IRC logs for #openttd on OFTC at 2007-10-25
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01:47:45 <Klanticus> ops... wrong channel
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02:02:44 <Belugas> you wanted to see your password?
02:02:53 <Belugas> or all our passwords...
02:03:43 <Klanticus> Belugas, i wanted the password for the ottd coop game
02:26:39 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11340 /trunk/src/industry_gui.cpp: -Fix[FS#1362]: Newindustries can provide no production at start. So the Modifying Production cheat was a bit puzzled on how to deal with it. This will help a bit.
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05:39:43 <Tefad> heh just got locomotion for $3 new at a retail store.
05:39:55 <Tefad> figured i'd give it a whirl and see how much i hate it : D
05:42:47 <Tefad> i am confused. it's accessing weird parts of the CD : x
05:43:30 <Tefad> authenticate disc? booooo
05:50:54 <Ailure> just when I saw that there hadn't been a update for days
05:50:56 <Ailure> [04:24] <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r11340 /trunk/src/industry_gui.cpp: -Fix[FS#1362]: Newindustries can provide no production at start. So the Modifying Production cheat was a bit puzzled on how to deal with it. This will help a bit.
05:52:02 <Ailure> trying to install with Wine?
05:52:08 <Tefad> installed fine actually
05:52:17 <Tefad> it just won't execute past the securom nonsense
05:52:21 <Ailure> I swear I saw locomotion working on their application database
05:52:31 <Tefad> yup. it says so.. probably with cracked exe
05:52:32 <Ailure> You can try to look for a crack heh
05:53:03 <Ailure> I doubt the game itself have problems to run
05:53:26 <Ailure> well, I belive it uses same engine as rollerocaster tycoon too
05:53:52 <Ailure> it apparently have (hilariously) same limits as TTD
05:53:58 <Ailure> when it comes to colors
05:54:34 <Tefad> seems like chris is stuck in the past like we are : x
05:54:41 <Tefad> except that we're moving on.. now anywy
05:54:54 <Ailure> at first glance, screenshot does look 32 bit
05:55:01 <Ailure> but then you notice the lack of variance in colors...
05:58:38 <Tefad> aw no more chrissawyer.com ?
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06:55:06 <Celestar> ... and no one seems to care :P
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06:57:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> not at this hour ;)
06:57:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> welcome back anyway :)
06:59:21 <Celestar> TrueBrain: echo-request
07:02:14 <dihedral> TrueBrain: updated move_clients patch to v5, fixes the bug
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07:43:40 <TrueBrain> Celestar!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111111111111111111111
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08:05:34 <Celestar> TrueBrain: I've heard there's some shortage concerning disk space?
08:10:47 <TrueBrain> Celestar: not anymore :) And your server couldn't carry it ;)
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08:13:46 <Celestar> TrueBrain: I'll be upgrading the server in a month, just so that you know :)
08:14:03 <Celestar> but not much, like to 250GB
08:14:12 <TrueBrain> then it might be useful ;)
08:14:29 <TrueBrain> but more important: how are you? :)
08:14:50 <TrueBrain> we haven't seen you in a while? :)
08:18:27 <Celestar> I just woke up one morning and found that I have a life :P
08:18:40 <TrueBrain> Wow! How was that like?! :)
08:18:49 <Celestar> Weird I'm telling ya
08:18:56 <TrueBrain> can you teach us? :p
08:19:22 <Celestar> dancing is cool, we have our first national championship Nov 3rd
08:19:33 <TrueBrain> you are going to win, right? :P
08:19:52 <Sionide> i saw national chamionship and thought you were talking ottd!
08:20:15 <TrueBrain> Sionide: as mentioned, some people DO have a real life :p
08:23:24 <Celestar> TrueBrain: I don't think so :P
08:23:47 <TrueBrain> Anyway, good luck :) Now I have to make some Scheme application, so I will be back later :)
08:23:53 <TrueBrain> Celestar: drop by more often, we like that :)
08:23:54 <Celestar> TrueBrain: well, because those are basically professionals
08:24:05 <TrueBrain> and you aren't? :p :)
08:25:08 <Celestar> TrueBrain: nope I have a life (see above) :P
08:25:55 <TrueBrain> (btw, really nice to see you again ;))
08:26:25 <Celestar> almost 1500 revs to catch up
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09:02:29 * dihedral|away greets once round
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09:51:39 <TrueBrain> bah, designing CPUs (and more specific: microcode) is a bitch
09:51:51 <TrueBrain> in specific, memory alignment
09:53:31 <Gekz> RCT was written 99% in ASM
09:53:46 <blathijs> TrueBrain: Wth are you doing writing microcode?
