IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-12-23
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07:28:23 <NGC3982> Morning Morning
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08:04:49 <andythenorth> retina screen breaks my screenshots :P
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12:08:59 <Xaroth|Work> make me some as well will ya?
12:12:20 <Eddi|zuHause> sudo make me a sandwich
12:13:39 * andythenorth gets a PyPy buildout
12:13:47 <andythenorth> see if I can test this firs compile
12:14:20 <andythenorth> meh, buildout failed
12:16:13 <andythenorth> stuff happening now
12:16:44 <Eddi|zuHause> i'll never understand the fascination about "buildouts"
12:16:59 <andythenorth> you don't have the use case
12:17:26 <andythenorth> tens of thousands of people working on python web frameworks do ;)
12:17:43 <Xaroth|Work> i never use buildout :|
12:17:47 * Xaroth|Work works on python web frameworks
12:17:51 <andythenorth> you probably do django?
12:18:30 <Xaroth|Work> then again, I build stuff for customers
12:18:43 <Xaroth|Work> so they are kinda stuck on how it's installed
12:18:47 <Xaroth|Work> since that's part of the contract
12:18:59 <Xaroth|Work> we build it, we install it, that way they can't fuck it up
12:19:17 <Xaroth|Work> but that also goes for other things we make
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12:20:18 <andythenorth> how do devs on your team get a project environment?
12:20:33 <andythenorth> have you packaged it up somehow? Vagrant or something?
12:20:52 <andythenorth> setuptools? o_O :P
12:20:52 <Xaroth|Work> we have sandbox systems, and we specify a setup.py with requirements.txt for virtualenvs
12:21:23 <Xaroth|Work> and yes, vagrant/buildout can probably work smooth, but most of the people are used to this
12:21:42 <Xaroth|Work> and they know how to fix things if it breaks (read: if they break it)
12:25:41 <andythenorth> who now has broken python everywhere
12:28:40 <andythenorth> this is why we have backups :P
12:30:27 <Rubidium> backups? What are those?
12:31:08 * Rubidium works at a company that supposedly makes backups, but never does a recovery test
12:31:36 <Rubidium> so much fun to find out that the database backup doesn't end up in the backup because it was filtered out
12:38:48 * Rubidium wonders whether to blame the backup tool of SQL server though... for respectively not backing up .bak or for making backups to .bak
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13:17:09 <ZxBiohazardZx> anyone good with reversers/pathfinding? i cant see why my train is making a turn to a red signal instead of going into a reverser
13:17:50 <Xaroth|Work> ZxBiohazardZx: upload a few images to imgur, that might help
13:18:29 <ZxBiohazardZx> i expect trains to go to Q5, but instead they go for C
13:19:21 <Xaroth|Work> ZxBiohazardZx: I don't see a route from Q5 to the station
13:20:08 <ZxBiohazardZx> it is a reverser, it should route to the depot / via depot to the entrance again (its a loop)
13:21:02 <ZxBiohazardZx> and loop has a direct run back into the station entrance, hence imo it should work :P
13:39:10 <Taede> what is yapf.rail_firstred_twoway_eol set to ZxBiohazardZx ?
13:44:52 <ZxBiohazardZx> you can have a look, 1.3.3 -> biohazards realm
13:45:13 <ZxBiohazardZx> station @ Dadingworth is causing the random stuff, i got them to overflow after changing the reverser to a loop
13:45:24 <ZxBiohazardZx> but now they wont go into the depot, and instead block depot exit
13:45:57 <Taede> yapf.rail_firstred_twoway_eol is usually set to 1 on coop-servers, to make overflows like that work
13:46:18 <ZxBiohazardZx> ill try setting it
13:47:23 <ZxBiohazardZx> thx that worked :)
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13:53:28 <ZxBiohazardZx> thx again Taede :)
13:53:36 <andythenorth> he always comes when I mention his name
13:57:39 <andythenorth> frosch123: any reason against modifying cb 10 so effect vehicle xyz pos is returned in register 0x100?
