IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2013-08-19
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02:34:18 <ChubbyPitbull> For contributing patches, is there a status to set the bug in the bugtracker to in order to indicate a patch has been submitted, or just leave a message in openttd.dev and wait for review?
03:47:42 <Eddi|zuHause> there is a "patch" status in the tracker
03:48:45 <Eddi|zuHause> if you post a new issue, you can select "patch" instead of "bug". otherwise just reply to the existing issue with your patch, a dev may or may not notice that :p
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07:38:53 <V453000> how is your rainbow slug railway doing? :)
07:44:47 <planetmaker> it's very pleased. Slugs prefer wet and rainy weather. And it's raining cats and dogs right now
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08:01:22 <dihedral> Zuu_, thank you for confirming a channel name on the .dev channel - sadly i already knew the channel name :-P
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10:10:45 * MINM pelts __ln__ with tribbles
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10:29:58 <peter1138> How many average-size tribble pelts does it take to make an average-size coat?
10:33:30 <MINM> suddenly I have a brilliantly bad idea
10:33:37 <MINM> make a star trek inspired economy
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10:37:00 <__ln__> at least they don't use money on the starships, but does it exist at all is another question.
10:39:03 <maddy_> depends on if you are Ferengi or not
10:40:23 <__ln__> yes, true, i was talking about starfleet worlds only
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10:43:38 <MINM> deuterium, deuranium, tribbles, datapads
10:50:59 <TinoDidriksen> V453000, I got channel logs, though not currently public - what're you looking for?
10:51:22 <V453000> :> nothing anymore, ty
10:51:37 <V453000> I needed the thing __ln__ posted
10:52:58 <TinoDidriksen> So public logs are ok. I'll open mine then.
10:53:45 <planetmaker> no-one could be stopped to publish logs from this channel...
10:54:13 <V453000> .) for next time, ty pm
10:54:20 <TinoDidriksen> Of course not, but several public channels will kick+ban people who keep public logs, for some bizarre reason.
11:19:12 <dihedral> TinoDidriksen, and how would they find out? :-P
11:22:08 <planetmaker> V453000, did you mean "good thirstday"?
11:22:27 <planetmaker> oh, no beer then. sad
11:23:48 <ChubbyPitbull> thursday?! someones way ahead or way behind
11:24:02 <V453000> lose 3 days in 1 evening
11:24:34 <V453000> also I didnt say it is thursday?
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11:38:10 <Eddi|zuHause> isn't "good thursday" an easter thing?
11:42:11 <V453000> it is as relevant as good morning :P
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11:45:15 <planetmaker> seems it's not Good Thursday. But Good Friday :D
11:49:20 <peter1138> Let's declare the 22nd of August 'Good Thursday'
11:49:23 <peter1138> Even when it's not Thursday.
11:50:44 <dihedral> TinoDidriksen, how would that help - you can find the logs, but you do not really get a chance to find out who publishes them
11:51:19 <TinoDidriksen> Fairly easy to compare join/part dates and presence with private logs.
11:52:12 <planetmaker> unless the person stays here infinitely. And starts logging only later
11:52:27 <planetmaker> like... who would know it's from me when I suddenly start publishing logs?
11:52:58 <TinoDidriksen> Sure it's not foolproof, but you can also exclude anyone join/parting in the logs...
11:53:13 <TinoDidriksen> So, narrowing down is not that hard.
11:53:55 <planetmaker> anyway, they exist here for ages. And it's a public channel. So... well, why not?
11:53:56 <dihedral> i could have my bouncer run the logs :-)
11:54:13 <planetmaker> yes or the coop bouncer. or ... whatever :-)
11:54:22 <planetmaker> dorpsgek itself could
11:54:59 <planetmaker> actually... my client here could. It#s connected 24/7 basically
11:55:03 <TinoDidriksen> I think it's crazy to forbid logs of public channels, but that's apparently the norm on Freenode, so much so it is enshrined in the network policies to default to no public logging.