09:54:30 <TrueBrain> blathijs: because I have to
09:55:09 <blathijs> TrueBrain: Weren't you studying astronomy last time I checked?
09:55:15 <TrueBrain> blathijs: that was long ago :p
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09:56:53 <blathijs> TrueBrain: Something CS-ish or ES-ish? :-)
09:57:22 <TrueBrain> hmm.. in fact, this course covers both :p
09:57:36 <TrueBrain> but I have to simulate my CPU in C++, so that rules out ES :)
09:58:05 * dihedral|away does not envy TrueBrain
09:58:58 <TrueBrain> LB: Temp AND A Const 0x3
09:58:58 <TrueBrain> Temp SLL Temp Const 3
09:58:58 <TrueBrain> Temp SLL Const Temp 0xFF
09:59:02 <TrueBrain> Yeah, you shouldn't :p
09:59:13 <TrueBrain> (okay, that was the worst copy/paste ever)
10:01:56 <blathijs> TrueBrain: No VHDL? :-)
10:02:09 <TrueBrain> blathijs: lucky enough, I only need to be able to read it :p
10:02:31 <blathijs> VHDL is actually quite cool, as long as you get it explained properly :-)
10:02:46 <TrueBrain> argh, I hate alignment.. either I miss a register to do what I want, or I get the wrong byte :p
10:03:14 <blathijs> TrueBrain: What kind of CPU is it?
10:03:21 <TrueBrain> we need to do a MIPS implementation
10:04:05 <blathijs> ah, we did a MIPS in VHDL here :-)
10:04:19 <TrueBrain> we also needed to make the datapath and shit
10:04:43 <blathijs> That makes more sense :-)
10:04:55 <TrueBrain> hmm.. BE... was that 1234 or 4321
10:04:58 <TrueBrain> I can never remember...
10:05:12 <blathijs> Big Endian was the one that makes sense
10:06:32 <TrueBrain> okay, my question is wrong: 1234, in BE is 1 MSB or 4? :p
10:07:00 <TrueBrain> well aint that fucked :)
10:08:26 <TrueBrain> better question: 1234[0] == ? at BE? :p
10:08:46 <TrueBrain> blathijs: either LE or BE needs a 4 - alignment-rest
10:08:55 <TrueBrain> but I am too sleepy :p
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10:10:11 <TrueBrain> blathijs: ah, I now remember :)
10:10:22 <TrueBrain> BE 02 is 00 00 00 02, and LE 02 is 02 00 00 00
10:11:07 <dihedral|away> i was having those issues all the time when reading the ottd udp packets :-P
10:11:22 <TrueBrain> dihedral|away: OTTD is LE
10:11:28 <TrueBrain> so that should be relative easy ;)
10:11:45 <TrueBrain> I read the Earth and Beyond protocol
10:11:46 <dihedral|away> is it not BE for exactly _one_ thing?
10:11:50 <TrueBrain> it has a mix of BE and LE
10:12:04 <dihedral|away> now that is fun
10:12:10 <TrueBrain> dihedral|away: for OpenTTD we use wrapper, WriteByte, WriteWord, ... which take care of it
10:12:14 <TrueBrain> so it is all in 1 alignment
10:12:31 <dihedral|away> but when i read the data with php i need my own wrappers :-)
10:12:32 <TrueBrain> dihedral|away: it became confusing.. an array with an array size.. the size was in LE, the content was in BE
10:12:43 <TrueBrain> that I already provided you :p
10:12:55 <dihedral|away> it was brocken for some parts
10:13:55 <blathijs> TrueBrain: That's what I meant with BE makes sense :-)
10:14:19 <TrueBrain> blathijs: I agree :)
10:14:27 <dihedral|away> i was thinking of, when moving a client to a non existent but valid player, to create the player
10:14:56 <dihedral|away> so spectating clients would not have to leave and join to start a company
10:15:01 <dihedral|away> a move would do the trick :-P
10:15:15 <dihedral|away> or in fact, have a console cmd for clients
10:15:20 <dihedral|away> for that purpose
10:17:29 <TrueBrain> ha, I just removed 12 microcodes :) That makes me happy :) (less codes == less money ;))
10:23:16 <TrueBrain> downside is that loading of words take 3 cpu cycles which are useless...
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10:39:14 <Ammler> dihedral|away: there should be already be something for that, if you click on new company for joining...