13:57:46 <andythenorth> other than "it's work"
13:59:18 <andythenorth> "since this is performance critical NewGRFs cannot define their own models." \o/
14:01:00 <andythenorth> we could have SmokeTypes
14:01:03 <andythenorth> and SmokeTypeLabels
14:01:15 <peter1138> SmokeTypeTranslationTables
14:01:22 <andythenorth> it might be worth putting into the forums 'to develop a spec for the future'
14:01:24 <andythenorth> maybe on April 1
14:01:37 <peter1138> Let's drop everything and make it with 3D models.
14:01:43 <frosch123> don't forget extra zoom
14:01:52 <frosch123> a proper smoke spec needs to be retina compatible
14:02:03 <frosch123> so, say 1kx1k smoke sprites
14:02:33 <andythenorth> frosch123: as it happens OpenTTD is very very retina compatible
14:02:45 <andythenorth> unlike most of the internets
14:03:04 <frosch123> yeah, i have used my retina for years to watch it
14:03:35 <andythenorth> - is it just nicer to repeat the cb until 'no more effects' is returned?
14:03:38 <andythenorth> similar to articulated parts
14:05:21 <Eddi|zuHause> suggestion: black steam engine smoke when accelerating heavily at low speed, white smoke when "idling" at top speed
14:05:40 <Eddi|zuHause> with greyscales inbetween
14:05:48 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: now you want a custom palette transform? :P
14:06:17 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: that case is covered
14:07:00 <andythenorth> frosch123: my only other comment is that I zoned out around "Custom effects"
14:07:31 <andythenorth> seems to have a lot of TODO and unresolved. TMWFTLB?
14:08:35 <Eddi|zuHause> hm, my NTFS external drive tends to get cluttered by .fuse_hidden files
14:09:58 <frosch123> andythenorth: eddi wants to use it, he just said :p
14:10:19 <andythenorth> well extend the spec later :D
14:10:24 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause needs some sprites first
14:10:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i have loads of sprites
14:10:50 <Eddi|zuHause> i finally got around to involving pixa
14:11:12 <andythenorth> oh god, now I have a user :P
14:11:17 <andythenorth> I am obliged to do support
14:11:26 <frosch123> andythenorth: i do not much like the "iterative calls of cb"
14:11:38 <frosch123> they do the same 99% of the time
14:11:47 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: can pixa output 32bpp?
14:12:01 <frosch123> if you have multiple smoke sprites, they are more arranged like a industry layout
14:12:04 <andythenorth> probably, just teach it a different palette?
14:12:05 <frosch123> rather than independent things
14:12:21 <andythenorth> pixa doesn't make (many) assumptions, it's just a processor
14:13:12 <andythenorth> frosch123: ok, I am easily convinced
14:14:09 <Eddi|zuHause> that one is not pixa-generated :p
14:16:35 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the autogenerated files are not in the repository
14:17:17 <Eddi|zuHause> they look like "template<4,default>(0..2:box<6>(0..4:grey-4,5:grey-3),3:box<8>(0..6:grey-4,7:grey-3))"
14:20:09 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: wich then looks like this: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/V_4_default_8bpp_normal.pixa.png
14:20:25 <andythenorth> frosch123: so with this spec, I could trigger existing diesel smoke sprites, using the steam spawning model? o_O
14:20:39 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: pretty neat
14:23:13 <andythenorth> avoids patching vehicle.cpp
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14:28:54 <andythenorth> (existing diesel smoke generation model is daft for ships)
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15:00:49 <andythenorth> frosch123: is smoke something you're interested in working on? It's a nice feature, and I have some time right now to help :) If not, it will keep :)
15:01:22 <frosch123> well, it's something on the list to code when some grf author is interested in using :p
15:01:33 <frosch123> but maybe not exactly today :p
15:02:03 <frosch123> you know, not all releases are done for this year
15:07:48 <andythenorth> I will go make some trains or something in that case
15:11:32 <andythenorth> unless anyone wants to collaborate on a GS? o_O
15:11:36 <andythenorth> just a simple one...?
15:19:32 <andythenorth> hmm GS looks like 'proper' programming
15:20:27 <andythenorth> there's actually some kind of loop running or something
15:23:12 <frosch123> use zuu's "minimal gs" as starting point :)
15:23:20 <frosch123> it's a sticky in the script dev forum
15:24:17 <andythenorth> I was reading SV :)
15:24:24 <andythenorth> might as well dive straight in
15:24:31 <andythenorth> I'm not good with 'build it up in small pieces'
15:24:34 <frosch123> that is based on the minimal gs as well :p
15:24:48 <andythenorth> better to get something existing, and try 'wtf?' on it
15:27:15 <andythenorth> code looks ok, need someone to kick at my ideas though
15:34:59 <andythenorth> so why do so many of us turn off the stuff that screws with you - breakdowns, disasters, fluctuating economy...?