11:55:33 <dihedral> TinoDidriksen, so much for FREEnode :-D
11:56:08 <planetmaker> my bet is on SpBot ;-)
11:56:22 <TinoDidriksen> That log snippet is from roboboy
11:56:38 <dihedral> planetmaker, the logs from SpBot look differently though
11:57:00 <TinoDidriksen> Joined right before Speedy, hasn't parted since. Matches 100%
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11:57:48 <dihedral> you have answered a question i have had for many years now :-)
11:58:01 <dihedral> V453000 wants to be banned :-P
11:58:31 <dihedral> TinoDidriksen, so much for your guess there
11:58:44 <planetmaker> V453000, I'd be careful with those commands ;-)
11:59:12 <V453000> which commands does dorpsgek take
11:59:12 <dihedral> mikegrb, neat, but i think i like the old ones a bit more :-)
11:59:13 <planetmaker> you know... they used to work... and people permabanned themselves that way
12:00:21 <TinoDidriksen> Oh, I see, I was off by 5 minutes...would've been 00:37 for it to be roboboy.
12:00:54 <mikegrb> dihedral: but the code is soooo much prittier!
12:04:54 <dihedral> i can imagine that, yes
12:05:24 <V453000> code and pretty doesnt go together
12:05:28 <V453000> unless severely beered
12:05:35 <V453000> then it is just plain wtf
12:37:06 * roboboy wanders what the highlights were for
12:41:30 <maddy_> V453000: it's pretty colourful
12:42:25 <maddy_> I'm not sure if I think that's good or bad thing, I'm just stating the obvious
12:42:55 <V453000> clearly good thing for me :) still, there are 2 versions of the train - rainbow and standard slug so you can use colourful or with 1 colour
12:44:15 <maddy_> is it NUTS or separate grf?
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12:48:19 <DunnoNL> Hey. I've been playing on a server that uses some town growth newGRF but I can't figure out how it works or which of the newGRFs causes this behavior so I can't read the manual to figure it out. The town growth requirements are presented like this "Town is not growing: D/S/R: 2525/1205 PASS, 1192/3504/536 COAL ...". Does anyone know which newGRF this is so I can research how it works?
12:49:30 <maddy_> have you viewed the enabled newgrfs list when you are connected to the server?
12:49:32 <planetmaker> hi, town growth is either a game script. Or the server is hacked and just pretends to be the version it says to be
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12:50:28 <planetmaker> and welcome back :-)
12:50:44 <Belugas> so cool... i can place faces and voices over those nicks now !
12:51:03 <Belugas> although i would love to get back to where i was ;)
12:51:04 <planetmaker> hehe, that makes the channel look different, eh?
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12:52:08 <planetmaker> DunnoNL, there's a few town growth scripts available in online content. But then, the server could also use its own custom one. then all you can do is ask them whether you get it.
12:52:20 <V453000> got any photos somewhere btw Belugas ? :>
12:52:40 <planetmaker> DunnoNL, just load a savegame locally and check. It will tell you in the scripts settings
12:52:43 <DunnoNL> maddy_: Yes, but from the descriptions and settings I assume none of them are responsible for this behavior.
12:52:47 <Belugas> yup, still in my camera ;)
12:53:00 <DunnoNL> planetmaker: Good idea. Going to try that now.
12:53:12 <Belugas> thing is, i had very little time between the trip back and my family vacations
12:53:24 <planetmaker> :-) I'm quite looking forward to those, too!
12:53:58 <Belugas> and we were traveling a lot during those vacations
12:54:08 <Belugas> i will get them out this week
12:54:28 <Belugas> although.. i'm not sure i took a lot during the party itself...
12:54:43 <Belugas> i think i had way more to shoot in Amsterdam
12:59:21 <DunnoNL> planetmaker: It says 'game script: (none)'.
12:59:58 <maddy_> wow that's a long list
13:00:05 <planetmaker> a newGRF cannot change what you describe, DunnoNL
13:00:15 <planetmaker> thus the list is ... not what you want to look at
13:00:30 <planetmaker> ask the server owner
13:04:37 <DunnoNL> I did ask. Hoped it was a simple question and I could continue playing today. Thanks for the help :)
13:05:01 <planetmaker> so... what did s/he tell you?
13:05:20 <planetmaker> and yes... it's a simple question :-)
13:05:41 <DunnoNL> Nothing yet. He is notorious for rarely showing up. That's why I asked it here.
13:05:43 <planetmaker> the answer might not be simple, though ;-)
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13:06:40 <V453000> LOL hiding company names
13:08:34 <DunnoNL> I don't care about mine, but not sure about other players. They probably wouldn't mind, but I'd rather not upset anyone and better be safe than sorry. OpenTTD community is a bit.. peculiar.
