IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2009-10-05
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00:23:08 *** KenjiE20|LT has joined #openttd
00:35:33 *** Rubix is now known as Rubix`
00:36:01 <Rubix`> Hello, How do i start up my own transportation company, I have the HQ placed, but it will not allow me to do anything further or build depots etc.
00:36:30 <SirSquidness> Rubix`: what year is it in game?
00:36:41 <Rubix`> Do i need to change that?
00:36:55 <Eddi|zuHause> the default start year is 1950
00:37:11 <Eddi|zuHause> with the default vehicles, there is nothing available in 1920
00:37:33 <Rubix`> so that was my problem.
00:37:44 <Rubix`> but i could add my own vehicles theoratically correct?
00:37:46 <SirSquidness> I'm pretty sure there is
00:37:54 <SirSquidness> I've started back in 1850 befor eand had horse and carts.
00:37:56 <Eddi|zuHause> either use a newgrf vehicle set, or start later
00:38:05 <SirSquidness> but it only has road vehicles though
00:38:17 <Eddi|zuHause> SirSquidness: no, that is the eGRVTS
00:38:25 <Eddi|zuHause> those are not default vehicles
00:39:02 <SirSquidness> I don't think I had any GRFs when I did it
00:39:27 <PeterT> Check under the NewGRF list
00:39:57 <SirSquidness> I'll take your word for it :P
00:40:01 <SirSquidness> (no openttd on this laptop)
00:43:40 <Rubix`> So you can add your own vehicles and such?
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00:47:27 <Phazorx> can any of you guys suggest a reason why modern PC can have major issue (display lag) on network play on specific server?
00:48:13 <Phazorx> ping is relatively high ~400 but visualy look like 4fps
00:48:24 <Phazorx> PeterT: i run it on my laptop :)
00:48:37 <Phazorx> so you can join it only via hamachi
00:48:56 <Phazorx> given that you have desire to try - i'll provide the info
00:50:29 <PeterT> it's too late for me to install more programs,sorry ;)
00:51:13 <Phazorx> could it "theoretically" be grfs?
00:52:17 <Yexo> yes, but it's much more likely that it's 1) a very big map or 2) there are many vehicles (or both)
00:52:55 <Yexo> you should check the cpu usage of the server and client
00:53:31 <Phazorx> Yexo: 6% cpu usage on client
00:54:07 <Phazorx> early game stages nothing really there, 50 trains
00:54:34 <Phazorx> would network lag manifest it this way?
00:54:46 <Phazorx> 400 is relatively high i'd say
00:54:53 <Phazorx> server does not complain about resyncs tho
00:55:08 <Phazorx> can i change debug level on a fly?
00:55:17 <Yexo> yes, via the debug_level console command
00:59:33 <Phazorx> well even 5 says nothing
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01:01:59 <Phazorx> any other ways we can try to figure out what is wrong with the situation?
01:02:04 <Phazorx> it only affects one player
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01:12:30 <Rubix``> So i can theoratically start in 1850 with horses and wagons?
01:12:43 <Rubix``> What set of vehicles do I need to download to do that?
01:14:09 <Rubix``> What GRF set do I need to be able to play the game from 1850 onwards?
01:22:43 <PeterT> do you need a link or anything?
01:26:05 <Rubix``> It's 1850 yet there are sky scrapers...
01:44:11 <PeterT> anybody know what (+ntcl 150) mode is?
01:45:27 <Spoons> Some flood limit control.
01:46:28 <Rubix``> Is there a way to find the nearest (for this example) coal mine on the map?
01:51:41 <Eddi|zuHause> PeterT: /help cmode
01:52:05 <PeterT> Eddi|zuHause, "No such commmand."
01:55:50 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubix``: you can filter on the map by industry type, or you can go through the industry list
02:04:25 <Rubix``> Lol, i found a bug/glitch I think.
02:05:01 <Rubix``> When you get a message in the bottom, and it shows buildable tiles, you can build on them, but they don't show up on the actual game screen
02:08:17 <Rubix``> Also, what is the point of building a HQ?
02:12:06 <Eddi|zuHause> it produces and accepts passengers
02:25:54 <Rubix``> How the hell do you make a profit
02:33:05 <Rubix``> Are subsidies worth it?
02:52:01 <thepalm> quick question for devs: why doesnt CompaniesMonthlyLoop() get run at game start?
02:54:20 <DaleStan> (not a dev) Because that's the beginning of the month, not the end?