15:36:20 <frosch123> disasters and recessions are nothing you can influence
15:36:29 <frosch123> you cannot play differently to avoid them
15:36:41 <frosch123> some think that breakdowns are also something that you cannot influence
15:36:48 <frosch123> but that is actually a lie
15:36:57 <frosch123> as such i play with breakdowns in singleplayer
15:37:13 <andythenorth> I would play breakdowns if I could make servicing work :)
15:37:21 <andythenorth> but I have EAndythenorth in that respect :)
15:37:31 <frosch123> it enriches the engine selection and your network needs to be somewhat redjundant to it
15:37:51 <frosch123> automatic servicing is broken :p
15:37:57 <frosch123> always use manual servicing
15:38:08 <andythenorth> oh so it's a known issue now? o_O
15:38:11 <andythenorth> I thought it was just me :)
15:38:11 <frosch123> either orders, or forced visits via track layout
15:38:34 <andythenorth> is there some pathfinder problem?
15:38:38 <frosch123> automatic servicing can work for inner-town bus networks
15:38:42 <frosch123> but not for serious transport
15:38:51 <andythenorth> RVs have been broken for years, but trains used to work with PBS signal in front of deport
15:38:56 <andythenorth> that now seems to be ignored
15:40:03 <frosch123> though if you are particulary lazy (like i am sometimes), you can put it right at the loading stations
15:40:18 <frosch123> make all ariving trains run into the depot before loading
15:40:38 <frosch123> that way the depot also deals as buffer when the production fluctuates and removes unneeeded trains from the network
15:41:06 <frosch123> for that don't put any signals between depot and platofrm, so trains only leave the depot, if a platform is empty
15:41:19 <frosch123> and well, set service interval to maximum :p
15:42:58 <andythenorth> yeah that screenie describes forced servicing :) Pretty brutally :)
15:43:43 <andythenorth> so anyway, my aim is to make a nice GS for single player
15:43:48 <andythenorth> we have some good ones for MP
15:43:58 <andythenorth> and I want it to occasionally screw with you :)
15:45:13 <frosch123> if i do not want to build anything particular fancy
15:46:07 <frosch123> but well, it also works with exit-presignals at the station, instead of pbs
15:46:17 <andythenorth> why is that tram clipping? :P
15:48:11 <frosch123> it is on foundations
15:48:30 <frosch123> and the length of the last vehicle part is incorrect
15:48:48 <frosch123> side effect of the length rrefit i guess
15:49:09 <frosch123> the foundation is sorted in front of the vehicle bb, since the vehicle bb is on the tile in front
16:01:45 <andythenorth> so what are nice goals for single player?
16:02:43 <andythenorth> are they trackable?
16:02:45 <frosch123> non-point-to-point connections
16:03:54 <andythenorth> "Quackpool wants a cut of the lucrative cargo transfer business. Transfer 10,000t per year at Quackpool for a reward of [xyz]"
16:04:56 <frosch123> well, transporting cargo somehwere, just to transport it back :p
16:05:16 <frosch123> it would be cool if you could count the amount of cargo that is transfered between rv, trains and ships
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16:05:24 <andythenorth> that's what I intended ^
16:05:31 <andythenorth> dunno how to enforce it though
16:06:15 <frosch123> score = "cargo transported on one vehicle type" + 4 * "cargo transported by two vehicle types" + 9 * "cargo transported by 3 vehicle types" + 16 * "cargo transported by 4 vehicle types" ...
16:06:24 <andythenorth> "The Governor of Quackpool is tired of your noisy trains. You may only use river boats from now on. You may keep your existing railways."
16:07:23 <andythenorth> ok so for what you describe, something like "intermodal bonus: use 4 transport types"
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16:07:30 <frosch123> nah: as a measurement against terrorirsm the government has the intention to obfuscate cargo flows
16:07:42 <andythenorth> it's more less narrative, more like the rewards in the casual games I've been playing
16:07:45 <frosch123> help them to make it hard to track where cargos comes from and goes to
16:09:42 <andythenorth> dunno if GS can do this?