13:09:39 <planetmaker> what server do you play on, DunnoNL ?
13:10:02 <DunnoNL> Well, I heard about this development team being broken up and some cityscape stuff that is only for a very selective group of players.
13:10:45 <planetmaker> again: what server did you play that game on?
13:11:02 <planetmaker> that usually gives a good hint whether it's custom stuff or not :-)
13:11:43 <V453000> SERIOUS PLAYERS :DDDDD
13:11:46 <V453000> ima shit my pants on the spot
13:11:53 <planetmaker> reddit... afaik it's a patched server
13:11:54 <DunnoNL> It's a custom built client. That's probably it :/
13:12:02 <planetmaker> lool. And you tell us NOW?
13:12:17 <planetmaker> thanks for wasting my time
13:12:38 <V453000> never help the dutch plague
13:12:42 <DunnoNL> You're welcome. No, seriously, I'm sorry.
13:12:43 <V453000> esp with name Dunno :P
13:13:14 <V453000> you have one free ticket for making fun of my name now :>
13:13:31 <planetmaker> you're know as Mr NUTS anyway, V453000 ;-)
13:13:55 <V453000> and purrr :((((((((((
13:14:08 <planetmaker> first impression sticks, V453000 ;-)
13:14:24 <V453000> it is all related anyway, and its mental position is also quite similar
13:16:47 <planetmaker> I think Belugas doesn't yet know the rainbow purr ;-)
13:17:03 <ChubbyPitbull^> there's a rainbow purr??
13:17:38 <V453000> with the ultimate power of rainbow slugs 1209438
13:18:24 <V453000> no clue what that means but I guess you can describe it that way
13:24:50 <planetmaker> DunnoNL, but you should lobby that the server owners make use of the official OpenTTD. And put that functionality into a game script. As far as I see, that's perfectly feasible
13:26:10 <DunnoNL> All I know about the custom client is that it uses CargoDist for passengers and mail. I - and afaik many other players - love it. Would that be possible without the hacked client?
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13:29:49 <ChubbyPitbull^> AFAIK the game already uses cargo dist for passengers and mail, it's an advanced setting you can use, right? In fact I thought cargo dist was intended for passengers and mail, and it's a setting to turn it on for other cargo types lol.
13:30:46 <DunnoNL> As a casual player I am not bothered with the hacked client. I actually liked it because it implemented some awesome features (like being able to place signals on track with a train before the main client. What would be the benefit of using default client and scripts over this way? (I will need to provide arguments if I'm going to ask someone to spend a lot of time on it)
13:31:13 <planetmaker> the benefit is that users like you are not confused
13:31:51 <planetmaker> and it's less work for them. Bigger audience for them. Easier updates for them
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13:35:29 <DunnoNL> Makes sense. The custom client makes it kinda hard for new players to join (but then again, this means only serious people willing to read join). I will suggest it.
13:37:34 <V453000> god forbid, indeed isnt default
13:38:10 <planetmaker> it's not switched on by default. But it's a setting like any other
13:38:15 <ChubbyPitbull^> Not default, but it's in teh stock client
13:38:35 <planetmaker> (in the nightly openttd builds)
13:38:51 <ChubbyPitbull^> lol oo right sorry, the server I'm running with friends is using a nightly
13:39:44 <ChubbyPitbull^> On that nightly I can also place signals on track that has a train, if that' what you were also referring to Dunno.
13:40:52 <V453000> I think latest stable has that too
13:41:03 <ChubbyPitbull^> Belugas I submitted a patch to a bug you last touched 4 years ago lol.
13:42:00 <Belugas> 4 years ago? that long?
13:42:23 <Belugas> waht is it? out of curiosity?
13:42:44 <DunnoNL> ChubbyPitbull I believe it was implemented in the stable version about half a year ago. So it is no longer a reason to use the hacked client, but I like to believe that the person that compiled it knows way more than I do and makes decisions on what to include that are good for the players.
13:45:56 <ChubbyPitbull^> I had some things I wanted to try to implement for OpenTTD, but following the crawl/walk/run philosophy I've been browsing the TODO list on the wiki lol
13:46:49 <ChubbyPitbull^> Roger that Dunno! Not sure why someone is hacking stuff into the client rather than submitting it for inclusion in the actual client, or not just making a newGRF for the new functionality if that was an option.
