IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2014-07-27
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00:18:16 <encoded> when is openttd 3d comming out?
00:18:58 <encoded> in windows does openttd use DX, OGL or GDI ?
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01:03:47 <encoded> why not use SDL on windows?
01:06:08 <glx> SDL is not used on OSX either
01:08:02 <encoded> does it use CreateWindows and such for game windows??
01:08:40 <encoded> the rest is just drawn with magic
01:08:41 <glx> internal windows are just drawn on the screen
01:09:18 <encoded> where can i get a linux windowing system like ttd's ? hehe
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07:47:30 * andythenorth saves time on compiles
07:47:39 <andythenorth> by spending days re-building the compile
07:54:10 <andythenorth> ugh, there is going to be One Giant Commit when this is done
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07:55:46 * Alberth quotes the relevant xkcd cartoon
07:56:29 <Alberth> but think of all the new things you learned :)
07:56:57 <andythenorth> ultimately it makes a better structured project
07:57:18 <andythenorth> making it work with partial compiles and multiprocessing requires removal of string
08:00:10 <pipeep> Hey, I'm having issues connecting to my OpenTTD server over IPv6. Can someone else with an IPv6 connection try to connect to my server, so I can see if the problem is on comcast's side, or on my server's side?
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08:01:12 <pipeep> It's really strange because IPv4 works, and I can ping6 my server
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08:13:04 <Rubidium> maybe there's no port forwarding set up for IPv6? Or the firewall is blocking IPv6?
08:13:36 <pipeep> Rubidium, I don't have a firewall
08:14:06 <pipeep> Rubidium, and there's no port forwarding involved. I'm using a server from a real hosting provider (not some home router)
08:14:14 <pipeep> So the box has a dedicated IPv4 and IPv6
08:14:40 <pipeep> peter1138, there's issues with UFW and OpenVZ
08:14:42 <peter1138> You can connect to it via ssh right?
08:15:07 <pipeep> It's a iptables configuration tool
08:15:29 <peter1138> Oh, I tend to just use iptables direct.
08:15:43 <pipeep> And I know UDP traffic over IPv6 works because I use mosh, and that works over UDP
08:16:16 <peter1138> OpenTTD is TCP, bar the server list stuff.
08:16:17 <pipeep> peter1138, Yeah I think that would work, I'm just too lazy to learn another tool
08:17:02 <peter1138> I'd like to test, but I don't have anything with ipv6...
08:17:07 <Rubidium> pipeep: what ports/addresses does openttd say it's listening on when starting openttd with -D?
08:17:34 <Rubidium> or rather, just paste the whole output (pastebin or so)
08:17:36 <peter1138> ACtually I have access to one box with ipv6.
08:18:16 <peter1138> pipeep, 3979 is open from.
08:18:50 <peter1138> $ telnet ipv6.b.enjam.info 3979
08:18:50 <peter1138> Trying 2605:6400:10:a15d:feed:face:dead:beef...
08:18:50 <peter1138> Connected to ipv6.b.enjam.info.
08:18:50 <peter1138> Escape character is '^]'.
08:18:51 <peter1138> Connection closed by foreign host.
08:19:52 <Rubidium> okay, it's at least binding to ipv6. So not binding is ruled out as well
08:21:11 <pipeep> I ran `telnet ipv6.b.enjam.info 3979` on my local box just now, and that works
08:21:20 <Rubidium> too bad the tunnel IPv6 thing was just too unreliable, so I'm not using it anymore and don't have IPv6 connectivity (yay provider for promising to deliver IPv6 connectivity in summer of 2013...)
08:21:48 <peter1138> I think my provider does, but... my router isn't capable.
08:21:57 <Rubidium> peter1138: how quickly did the connection close?
08:22:05 <pipeep> Yeah, comcast sucks, but at least they have IPv6 support
08:22:06 <Rubidium> immediately or after a few seconds?
08:22:10 <peter1138> After a few seconds.
08:22:17 <pipeep> peter1138, my parents are in the same situation.
08:22:31 <Rubidium> then that's likely OpenTTD killing it due to idling
08:22:43 <Rubidium> don't think comcast provides service here
08:25:08 <pipeep> When it kills my telnet session, the I get the message in the openttd log: dbg: [net] [admin] Admin did not send its authorisation within 10 seconds
08:25:19 <pipeep> So yes, it's just OpenTTD killing the session for idling
08:28:19 <pipeep> If it helps, my server log shows I'm getting packets from the client: dbg: [net] [udp] queried from 2601:8:b180:205:2030:b886:ce3d:1d8d
08:28:31 <pipeep> Where 2601:8:b180:205:2030:b886:ce3d:1d8d is my comcast IP
08:39:24 <pipeep> I can connect to other IPv6 OpenTTD servers...