16:09:54 <andythenorth> would need to track packets somehow?
16:10:02 <frosch123> you can read orders and vehicle loads
16:10:21 <frosch123> well, you will likely only get some approximation
16:10:25 <frosch123> not the exact thing :p
16:10:53 <andythenorth> - average speed per passenger mile between two towns?
16:11:06 <andythenorth> sounds tedious, but would be a nice micro-challenge
16:14:06 <andythenorth> I am thinking stuff more like 'deliver at least 2000t / month to five different ports' or such
16:14:37 <andythenorth> GS only knows about industries via accepted / produced cargos?
16:17:49 <frosch123> yup, no name or anything
16:18:05 <frosch123> and primary/secondary, fundable/prospectable
16:18:32 <andythenorth> I could generate a lookup table from FIRS code :P
16:19:26 <frosch123> you can also track the shape of the industry then :p
16:19:54 <andythenorth> oh, so I could go measure individual tiles? :P
16:20:34 <frosch123> and very specific to a firs version :)
16:21:18 <andythenorth> so is there such a thing as a single-sided subsidy?
16:21:27 <andythenorth> i.e. only destination or source is specified
16:22:01 <andythenorth> I meant existing subsidy machinery
16:22:06 <frosch123> allows tracking of delivery at source or destination
16:22:19 <andythenorth> I was thinking of adjusting rates
16:22:33 <andythenorth> "Quackpool Textile Mill has a big contract, deliver Wool"
16:22:59 <andythenorth> "Bubbleville Mine will pay double for enough supplies to max production"
16:23:53 <frosch123> who cares about money
16:24:01 <frosch123> add score as an alternative to money
16:25:11 <andythenorth> ha ha you gave me an idea
16:25:31 <andythenorth> all these stupid casual games have 'money' and also 'bucks' or 'gems'
16:25:47 <andythenorth> all the good stuff needs bucks or gems :P
16:25:58 <andythenorth> which costs real money on the other fruit store :P
16:26:04 <frosch123> yup, there are always two types of money
16:26:15 <frosch123> one easy to get, one hard to get, but also gettable via real money :p
16:26:29 <andythenorth> maybe I introduce one that you get by having fun :P
16:26:39 <andythenorth> can we trade it?
16:27:02 <frosch123> you could offer that for some fee :p
16:27:22 <andythenorth> pay someone to fix the mac port :P
16:28:31 <andythenorth> could the extra currency be used to 'unlock' map sections?
16:33:57 <andythenorth> does GS have a UI with dialogs?
16:35:02 <frosch123> there are questions in pop-up windows, similar to the engine preview
16:37:14 <andythenorth> found the popups
16:38:05 <andythenorth> presumably, if user went to a story book page, a question dialog could be shown
16:38:42 <frosch123> zuu is working on interactive story book elements
16:38:49 <andythenorth> doesn't matter, getting ahead of myself :)
16:39:08 <andythenorth> just thinking about the option to have some kind of 'get access to territories' method
16:39:15 <andythenorth> without having to trigger dialog every month :P
16:40:14 <andythenorth> "Where would you like to start your career" is a pretty common mechanic in sims
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16:42:20 <Eddi|zuHause> <frosch123> that way the depot also deals as buffer when the production fluctuates and removes unneeeded trains from the network <-- that used to be very broken, as trains were only serviced on entering a depot, not exiting. so when they waited too long, they left with 0% reliability
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16:43:02 <frosch123> i am not playing with ottd 0.4
16:44:53 <andythenorth> ha that must have been fun to find :)
16:45:13 <andythenorth> frosch123: so plant HQ to get first territory? Or you think it's just a silly mechanic? o_O
16:46:07 <frosch123> as in at least two gs use that mechanic
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18:08:02 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r26171 trunk/src/newgrf_storage.h (2013-12-23 18:07:57 UTC)
18:08:03 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Make TemporaryStorageArray keep track of assigned registers. Also make clearing the array 'cheaper'.