13:47:00 <ChubbyPitbull^> Unless it's just a way of mass beta testing changes before submitting patches lol
13:47:50 <Belugas> mmh... the only think I did was actually to clarify what the guy had in mind in his feature request
13:48:28 <Belugas> the EDIT part, that is... I closed it as INVALID, then (dunno why) reopened it
13:49:01 <DunnoNL> ChubbyPitbull Afaik the guy doesn't create stuff, he just compiled a client with a great mix of patches and stuff to make gameplay better. Everything in the client exists out there somewhere. The guy just put it together in a specific way for playing on his server.
13:50:41 <ChubbyPitbull^> Roger that Belugas. The bug was listed here http://wiki.openttd.org/Todo_list so I made a patch for it. It's only my second patch, so I wasn't sure what the process was after submitting a patch; whether I had to change a flyspray status, or PM someone
13:51:43 <ChubbyPitbull^> Figured I'd bug you since you had at least seen the bug at some point in your life lol.
13:53:15 <ChubbyPitbull^> Is there a more up-to-date requested features/TODO list for new people wanting to contribute?
13:54:23 <planetmaker> there isn't, sadly
13:54:37 <planetmaker> being in this channel is good though :D
13:55:54 <Belugas> that or the suggestions in forums
13:56:00 <ChubbyPitbull^> The coding guidelines you guys have in place made it fairly easy to jump into the code, a lot of it is very readable and easy to pick up what's going on.
13:56:03 <Belugas> althohg that is a bit of a joke
13:56:29 <ChubbyPitbull^> I was using the lists because I figured those were coming after a one-pass by developers or contributors saying "yeah this one makes kind of sense"
13:56:34 <Belugas> lovely code style indeed, thanks to Rubidium
13:56:47 <planetmaker> yes, that's why we created the lists
13:57:03 <maddy_> what the idea with DOS and Windows palettes in newgrfs, and ability to toggle them in the gui? when would/should I want to switch them?
13:57:05 <planetmaker> it takes more effort to review the patches though :D
13:57:13 <planetmaker> writing the list was easy in comparison
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13:57:42 <planetmaker> maddy_, history. Never use anything but DOS for new NewGRFs. Don#t change for existing ones in the newgrf config
13:57:51 <planetmaker> that's usually the best guide
13:58:09 <planetmaker> for new NewGRFs as when you write them as author
13:58:31 <ChubbyPitbull> Ahh poop lost voice in .dev for changing nick
13:59:25 <ChubbyPitbull> My only code structure complaint so far is global o'er the land! Took a bit of reading around now and again to find the definitions and scoep for everything, MSVC 2010 is surprisingly helpful
14:00:00 <planetmaker> well... yes. They're defined in the headers where they are used
14:08:46 <peter1138> We should put everything into a class so that we can run multiple instances of the game in one process.
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14:10:51 <Belugas> one instance attached to each processor ;)
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14:25:52 <planetmaker> ChubbyPitbull, yes... #openttd.dev is often silent. We use it to discuss code only. And sometimes we do that also here instead of there
14:27:31 <planetmaker> we created that channel so that some discussions don't drown or are public in the first place but without too much interference from the more general chatter we sometimes have here
14:30:51 <Eddi|zuHause> <peter1138> We should put everything into a class so that we can run multiple instances of the game in one process. <-- well it would be really useful to be able to prepare the game context of a new game while the title game is still running.
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16:15:46 <maddy_> oh dead, my next task is writing the save/load handler, I hope you guys have made it easy for me
16:16:33 <planetmaker> depends... what needs saveload handling?
16:17:28 <planetmaker> if you just add additional stuff, usually no special care is needed with saveload
16:17:55 <planetmaker> at least wrt settings or so
16:18:09 <maddy_> what about the savegame version? is it recommended to increment it or not?
16:32:05 <Rubidium> unless it becomes a new chunck ;)
17:12:28 <Belugas> chun(c)k is a packet of bytes containing, in this context, configuration data
17:15:55 <scshunt> maddy_: ooh, new signals? what do they do?
17:18:32 <Xaroth|Work> they go either red or green
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17:22:47 <peter1138> hmm, how should i test if the viewport should be scrollable, just test the game mode variable?
