes that it does not give a good example :p
16:01:50 <Wolf01> Should we be able to build even tramways in editor?
16:05:13 <frosch> they cannot be town-owned
16:06:49 <Wolf01> I wonder if one day we could have generated maps with connections, and maybe industries too with the possibility to take over single routes
16:10:02 <Wolf01> Good guy adf88 provided a temporary fix for opengfx+ missing graphics :P
16:25:01 <andythenorth> frosch: upgrade = increases compatibility, never reduces it?
16:25:41 *** Ethereal_Whisper has joined #openttd
16:29:10 <Wolf01> For example you can't upgrade ROAD->HAUL
16:37:15 <frosch> andythenorth: in practice yes, in theory compatibilty is not transitive
16:51:03 <andythenorth> upgrade seems like the right thing to do, but is the hardest behaviour to explain
16:51:25 <andythenorth> what’s wrong with having to explicitly convert?
16:51:31 <frosch> the best behaviour is the one that does not need explanation :)
16:51:34 <andythenorth> or choose the right type before overbuilding
16:51:45 <frosch> anyway, already pushed
16:51:50 <frosch> made it the same as for railtypes
16:52:02 <frosch> though the behaviour for bridges and tunnels is meh in for both :p
16:58:08 <andythenorth> so HAUL won’t build over ROAD, but ELRL will build over RAIL
16:58:59 <frosch> and building ELRL over RAIL and RAIL over ELRL both result in ELRL
17:01:18 <frosch> ok, so... roadstops...
17:01:57 <andythenorth> ah I was talking about roadstops :)
17:01:59 <frosch> the gui sprites for road and rail include sprites for build tunnel, but not for build bridge
17:02:22 <frosch> the gui sprites for rail do not include sprites for build station and build waypoint
17:02:34 <andythenorth> ok so if road is also present on the tile, I can build RAIL stop over ELRL
17:02:39 <frosch> i think the gui sprites for road should also not include sprites for build busstation and build truckstop
17:03:04 <andythenorth> if road is not present I cannot build RAIL stop over ELRL
17:27:46 <frosch> all gui sprites are meh
17:29:37 <andythenorth> I would leave them out as far as possible
17:30:10 <andythenorth> it’s nice if they look like what you’re building, cos it’s WYSIWG
17:30:32 <andythenorth> but it’s more important that you can recognise them quickly, and they don’t change a lot between types
17:30:55 <andythenorth> they’re an icon, not a preview
17:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> if road is not present I cannot build RAIL stop over ELRL <-- why not?
17:31:12 <andythenorth> because it doesn’t work? o_O
17:31:37 <frosch> you can convert any station to any station by overbuilding, same as for railtypes
17:31:53 <frosch> you can only upgrade by building a station over plain track, same as for railtypes
17:32:12 <frosch> as said, it is as inconsistent as for railtypes :)
17:32:31 <frosch> but road does not have anything to do with it
17:34:16 <andythenorth> oh it’s too many variables, my report is wrong sorry :P
17:34:28 <andythenorth> testing requires a very precise set of actions, I didn’t do them :P
17:46:54 <Wolf01> Needs a better error than "Cannot build road here", is it possible to tell at least "not compatible roadtypes"?
17:51:43 * andythenorth biab, flat battery
17:52:21 <Eddi|zuHause> can you repair flat batteries with hotglue and tape?
17:52:33 <frosch> Wolf01: please also add a better message for railtypes :)
17:52:53 <Wolf01> Oh, they suffer from that disease too?
17:53:14 <Wolf01> I only use rail (no mono/magl) so I never noticed that :P
17:53:25 <frosch> Wolf01: i could not decide for what is the right behaviour, so i made it exactly the same as for railtypes
17:53:48 <Wolf01> It's ok for me, at least is consistent
17:53:53 <frosch> Eddi|zuHause: everything that easily burns is suitable to mess with batteries
17:55:31 <Wolf01> Bah... I'm watching a dvd rip because I'm too lazy to connect the dvd player and play my own dvd... but the overall quality makes me want to do that
17:55:56 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, back to my original question before: what i think should happen if you build a RAIL station on a tile that has ELRL is the same as when you build a RAIL trackbit on a tile that has ELRL, so it should automatically upgrade to ELRL
17:56:15 <Eddi|zuHause> no matter if there is ROAD or not
17:56:49 <Wolf01> And you shouldn't be able to build HAUL roadstop over ROAD
17:57:05 <Wolf01> But it builds ROAD roadstop instead
17:57:33 <Wolf01> It should be changed for train too if that's the case
17:58:35 <frosch> rail + elrail station -> elrail station; elrail + rail station -> command failed
17:58:52 <frosch> rail station + elrail station -> elrail station; elrail station + rail station -> rail station
17:59:32 <Wolf01> Which is not backwards compatible, so it will break your route
18:01:25 <Wolf01> That could be ok for non-track tiles... but meh
18:06:12 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd
18:30:55 *** Flygon_ has joined #openttd
18:37:43 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
18:45:16 <andythenorth> also now we can add subways
18:47:04 <frosch> maybe there should be an option to assign trucks to airports, to increase the airport cargo throughput
18:48:11 <andythenorth> transferring the baggage? o_O
18:48:49 <frosch> i did not dare to suggest to add inner-airport roads :p
18:49:11 <andythenorth> faster conveyor belts
18:49:25 <andythenorth> I need that no-junctions patch, for point-to-point
18:49:33 <andythenorth> then NRT can provide conveyors and pipes :P
18:50:05 <Eddi|zuHause> it really should not do that...