03:07:53 <Rubix``> i just had a train go from one end of the map to other
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17:14:04 <TrueBrain> Belugas: 13 hours of silence, but you had to say hi ... :'(
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17:30:01 <Belugas> believe me, it was not on purpose...
17:38:09 <Belugas> same, dear friend, samo
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17:45:24 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r17718 /trunk/src/lang/ (afrikaans.txt unfinished/frisian.txt):
17:45:24 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:24 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: afrikaans - 35 changes by Maccie123
17:45:24 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frisian - 50 changes by Minifan
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18:19:24 <fonsinchen> Microsoft lets you register VC++ Express with an email address you don't own ... :)
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18:52:21 <fonsinchen> How do I analyze a core dump in VC++?
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18:57:17 * Belugas cannot answer that one
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19:01:33 <Belugas> ho boy... just read the post from SAC
19:10:23 <glx> fonsinchen: just open the dmp in VC
19:10:58 <glx> of course you need the right exe with corresponding pdb in the same dir
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19:12:05 <fonsinchen> in the same dir ... aha
19:14:18 <fonsinchen> I have built a debug binary of (hopefully) the same version with VC ... this should do, I guess.
19:15:32 <glx> but you don't need to use a debug build to analyse the dmp
19:15:50 <glx> you just need the exe used to create it and the pdb
19:16:25 <fonsinchen> The exe has been built by some forum user and he didn't post pdb.
19:16:51 <glx> quite impossible to debug then
19:18:07 <fonsinchen> well, anyway, the crash log says: Reason: Assertion failed at ..\src\strings.cpp:974: v != NULL
19:18:32 <fonsinchen> Does anyone remember a bug like that around r17268?
19:18:43 <glx> so failed when drawing a string it seems
19:18:56 <fonsinchen> It seems to have vanished in later versions, but I don't know details yet.
19:19:23 <fonsinchen> But as I haven't done anything about it, I guess it was some bug in trunk that has been fixed in the meantime.
19:19:54 <fonsinchen> unfortunately I don't have a backtrace ...
19:20:09 <fonsinchen> I did. Nothing obvious.
19:20:41 <glx> well you have a trace, it's in the dmp :)
19:21:02 <glx> but I know it's useless for you right now
19:21:07 <fonsinchen> yes, but the symbols are missing. And I can't read hex like a book.
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19:23:04 <glx> that's why we keep pdb of all our published builds ;)
19:25:10 <fonsinchen> Understandable ... someone should explain that to all forum users who create patched builds ;)
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19:30:25 <glx> pdb is next to the exe in objs/win32/release :)
19:31:41 <glx> but most forum users don't even report bugs in patched builds ;)
19:32:24 <glx> then the patch author thinks there's no bugs :)
19:33:39 <glx> (the usual "well tested, desync free", and we find a possible desync by just reading the diff ;) )
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19:42:36 <frosch123> iirc the compile farm does. ask dorpsgek, they are good friends
19:42:48 <Xaroth_> but I don't compile ottd :P
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19:44:43 <Xaroth> That decision is not up to me
19:44:44 <frosch123> sorry, but i guess i would get banned there, if i ask for unbanning you :p
19:45:13 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +b *!~Peter@c-76-19-168-104.hsd1.ma.comcast.net
19:45:14 *** PeterT was kicked by DorpsGek (asking in this channel about why you are banned in other channels deserves a ban I think ...)
19:45:42 <TrueBrain> and we will never ban you :)
19:46:02 <Xaroth> Laugh at you, possibly, but not ban :P
19:46:12 <TrueBrain> frosch123 is nice, nothing to laugh at :)
19:46:13 *** DorpsGek sets mode: -b *!~Peter@c-76-19-168-104.hsd1.ma.comcast.net
19:46:14 <Xaroth> then again, what are the odds of you asking for him to get unbanned anyhow
19:47:20 <TrueBrain> bah, I now need to make 6 keystrokes to type Rubidium :(
19:47:35 <SmatZ> you TAB broke, TrueBrain?