08:42:33 <pipeep> hmm... mosh is ipv4 only, so maybe udp over ipv6 truly is broken for my provider (although that doesn't explain why telnet gets through)
08:42:54 <pipeep> er... actually it does, telnet is tcp.
08:47:57 <pipeep> Eh, I'll deploy openttd to my testing box on a different provider tomorrow, and see if that has issues.
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09:41:24 <Wolf01> the silly fact is that I started mIRC about 1 hour and half ago, but never connected
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11:38:01 <Phreeze> i think i'm starting a game in 32bpp
11:38:16 <Phreeze> first time ever (besides an early version waaaaaaaaaaay back when only trains were 32bpp)
11:40:03 <Phreeze> it's not easy to find out WHICH newgrfs have 32bpp....
11:40:25 <kero> the new one of V453000 does
11:40:38 <Phreeze> 287mb for yeti and pine xD
11:40:45 <Phreeze> yes i know them + zbase
11:40:51 <Phreeze> but there are more...
11:40:52 <kero> there's also the last of Pikkabird
11:41:05 <Phreeze> 8/32bpp 2CC trains, obviously
11:48:14 <Rubidium> Phreeze: >50 MiB... likely 32bpp, <200kiB... likely not 32bpp
11:49:05 <Rubidium> also... 32bpp is ambiguous
11:49:39 <Rubidium> is a NewGRF with 32bpp normal zoom sprites only 32bpp enough for you? Or is it more about the larger/higher resolution sprites?
11:52:51 <Phreeze> it should look "other than 8bpp" :D
11:53:12 <Phreeze> i must say, i really hate the 32bpp GUI. it's just ugly...
11:53:32 <Phreeze> and still dont get it why the "train" symbol etc. are so small
11:54:02 <Phreeze> those gradiants...arff...it looks like a child has drawn them or like they are still temporary pictures
11:54:26 <Alberth> fire up the sprite editor, and make better ones :)
11:54:33 <Alberth> ranting here doesn't fix it
11:58:03 <Rubidium> you mean zbase? The set effectively made by one drawer, making about 10.000 sprites in about 3.5 months, just so there would be a 32bpp base set that people can build upon
12:00:01 <Rubidium> for what it's worth, the first opengfx alpha came out a mere 11 months after they (a group) started
12:00:37 <Rubidium> the first non alpha another 10-11 months later
12:02:27 <Rubidium> oh... after basically 24 months from the announcement the first "complete" OpenGFX was released. zBase after ~3 months
12:02:41 <Rubidium> no wonder zBase isn't looking as finished
12:03:27 <LordAro> zeph did most of the ogfx sprites himself as well
12:05:31 <Phreeze> i know, i appreciate the really good work
12:05:37 <Phreeze> but the gui is uncool ^^
12:09:32 <LordAro> make new ones then ;)
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12:15:18 <Phreeze> i'm horrible at it :) i'm just good at ranting ;)
12:18:52 <Alberth> you're creating a negative mood in the channel for no good reason
12:24:10 <Phreeze> srsly...it's my right to discuss stuff....
12:24:52 <Phreeze> i just think, that 32bpp looks really nice, especially all the trains, wagons etc, but the gui creates a contrast to this
12:25:15 <Phreeze> my opinion..if we dont chat/discuss, we dont need an irc channel...
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12:34:32 <Alberth> discussing would be about solving the problem, wouldn't it?
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12:35:08 <Phreeze> no, it's about talking aboth sth
12:35:41 <Phreeze> a bit like the bad features thread ;)
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13:10:33 <V453000> trying to continue with yeti ... sprite: sprite_industry_3X_tile00_under(14); screams "sprite_industry_3X_tile00_under is not defined as a function ... what do I do with this? it looks like this in the sprite layout http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/3551/
13:16:28 <Rubidium> apparantly the function doesn't exist (different name?); might it be 3x?