18:50:27 * andythenorth thinks Eddi just says that for encouragement
18:50:34 <frosch> since when can pipes not branch?
18:50:39 <andythenorth> reverse pyschology
18:50:54 <andythenorth> if they branch, how does the milk know which branch to take? :o
18:51:35 <frosch> the new one into the branch, the old one from the branch can continue
18:58:41 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd
19:06:57 <frosch> even andy's wifi is good compared to that :)
19:08:15 <Wolf01> <andythenorth> I need that no-junctions patch, for point-to-point <- lol
19:09:43 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
19:30:09 <Frage> Hey all. Anyone who can help me get openttd working on Android?
19:36:20 <andythenorth> Don’t leave me hanging on like a yo-yo
19:36:25 <andythenorth> Wake me up before you go-go
19:44:27 <andythenorth> ho, what smells bad about my ship size schema?
19:44:37 <andythenorth> I have large, small, mini, micro
19:45:47 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27715 trunk/src/lang/spanish.txt (2016-12-26 19:45:38 +0100 )
19:45:49 <DorpsGek> spanish: 2 changes by SilverSurferZzZ
19:50:04 <Alberth> "micro" for ships doesn't make much sense?
19:50:32 <Alberth> /me is just making random guesses
19:50:35 <Redirect_Left> Surely a 'micro' ship is just a dinghy?
19:50:50 <Redirect_Left> with a single envelope of mail on it
19:51:17 <Alberth> you send those by pigeon :)
19:52:09 <Alberth> hmm, aircraft set with pigeons :p
19:52:31 <Redirect_Left> Let's spice it up a bit, use owls!
19:52:37 <andythenorth> there’s no ‘medium'
19:52:39 <Redirect_Left> Pigeons are so predictable and old school!
19:52:43 <andythenorth> medium is boring
19:53:25 <Alberth> sounds like a nice experiment :)
19:56:51 <andythenorth> so what will the WaterTypes spec be? o_O
19:58:27 <frosch> i thought canal road is next?
20:05:34 * andythenorth needs electrified canal
20:06:25 <andythenorth> EELS would be the label
20:09:24 *** smoke_fumus has joined #openttd
20:12:18 <andythenorth> there are some extant in france
20:12:32 * andythenorth was trolling, but as usual RL trolls back stronger
20:12:36 <Redirect_Left> wow, that's an odd idea
20:12:59 <Redirect_Left> I assume there is some sort of huge fuse so if a certain part of it falls into the canal it won't kill all the wildlife in the water within X radius of the fault...
20:23:18 <Snail> hey Andy, I was looking for the list of your FIRS cargo
20:23:42 <Snail> but I fear it’s incomplete… I read somewhere you added some new cargoes like Explosives
20:23:46 <Snail> but I can’t fing them there
20:24:26 <frosch> try replacing "releases" with "push" in the url
20:49:25 <Snail> andythenorth: maybe a silly question… but don’t you think the Vehicles Factory could also churn out Engineering / Farm supplies?
20:49:34 <Snail> like excavators, tractors...
20:49:35 <andythenorth> but it doesn’t currently
20:50:07 <andythenorth> there is the Machine Shop for that
20:50:44 <andythenorth> it would be hard to decide whether to drop FMSP or ENSP
20:50:52 <andythenorth> it’s better to avoid the question
20:51:15 <Snail> ah…. because industries can only produce two products?
20:57:20 <andythenorth> not sure what to do for pax ships
20:57:32 <andythenorth> my notes say ‘probably all ideas are wrong’ :P
20:58:36 <andythenorth> - fast, very uncomfortable, normal loading
20:59:08 <andythenorth> - medium, +/-0 on comfort (cargo penalty), fast loading
20:59:23 <andythenorth> - slow, very comfortable (cargo payment bonus), slow loading
20:59:35 <andythenorth> and 3 sizes of each
21:01:11 <andythenorth> so hydrofoil/hovercraft; commuter ferry; pax liner
21:01:19 * andythenorth is seriously unconvinced
21:07:23 *** fleet75 has joined #openttd
21:08:21 <fleet75> idk but for some reason or another nuts train set seems give me a less than a frame a second, but only on servers
21:13:29 <frosch> and why would you blame that onto a train set?