19:47:52 <TrueBrain> Konversation doesn't auto-fill, but gives this annoying popup
19:48:02 <TrueBrain> so I am conditioned to type enough letters to give an unique hit
19:48:14 <TrueBrain> but by the joining of another user, that is no longer valid for Rubidium
19:48:19 <TrueBrain> (sorry for the highlights :))
19:48:31 <SmatZ> /kick Rubix`` please change your name so it doesn't begin in "Ru" or any first two letters of other devs' name
19:48:54 <TrueBrain> SmatZ: ghehehe :) You are getting there PYI :p
19:48:58 <Xaroth> frosch123: the 'laughing at' part was for the unlikely chance that you would ask :)
19:49:28 <frosch123> SmatZ: i guess PeterT is really unlucky with your new rule
19:49:30 <TrueBrain> PeterT: I would be a poor operator if I wouldn't have kicked you for that .. you have that coming for miles :)
19:50:02 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +o frosch123
19:50:14 * SmatZ gives PeterT one Swap operation
19:50:37 <TrueBrain> either way .. enough fun for one day, back to work ..
19:50:57 <frosch123> you can have lots of fun at work
19:51:23 <TrueBrain> frosch123: I do :) But at this stage it requires a lot of concentration :)
19:51:28 <frosch123> of course you can also make the whole company laugh about you on the first day
19:51:34 <Xaroth> TrueBrain: and a lot of prodding me? :P
19:51:59 <PeterT> SmatZ: why is it bad that someone's name begins with the same two letters that the devs name is? was that a joke?
19:52:37 <TrueBrain> PeterT: no joke, and frosch123 will enforce the rule
19:52:52 <Xaroth> PeterT shares 5 letters ?
19:52:59 <frosch123> TrueBrain: tired of kicking?
19:53:07 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: petern was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 5 days, 1 hour, 5 minutes, and 10 seconds ago: <petern> *want
19:53:15 <TrueBrain> I just realised most users here do differ in the first 2 letters
19:53:26 <Xaroth> heh, even when he's not here we can all see how fond he is of correcting people's english :P
19:53:28 <TrueBrain> frosch123: something like that :p
19:54:10 <Muxy> hI, i'm back with my string parameter...
19:54:34 <TrueBrain> 34 of the 111 users I can not reach within 3 keystrokes (including a tab)
19:54:43 <TrueBrain> oh, 36 of the 111 .. I need to learn to count :p
19:54:47 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 0.324324324324
19:55:05 <TrueBrain> haha, 432 432 432 :)
19:55:10 <Muxy> i have a string defined with parameter : watching {STRING} in the lang file
19:55:15 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 4.28828828829
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19:55:20 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: I have not seen tokar.
19:55:23 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: tokai was last seen in #openttd 2 weeks, 3 days, 10 hours, 7 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <tokai> I wonder why apps break all the time with an new OS release under Mac OS X.
19:55:26 <Xaroth> 288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288288
19:55:30 <Muxy> i set this as the title of a window
19:55:46 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 4.31531531532
19:55:46 <Muxy> and i would like to fill the parameter
19:55:52 <TrueBrain> I can't do math ... /me goes hide in a corner
19:56:01 <frosch123> [21:56] <TrueBrain> haha, 432 432 432 :) <- you were not very concentrated at school, were you? :p
19:56:15 <TrueBrain> frosch123: am I now? :p
19:56:27 <Muxy> i tried with SetSParamStr( 0, "blabla" ) but it doesnt work. do you have any clue about this ?
19:56:28 <Xaroth> that's what they invented calculators for
19:56:50 <Muxy> hum SetDParamStr... of course
19:57:26 <DorpsGek> frosch123: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number.
19:57:31 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 12345678987654320
19:57:41 <frosch123> ^^ my favorite computation during boring lessons
19:57:44 <TrueBrain> hihi :) The last number is wrong :p
19:58:09 <TrueBrain> how is that possible, I wonder :p
19:58:15 <SmatZ> @calc 111111111 * 111111111
19:58:15 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: 12345678987654320
19:58:21 <DorpsGek> Xaroth: 1371742108367626879107072
19:58:40 <frosch123> obviously dorpsgek uses double precision
19:59:28 <TrueBrain> @calc 111111111**2 + 1
19:59:28 <DorpsGek> TrueBrain: 12345678987654320
19:59:35 <DorpsGek> Muxy: Error: float division
19:59:44 <Xaroth> @calc 111111111**2 + 2
19:59:44 <DorpsGek> Xaroth: 12345678987654322
19:59:54 <TrueBrain> black hole of course would be the correct english word ...
20:00:13 <TrueBrain> @calc 111111111**2 + 1 - 111111111**2
20:00:21 <TrueBrain> look mom, I can do math!