13:16:31 <Alberth> line 7 says "...anim"
13:17:15 <Alberth> hmm, that seems correct, you didn't paste both names :(
13:17:56 <Alberth> like RB says, the common mistake is a typo in the name
13:18:13 <V453000> it indeed doesnt exist
13:18:44 <Alberth> yep, computers are much better readers than us :p
13:19:04 <V453000> oh yeah I see the issue now
13:19:16 <V453000> that is exactly what happens if you stop doing something without finishing it
13:19:35 <V453000> it was not 3X at all, I Actually removed the identifier because I made one "under" for all industries
13:19:43 <V453000> and obviously I forgot about that
13:19:48 <Alberth> yeah, you are not to leave the computer until all yeti is finished :p
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13:57:54 <Phreeze> V453000 : could you just add a transparency-effect ? i often build tracks and stations in transparent mode, so i can see slopes etc. but i often run into the yeti industries ^^
13:58:25 <Phreeze> (is it the basement-gfx ? whatever it is called, it is "invisible" at the moment ;) )
14:00:21 <Eddi|zuHause> it needs a custom "ground sprite"
14:00:22 <Phreeze> hm and what wagons can transport grain ? i think i miss some Newgrf
14:00:43 <Phreeze> grain hopper can not be refitted to "grain" xD
14:00:59 <Eddi|zuHause> from the base set?
14:01:01 <Phreeze> using 8/32bpp 2cc trains and pineaccle
14:01:31 <Eddi|zuHause> that's probably a bug in the train set
14:02:16 <Eddi|zuHause> train set should just accept any cargo configuration the industry throws at it
14:02:23 <Eddi|zuHause> no matter how weird it is
14:02:43 <Eddi|zuHause> "you want grain transported as liquid? sure."
14:03:32 <Phreeze> hm im not ok with that
14:03:47 <Phreeze> are the opengfx+ train 0.3.0 in 32bit too ?
14:04:07 <Eddi|zuHause> probably some alpha versions
14:11:32 <V453000> Phreeze: yeti explicitly says it is recommended to use nuts :) I have no idea about other train sets
14:13:27 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: so what weird things do you set for cargo classes?
14:21:51 <Phreeze> you are the source :D
14:23:16 <V453000> yes but I have lesser clue about the cargo, I coded it as I thought is fine
14:23:23 <V453000> so I dont have any other answer for eddi :)
14:32:30 <Phreeze> perhaps you can look into the "grain" code :) thx in advance ;)
14:32:58 <V453000> just use nuts for now
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16:06:34 <V453000> both animation and underlay broken :D
16:20:12 <LSky`> was there a way to switch to a certain order instead of skipping through each one ?
16:20:52 <Alberth> not that I am aware of
16:23:37 <Eddi|zuHause> select it and ctrl+click on "skip order"
16:26:07 <Eddi|zuHause> hidden features are hidden :)
16:37:27 <kero> Succeded. Vehicles are waiting in depots :)
16:38:32 <kero> Should help for better timetabling ...
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16:54:24 <LordAro> this is fun, i have a python program which responds to INT, but not TERM
16:54:48 <LordAro> so i have to close my terminal window to kill it
16:55:17 <LordAro> and the best part, the backtrace is coming from inside the stdlib
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17:46:00 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r26704 trunk/src/lang/slovak.txt (2014-07-27 17:45:52 UTC)
17:46:01 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:46:02 <DorpsGek> norwegian_bokmal - 1 changes by
17:46:03 <DorpsGek> slovak - 5 changes by Milsa
17:46:51 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r26705 trunk/src/lang/slovak.txt (2014-07-27 17:46:46 UTC)
17:46:52 <DorpsGek> -Fix: WT3 validation error
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18:16:09 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r26706 trunk/src/vehicle.cpp (2014-07-27 18:16:03 UTC)
18:16:10 <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#6015] (r20644): wrong breakdown sound was played for ships
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18:47:51 <Eddi|zuHause> the song goes "la le lu"
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18:48:43 <andythenorth> is it worth caring about StringIO versus cStringIO for a couple of hundred lines?
18:49:27 <SpComb> profile first, then optimize
18:52:52 <andythenorth> my guess is more time spent profiling than will be saved in next ~ 2 years
18:53:06 <Eddi|zuHause> then don't do it
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19:05:04 <andythenorth> is there a nice one-liner in python 2 to get me the last non-blank line of a file?
19:06:34 <andythenorth> filter(None, (line.rstrip() for line in dummy_nfo.readlines()))[-1]
19:09:10 <Eddi|zuHause> what do you need that for?
19:11:40 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i'd have some performance concerns about building a list when iterating would be enough
19:12:03 <andythenorth> alternative method?