17:24:38 <peter1138> heh, well that's silly
17:35:45 <maddy_> scshunt: they are similar to programmed signals patch kind of
17:45:16 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25734 trunk/src/lang/afrikaans.txt (2013-08-19 17:45:09 UTC)
17:45:17 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:18 <DorpsGek> afrikaans - 21 changes by mulderpf
17:48:27 <peter1138> hmm... should i try making the OPENTTD letters refresh properly on the intro screen? :p
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18:01:45 <DorpsGek> planetmaker: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
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18:24:08 <frosch123> __ln__: just for the record: today's xkcd contains the word 'unicorn' at least twice
18:25:59 <frosch123> actualy misread unicode as one of them :s
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19:48:09 <SpComb> I should totally rewrite my irclogs some day
19:48:16 <SpComb> it's a miracle that they're still up and running :)
19:49:57 <SpComb> I'm still proud of the timezone support! Not sure how many users actually notice it, though :)
19:51:17 <LordAro> i think i've noticed at some point in the past :L
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20:30:10 <Eddi|zuHause> yay, finally got my mouse replaced \o/
20:30:53 <andythenorth> does the cat chase it?
20:31:19 <Eddi|zuHause> usually not. the mouse cursor however... :)
20:31:28 <Alberth> its sleeping after eating the previous one :)
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20:34:52 <Supercheese> Hmm, I can't find where the prop 24 nearby station name string gets the Town name added to it
20:36:07 <Eddi|zuHause> start at newgrf* where it checks prop 24 and backtrack from there?
20:36:08 <Supercheese> or is that incorporated in the grf file itself
20:36:16 * Supercheese has to check FIRS source
20:37:02 <Supercheese> Ah, it seems to be in the grf itself
20:37:07 <Supercheese> that would explain it, then :P
20:37:13 <Eddi|zuHause> i think there should be a {TOWNNAME} token
20:37:28 <Supercheese> That means I have to add the town name in the patch
20:39:38 <Eddi|zuHause> there should be a similar token in normal lang files
20:40:02 <Supercheese> Yeah, but the lang file stuff doesn't matter when I'm editing strings.cpp
20:40:25 <Eddi|zuHause> new keyboard feels totally weird, even though it's the same type as the old one...
20:40:47 <Belugas> not the same "touch", i guess :)
20:40:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: just add a string {TOWNNAME} {INDUSTRYNAME}
20:41:07 <Belugas> or is it that you actaully can see the letters now? hahahah!
20:41:08 <Supercheese> How would I do that?
20:41:12 <Eddi|zuHause> and then set both via SetDParam
20:41:43 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: just check how it's done in the industry list?
20:41:55 <Eddi|zuHause> or the industry window?
20:42:19 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: i seriously doubt strings.cpp is the place to change, anyway
20:42:34 <Supercheese> It is, frosch helped me see that earlier
20:42:46 <Supercheese> prop 24 nearby station name is an odd case
20:43:39 <Supercheese> industry type is stored as a reference, then strings.cpp sorts out the actual name
20:43:45 <Supercheese> I still don't really get it
20:44:29 <frosch123> iirc you just want to replace the stationame with the industry name
20:44:53 <frosch123> so, do not append the industrytype or townname, just use the industry name directly
20:45:03 <Supercheese> {TownName} {IndustryName}
20:45:10 <frosch123> hmm, though that might give you the wrong town for the station :p
20:45:42 <Supercheese> Ah, now I just have to figure out where the "full" industry name variable is
20:45:53 <Supercheese> indsp->name has no town name
20:46:58 <Supercheese> st->town + indsp->name throws errors
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20:48:50 * Supercheese wonders why there is both base_station_base.h and station_base.h
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20:51:43 <Eddi|zuHause> one is for all stations and the other for railway stations?
20:51:48 <Supercheese> Perhaps a better idea would be to insert a {TownName} param to the string, but I don't know how to do that
20:54:16 <Supercheese> I'd rather not edit english.txt
20:56:07 <Supercheese> Hmm, let's try STR_FORMAT_INDUSTRY_NAME
20:56:25 <planetmaker> nothing wrong with changing english.txt when making source code patches
20:56:47 <Supercheese> Well, what I'm trying to do really should be able to use existing strings
20:57:05 <Supercheese> or rather, parameters
20:59:43 <Supercheese> STR_FORMAT_INDUSTRY_NAME does not work at all
21:00:24 <Supercheese> perhaps because I seem to be dealing with string IDs rather than actual strings?
21:03:57 <Supercheese> guess I should SetDParams
21:10:05 <Supercheese> this is ridiculous
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