20:00:30 <DorpsGek> PeterT: Error: float division
20:00:38 <TrueBrain> once again, we have shown that 1 == 0
20:00:51 <DorpsGek> Muxy: Error: float division
20:00:59 <DorpsGek> Muxy: Error: unexpected EOF while parsing (<string>, line 1)
20:01:02 <PeterT> there is no opposite of zero
20:01:08 <TrueBrain> PeterT / Muxy: ANY number divided by 0 is 'impossible' ....
20:01:11 <TrueBrain> no need to test them all
20:01:18 <TrueBrain> PeterT: for sure there is a +0 and a -0
20:01:27 <TrueBrain> (/me points to one-complements)
20:01:31 <DorpsGek> Muxy: Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)
20:01:37 <PeterT> 0 is just 0, there is no negative or postive
20:01:45 <DorpsGek> Muxy: Error: unexpected character after line continuation character (<string>, line 1)
20:01:55 <TrueBrain> Muxy: start a PM with DorpsGek, this is annoying
20:02:19 <Muxy> back to the channel subject. is there a way for me to display my param in my string ?
20:02:26 <SmatZ> @calc 1 / (12345678987654320 - 12345678987654321)
20:02:26 <DorpsGek> SmatZ: Error: float division
20:02:29 <frosch123> what kind of param?
20:03:04 <Muxy> as i said : i defined a string in the lang file "blablabla {STRING}"
20:03:18 <Muxy> and i set this string to a window title
20:03:30 <Muxy> and in the Paint i would like to fill the param
20:03:53 <Muxy> so i used the SetDParamStr(0, "tralala" ) but not good
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20:04:05 <frosch123> SetDParamStr is for {RAWSTRING}
20:04:22 <frosch123> do you want to insert another STR_xxx or a char * ?
20:04:25 <Muxy> okay, and SetDParam( 0, "glouglou" ) will be ok ?
20:04:46 <SmatZ> I think strdup("glouglou")
20:05:05 <SmatZ> if that one crashes, try it with strdup()
20:05:12 <SmatZ> not the other way around or it will leak :-p
20:05:43 <Muxy> frosch123: i would like to insert a char *
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20:06:13 <frosch123> then you need {RAW_STRING} in english.txt
20:06:30 <frosch123> without strdup i guess :)
20:06:39 <Muxy> ah ok, {STRING} should be used only to insert a string from lang...
20:07:05 <DorpsGek> PeterT: Akoz was last seen in #openttd 3 weeks, 3 days, 6 hours, 33 minutes, and 24 seconds ago: <Akoz> @calc exp(-100)
20:07:16 <frosch123> note that only english.txt distinguishes between RAW_STRING, STRING, STRING1 ... STRING5. other languages only use STRING
20:08:19 <Muxy> i read that a long time ago. it means...
20:09:10 <frosch123> ... that english.txt contains the important stuff, while the rest is simplified
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20:11:34 <Muxy> SetDParamStr works fine with {RAW_STRING}, thx men...
20:11:35 *** PeterT was kicked by frosch123 (me doing belugas' job)
20:11:59 <glx> Muxy: it's easy when you know it :)
20:12:23 <Muxy> yeap, and when it works, it's great...
20:12:38 <PeteT> frosch123, thanks, my xchat kept joining twice when I opened it
20:12:53 * Muxy working on my watch patch through a viewport window
20:13:22 <Lolwut> just got 1,000,000 loan payed off
20:14:36 <frosch123> start 5 ais and try to buy them all
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20:21:26 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: frosch * r17719 /trunk/src/ai/api/ai_engine.cpp:
20:21:26 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Change: [NoAI] Make AIEngine:CanRefitCargo() not report refittability to Mail
20:21:26 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: by default for aircraft. It is not necessarily true, and the special case of
20:21:26 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: carrying both passenger&mail is better handled by AIs themself than by the API.
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21:07:46 <_ln> don't tell me Brüno was dubbed into german
21:17:07 <_ln> thank you for not telling me
21:19:22 <Belugas> I'm telling you that Germain has rubbed Brüno
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22:07:49 <Eddi|zuHause> <_ln> don't tell me Brüno was dubbed into german <- i actually have no idea... i believe borat was dubbed, but i didn't watch it in german
22:12:51 <_ln> they speak quite authentic german in Brüno now and then, i don't understand how the funniness of that could be maintained if it's dubbed.
22:13:29 <Eddi|zuHause> i had no incentive to watch Brüno anyhow...
22:14:41 <_ln> it was a stupid movie mostly, with a few funny parts that would have worked better as separate sketches.
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