18:08:23 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r26172 /trunk/src (newgrf_spritegroup.cpp newgrf_spritegroup.h) (2013-12-23 18:08:16 UTC)
18:08:24 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Make SpriteGroup::Resolve aware of nested calls.
18:08:42 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r26173 /trunk/src (newgrf_spritegroup.cpp newgrf_storage.h) (2013-12-23 18:08:36 UTC)
18:08:43 <DorpsGek> -Change: [NewGRF] Reset the temporary storage registers for every sprite resolving.
18:09:09 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r26174 /trunk/src (5 files) (2013-12-23 18:09:03 UTC)
18:09:10 <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Rename BaseStorageArray to BasePersistentStorageArray
18:09:35 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r26175 /trunk/src (9 files in 2 dirs) (2013-12-23 18:09:29 UTC)
18:09:36 <DorpsGek> -Add: Log in desync output when persistent storage is discarded.
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20:08:40 <andythenorth> ho a congo heightmap
20:10:31 <frosch123> hmm, has congo sea-access?
20:11:07 <Eddi|zuHause> unless you mean the river, instead of the country
20:11:10 <frosch123> likely only a few km
20:11:13 <frosch123> but technically it has
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20:12:25 <Eddi|zuHause> well it also depends on which congo you mean :p
20:12:33 <Eddi|zuHause> there's two of them
20:12:41 <frosch123> not in the andy scenario
20:13:12 <andythenorth> it's a bit generic tbh
20:13:35 <andythenorth> but the FIRS economy kind of demands some coast :P
20:13:40 <andythenorth> otherwise it doesn't work
20:14:39 <andythenorth> it actually works quite well with the height map on bananas
20:14:50 <andythenorth> it has built all the port industries in sensible places
20:17:12 <andythenorth> now if only I could have sensible GS goals coinciding with a sensible map :)
20:17:17 <andythenorth> it's a lot of restarts :P
20:17:39 <Eddi|zuHause> set the goals per parameter?
20:18:18 <andythenorth> NoCarGoal has no option for that :)
20:18:24 <andythenorth> I could patch it... :P
20:21:37 * andythenorth tries cdist for pax, and manual for other stuff
20:22:41 <andythenorth> herp, with cdist I could stop station walking over the whole city :P
20:24:20 <andythenorth> so what vehicle orders work with cdist?
20:24:53 <planetmaker> they'll be full anyway :)
20:25:22 <andythenorth> the wiki page has warnings about certain orders not being supported
20:25:37 <Eddi|zuHause> that should be outdated
20:25:58 <Eddi|zuHause> all combinations of load/unload orders should be supported
20:26:36 <andythenorth> can we split the 90' setting for ships and trains?
20:26:41 <Eddi|zuHause> and problematic were only ever "no unloading" and "no loading" options
20:26:48 <andythenorth> ship routing is quite borked without 90'
20:27:14 <Eddi|zuHause> ship routing should be fine with yapf
20:27:25 <Eddi|zuHause> except for where you place your dock
20:27:34 <Eddi|zuHause> it needs space to turn around there
20:27:47 <andythenorth> it's fine with 90' allowed
20:27:55 <andythenorth> otherwise all kinds of bad happens
20:28:16 <Eddi|zuHause> ships should just be allowed to turn in place
20:28:39 <andythenorth> ho horses are rubbish :)
20:28:50 * andythenorth is having all those observations that come from playing a game :P sorry
20:29:21 <andythenorth> or have observations?
20:29:36 <andythenorth> dare anyone patch in a flat dock?
20:29:42 <andythenorth> just to, you know, see if it works?
20:31:28 <andythenorth> ha ha I just thought of a hideous hack for that
20:33:59 <andythenorth> maybe FIRS can provide flat docks
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20:41:14 <Eddi|zuHause> sure it can, but you won't be able to connect stations to them for transferring
20:42:44 <andythenorth> everything would have to be actually transferred by barge?
20:42:52 <andythenorth> also placement would be a PITA
20:43:03 <andythenorth> I tried turning off the slope check for docks, but all I got for christmas was an assert :)
20:46:05 <Eddi|zuHause> step 1: allow multi-stop docks
20:46:23 <Eddi|zuHause> step 2: make every side of the dock stop-able, unless blocked by land
20:46:36 <Eddi|zuHause> step 3: allow single-tile docks
20:47:32 <andythenorth> didn't peter1138 have a patch for 1?