21:16:02 <fleet75> if i join a server without the nuts train set which is 32bpp it works as expected
21:16:33 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest1003
21:16:33 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd
21:16:33 *** andythenorth_ is now known as andythenorth
21:17:19 <frosch> try disabling "full animation" in the menu
21:29:28 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
21:31:55 <fleet75> actually i have no idea that its nuts trains set but i think it might be
21:32:09 <fleet75> i have gone through all the different blitters and none of them have an affect on the framerate
21:32:58 <fleet75> the framerate dies as soon as you enter the server, going from like 2fps to 2 seconds a frame
21:34:59 <_dp_> fleet75, which server is it? Did you try any other servers with nuts?
21:37:53 <fleet75> i tried it on openttdcoop welcome server, public server, and pro zone server
21:38:23 <fleet75> the welcome server works absolutely fine, however the public and pro zone servers framerate do what i just said
21:39:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i'd also suspect the sprite cache
21:39:24 <Lejving> should mention that it worked fine offline fleet75 right?
21:40:06 <Eddi|zuHause> but make sure that it's not just their massive networks that slowing things dow
21:40:39 <Eddi|zuHause> (i did type that n, but then sausage-fingered backspace when hitting enter)
21:41:05 <fleet75> yup was going to mention that at one point i downloaded the pro zone server and it run as expected, and just ran the public server offline and it worked fine
21:41:38 <Eddi|zuHause> there's also a way to force the game to run in 8bpp mode, but it involves secret config settings
21:42:06 <Eddi|zuHause> that may or may not actually improve things
21:42:22 <fleet75> tried that, no effect
21:42:30 <fleet75> might not even be the nuts train set
21:42:46 <_dp_> fleet75, check citymania #0 it has nuts also
21:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause> more likely to be the industry set
21:42:55 <_dp_> most of it is disabled though...
21:43:50 <fleet75> prozone runs yeti, but public server doesnt
21:44:10 <Eddi|zuHause> fleet75: even if you specify 8bpp blitter on the command line, the game will still turn on 32bpp mode if a newgrf requests it, there's a separate config setting to override that
21:45:03 <fleet75> i changed the blitter setting in the openttd.cfg file if thats what you mean
21:45:13 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that's not enough
21:46:03 <fleet75> oh wheres the second config?
21:46:34 <fleet75> i thought it was as all the buttons seemed lower quality and the trains looked like they were in 8bpp
21:49:40 <Eddi|zuHause> i think it's the "support8bpp" option
21:49:54 <Eddi|zuHause> but you need to look at what the values are
21:50:07 <Eddi|zuHause> it was something like no/software/hardware or something
21:51:38 <Eddi|zuHause> it might be called differently, or changed
21:51:49 <Eddi|zuHause> my info on that is very old
21:53:01 <fleet75> yh its support8bpp u=i need to change it to system
21:54:09 <fleet75> it still doesnt seem to do anything
21:54:26 <fleet75> alot of other people on #openttdcoop seem to be having the same issue
21:56:46 <andythenorth> frosch: you’re away for some time now?
21:57:45 <frosch> yep, gone in an hour for 7..9 days
21:59:04 <frosch> my nrt todo list does not contain anything important, so people can play for a week :p
22:00:50 <andythenorth> happy new year :)
22:01:51 <frosch> btw. i made the "overlay" sprites optional
22:02:17 <frosch> at least i think i did :p
22:02:19 <andythenorth> ok so I could drop those from Road Hog
22:03:07 * andythenorth learning about ship size names
22:09:24 <peter1139> Nah, just my bicycle.
22:09:37 <peter1139> I actually leave my house these days.
22:15:36 <frosch> so you do that trip every 3 days?
22:17:49 <frosch> did you get a job as bicycle courier?
22:18:45 <frosch> otherwise that is quite a lot
22:19:15 <Wolf01> He's the newspaper delivery kid
22:23:28 <peter1139> Nah, 12km cycle commute to the office, plus weekend rides.
22:30:58 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
22:35:59 * andythenorth driven away by flakey wifi
22:38:48 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd
22:59:28 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd
22:59:28 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd
23:37:28 *** Flygon__ has joined #openttd
23:43:35 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd
23:43:46 <Supercheese> What is this madness?
23:45:29 <Wolf01> Didn't ever notice that
23:54:15 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd
23:54:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir
continue to next day ⏵