19:12:35 <andythenorth> I am just doing c+p from stack overflow, so chances are there’s a better way
19:12:46 <andythenorth> this is just to find the last line of dummy.nfo to split on it
19:13:05 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds dangerous
19:13:35 <andythenorth> I’m accepting the ris
19:13:47 <andythenorth> until someone commits a comments patch, there isn’t a better way afaict
19:14:27 <Eddi|zuHause> you can configure the devzone to use it
19:14:46 <andythenorth> is it maintained?
19:15:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i updated it a few weeks ago
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19:49:59 <andythenorth> I can’t get nmlc to encode the lang strings using partial nfo
19:50:25 <andythenorth> this is specific to cargos
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20:12:00 <Eddi|zuHause> then just don't do it.
20:12:06 <Eddi|zuHause> keep the cargos in the main header
20:14:32 <andythenorth> I’m concatenating the header with the cargo nml before calling nmlc
20:14:59 <andythenorth> nmlc isn’t writing any strings out
20:18:37 <andythenorth> this nml *does* produce a valid single-cargo grf when encoded directly with nmlc
20:18:42 <andythenorth> so the nml looks ok
20:18:51 * andythenorth one step at a time
20:22:37 <andythenorth> and the nml -> nfo -> grfcodec grf looks ok
20:38:53 * andythenorth moves the cargos into the header :P
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20:51:13 <andythenorth> nmlc is writing the action 4s in with a lot of other header stuff
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20:51:31 <andythenorth> I need to split the header, or I have invalid grf due to too many action 8s
20:51:38 <andythenorth> invalid grf / nfo /s
20:51:48 <andythenorth> splitting the header loses the strings
20:52:18 <frosch123> filter the intermediate files for action 8/14?
20:52:22 <andythenorth> I could write my own action 4s out and concatenate them, but it won’t work
20:52:31 <andythenorth> yeah, I’ll have to filter on action 8 or so
20:52:50 <andythenorth> could I teach nmlc to drop actions by number?
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20:53:30 <frosch123> you could also try to let all files output the strings even, and drop them for all but one again
20:53:38 <frosch123> if you are lucky they will use the same ids
20:54:22 <andythenorth> that’s roughly what I’m trying to do
20:54:35 <andythenorth> but I can’t think how to reliably split the action 8 off
20:54:57 <andythenorth> this is a non-problem for trains, nmlc writes the action 4s out conveniently near to the action 0s
20:55:02 <andythenorth> not up with the header stuff
20:55:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i can only repeat what i said before
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20:57:48 <andythenorth> I could move all the industries into the header too
20:57:51 <andythenorth> maybe that would work ok
21:03:14 <Eddi|zuHause> well the whole concept always was fragile because it depended on nmlc not reordering stuff too far
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21:06:43 <andythenorth> it’s so close to working
21:06:53 <andythenorth> but it’s going to end up held together with tape
21:08:11 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, it's easy to filter out action 4, because you know exactly which byte to grep for. just make sure you get all the relevant lines afterwards
21:16:10 <Eddi|zuHause> the most sophisticated approach would be to modify a tool like nforenum, which already has a full nfo parser and output
21:23:32 <andythenorth> just got one step closer
21:23:40 <andythenorth> cargo names were working
21:23:47 <andythenorth> now industry extra text is working too
21:27:43 <andythenorth> but industry names are all ‘Alcohol’ :P
21:33:41 <Eddi|zuHause> something completely different: i always wondered why the game doesn't force loading openttd.grf before loading the base set? it's the only base grf file that ever changes, so why rely on outside projects to get updated, when all the necessary data is there anyway?
21:34:27 <Eddi|zuHause> in the worst case, the data is overwritten by the base set anyway
21:36:47 <andythenorth> if I encode just (for example) aluminium_plant.nfo, then I also get a valid grf, with all cargos and one industry
21:36:58 <andythenorth> so I guess I’m going to have to do a more sophisticated split
21:37:25 <andythenorth> I have *zero* idea how to work nforenum
21:37:43 <andythenorth> but the idea of having args to drop certain actions - sensible?
21:44:01 <frosch123> maybe you can instruct nforenum to refomat the grf to not use any linebreaks within nfo lines
21:44:10 <frosch123> then it is an easy grep filter to get rid of actions
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21:47:31 <andythenorth> turn off the beautifier
21:52:40 <andythenorth> I could probably dump in all the industries, and their extra text cbs
21:53:03 <andythenorth> compiling those still wouldn’t take long compared to all spritelayouts crap
21:53:06 <glx> IIRC steam uses a dropdown
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