20:50:49 <Eddi|zuHause> (why must i always think of blink when i say that?)
20:53:11 <andythenorth> yair, some kind of dist is needed for town cargos :)
20:53:24 <andythenorth> I have no-dist for alcohol, it's all going to one hotel
20:53:30 <andythenorth> hundreds of tons of it will be needed :P
21:04:04 <andythenorth> FIRS has 1 bag of diamond = 1t of cargo
21:04:22 <andythenorth> I guess they'd have to travel in a safe in the vehicle :P
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21:06:17 <Eddi|zuHause> rename it "one safe of diamonds"? :p
21:06:51 <Eddi|zuHause> just set the weight to 1/16 or something
21:07:04 <andythenorth> oh :( the diamond mines are 700 tiles away from the trading posts
21:07:09 <andythenorth> and I have no aircraft in 1870 :P
21:07:13 <Eddi|zuHause> assuming that's the lowest unit
21:07:13 <andythenorth> this is just like real life :P
21:09:21 <Eddi|zuHause> when you're not in the desert
21:09:48 <andythenorth> 700 tiles is a long way at 10mph (fake speed)
21:14:19 <Eddi|zuHause> start with short routes :p
21:14:55 <Eddi|zuHause> the silk road wasn't built in a day
21:16:27 <Rubidium> it isn't even a road...
21:16:58 <Eddi|zuHause> it's not made of silk either
21:17:28 * andythenorth started with short routes ;)
21:17:34 <andythenorth> I have 92 years or so to make this cargo goal
21:18:14 <Eddi|zuHause> use cargodist and autorefit to increase the distance steadily
21:18:49 <Eddi|zuHause> cargodist should be fixed to initiate multiple links if autorefit is enabled
21:19:07 <andythenorth> I am steering clear of cdist for cargo right now :)
21:19:11 <andythenorth> until I understand it more
21:19:48 <andythenorth> sometimes a 'load x%' would be useful
21:20:07 <andythenorth> we seem to have some conditional orders system that I don't understand, that can do that by sending trains in circles
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21:21:55 <Zuu> andythenorth: Regarding NoCarGoal params I did consider to make a setting which will delay assignment of goal cargo is delayed and done using an in-game dialog. Possible similar to how the chapter selection in Beginner Tutorial is implemented and then run it 3 times to get all three cargoes.
21:23:13 <Zuu> But so far I haven't actually made it as it will only work in single player or MP games with supervision.
21:23:33 <Zuu> Though maybe it is not a bad thing that the solution require an active MP admin :-)
21:26:04 <andythenorth> I don't suppose we'd consider removing 'auto-refit any' ?
21:26:56 <andythenorth> setting fixed refit orders would be faster if there was only one step - dropdown of cargos
21:27:09 <andythenorth> maybe with 'any' or 'no change'
21:30:43 <andythenorth> urgh, more borked refits
21:30:56 <andythenorth> 'transfer and wait for full load' simply doesn't work with a refit
21:31:04 <andythenorth> vehicle just sits refusing to unload
21:32:07 <andythenorth> wtf is it doing? :)
21:32:40 <andythenorth> - goto A, transfer and leave empty
21:32:46 <andythenorth> - goto A, full load with refit to rubber
21:33:00 <andythenorth> it reloads the previous cargo before attempting the refit
21:33:08 <andythenorth> and the refit fails because cargo is present
21:33:57 <andythenorth> what can I search for to try and fix this?
21:35:12 <andythenorth> LoadUnloadVehicle ?
21:38:24 <andythenorth> what does a ship return for artic_part?
21:39:50 <andythenorth> I am looking around L1473 in economy.cpp
21:40:06 <andythenorth> I have this 100% reproducible right now :P
21:40:16 <andythenorth> just didn't figure out if it's limited to ships yet
21:40:31 <andythenorth> if (front->current_order.IsRefit() && artic_part == 1 && IsArticulatedVehicleEmpty(v) &&
21:40:35 <andythenorth> ^ looks suspicious
21:40:36 <frosch123> it will always be 1 for ships
21:41:13 <andythenorth> so trains are refitting ok for equivalent order set
21:41:17 <frosch123> what looks suspicious?
21:41:39 <andythenorth> I wonder if something in that block (there is more) fails for ships?
21:42:30 <frosch123> add a printf or breakpoint
21:42:34 <frosch123> and see whether it triggers :)
21:43:21 <andythenorth> works if the order is not full load
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21:44:22 <andythenorth> ok my test was wrong
21:44:25 <frosch123> and set a conditional breakpoint
21:44:34 <frosch123> with front->unitnumber = your ship number
21:44:37 <andythenorth> full load also breaks refit for trains
21:45:42 <frosch123> maybe check line 1370 then
21:48:24 <andythenorth> hmm, I am crap at boolean logic, but that line looks ok?
21:49:17 <frosch123> doesn't it reserve cargo for the consist before refitting?
21:54:47 <frosch123> i believe there is some fs task about something similar
21:55:13 <frosch123> which says something like forbid loading and reserving until the vehicle has finished unloading, and is refitted
21:58:49 <andythenorth> you are faster at searching than me :)
21:58:59 <andythenorth> refitting at stations has some issues eh? :)
21:59:40 <frosch123> well, i guess when that task was opened it only applied in some cases, while with cargo reservation it might apply more often
21:59:52 <andythenorth> maybe we stretched the game too far with this one
21:59:57 <frosch123> can you add a comment and savegame?
22:00:22 <andythenorth> I'll have to create a clean game - mine has unreleased grfs :P
22:00:35 <andythenorth> oh and my ottd has patched ship smoke :P
22:01:58 <andythenorth> revert to depot-based-refits only? o_O
22:02:12 <andythenorth> there is also the problem of broken orders if newgrf authors do silly things with cb
22:02:31 <andythenorth> and the issue that first time vehicle visits station with a refit order, no cargo will be distributed (iirc)
22:09:28 <andythenorth> we gained a supply count at stations? o_O
22:09:58 <frosch123> it's just the thingie from last month
22:10:07 <frosch123> scaled with station rating or so
22:10:09 <andythenorth> all these little features are like christmas
22:10:32 <frosch123> so, it's an estimation, no exact thing, like always :)
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22:22:20 <fonsinchen> The supply count is not scaled by station rating. The cargo supplied to the station is added up continuously and halved in regular intervals see Node::UpdateSupply and LinkGraph::Compress for details.
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22:22:57 <fonsinchen> In the end you get sort of a running average
22:25:48 <fonsinchen> The problem with initiating multiple links on autorefit to any is that you don't know in advance what cargoes the vehicles arriving at a station will be able to refit to.
22:26:35 <fonsinchen> Getting that right would mean monitoring any vehicles added or removed to/from any consist serving a link.
22:27:05 <fonsinchen> That's pretty messy.
22:27:35 <andythenorth> you also can't account for what the newgrf can do
22:27:42 <andythenorth> although maybe you would have to discount that
22:27:51 <frosch123> fonsinchen: i think andy's case was about refitting to a specific cargo
22:27:58 <frosch123> not the variable auto-refit
22:28:05 <andythenorth> the variable auto-refit is a mess :)
22:28:05 <fonsinchen> That shouldn't be a problem.
22:28:50 <fonsinchen> Oh, it doesn't refit if there is cargo present in the vehicle. Interesting.
22:29:56 <fonsinchen> Maybe the refit should override the reservation and just return reserved cargo if the vehicle has only reserved, but not loaded.
22:31:10 <fonsinchen> Shouldn't be hard to do. There's a check for Count() == 0 somewhere. Just change that to OnboardCount() and add a Return() after it.
22:32:07 <frosch123> IsArticulatedVehicleEmpty has a TotalCount != 0
22:32:32 <frosch123> no idea what the refit command would do with the reservatiojn
22:42:26 <fonsinchen> IsArticulatedVehicleEmpty is only called from LoadUnloadVehicle. It could easily be changed to check OnboardCount instead
22:44:01 <fonsinchen> Then just add a v->cargo.Return() after line 1474 in economy.cpp and some special code for aircraft "shadows"
22:44:29 <frosch123> i'll try to get andy test that :)
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23:34:55 <NGC3982> The intro screen to Poirot reminds me of the original Transport Tycoon game case.
continue to next day ⏵