10:39:49 <dihedral|away> Ammler: what you mean?
10:40:07 <dihedral|away> but it needs to be created on all clients
10:40:20 <dihedral|away> and esp the server
10:40:37 <dihedral|away> but it would be nice if 'move' could do that
10:40:49 <dihedral|away> - have that result
10:41:06 <dihedral|away> atm the company has to exist
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10:42:04 * dihedral|away is out again...
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10:50:21 <Ammler> dihedral|lunch: its also needed for every client when you join the server, isn't?
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11:07:40 <dihedral> Ammler: yes, just need to include the funcion/method calles :)
11:08:16 <Ammler> dihedral: do you know, how to link to a post in a forum?
11:14:16 <Ammler> you made a nice link to the party grf
11:17:18 <Ammler> you linked to the gif, :P
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11:21:44 <BiA|pavel-css> anyone can compile ottd for win here? :/
11:22:56 <Ammler> BiA|pavel-css: try BuildOTTD
11:23:02 <Ammler> its sticked in the Forums
11:24:02 <BiA|pavel-css> anythink work for me :/
11:24:28 <BiA|pavel-css> Vs have internal compiler error ... cygwin cant found verion and then it freeze
11:24:46 <Ammler> don't use tools from Microsoft
11:25:11 <BiA|pavel-css> buildottd compile game and patching it too?
11:25:54 <BiA|pavel-css> ok, gonna try another one
11:28:10 <BiA|pavel-css> can i patch it with more patches or jsut one?
11:31:36 <Ammler> thats more difficult, I guess
11:32:11 <dihedral> just because you build with buildottd, does it mean you need to patch with it?
11:32:15 <BiA|pavel-css> i will patch it via cygwin and compile via that :P
11:32:41 <dihedral> what are you up to BiA|pavel-css
11:32:55 <dihedral> afaik, all servers that run IN's offer win binaries
11:33:20 <BiA|pavel-css> i want just ottd +4patches no more .. to play with friends
11:33:29 <dihedral> or at least win bins are available for all IN's, no?
11:33:31 <BiA|pavel-css> i dont like public server so much, usualy some nerd there
11:34:21 <dihedral> there is always 'some nerd'
11:34:44 <BiA|pavel-css> if i play with friends with our rules ... no theres not
11:34:46 <dihedral> if you build a patched version just for you and your friends, it makes you the nerd in there :-)
11:35:18 <dihedral> what do you understand under 'nerd'
11:35:38 * BiA|pavel-css is looking to vocabulary
11:36:22 <Ammler> hmm, maybe you should join #openttdcoop or dihedral.de
11:36:46 <Ammler> these are moderated servers
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11:37:04 <Ammler> admins are most time around...
11:37:16 <dihedral> and if not, you can call them
11:37:32 <BiA|pavel-css> they r at irc.oftc.net too?
11:38:06 <dihedral> #openttdcoop and #openttdFairPlay
11:38:08 <Ammler> #openttdcoop is for cooperative gameplay and dihedral is more for competative (if you like to have your own company)
11:38:32 <dihedral> both require you to play acording to some set down rules
11:39:20 <dihedral> and people have a max chance of doing something bad _once_
11:39:46 <dihedral> worst case scenario: we blacklist an entire isp :-)
11:39:55 <BiA|pavel-css> competative? i will have my part of map and noone will distract me? :P
11:40:17 <dihedral> industry stealing is the term you want
11:40:28 <dihedral> industry stealing is something i do not support on my FairPlay games
11:41:02 <dihedral> i am working towards a competitive game, where InduStealing is going to be encouraged, but that is not yet in place
11:41:43 <dihedral> in coop, all play in one company, with the aim to have an amazing network
11:41:49 <dihedral> transporting everything on the map
11:41:59 <dihedral> *depending on the game play chosen
11:42:34 <dihedral> you get some pretty amazing stuff there
11:43:03 <dihedral> and a flow that just is amazing
11:43:54 <BiA|pavel-css> btw, with buildottd i its downloading on its own? i cant set it to my direction?
11:45:05 <dihedral> i have no idea, never used it :-)
11:48:48 <Ammler> BiA|pavel-css: yep, it makes a faldoer in your MyDocuments
11:49:37 <dihedral> i think he meant lunch :-P
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11:55:57 <Ammller> BigBB: Hi, how is your patch going, could I include newwater to my GRF Pack?
11:58:23 <BigBB> Ammler: hi, in the last days I had lot of work. So I now make the patch flyspray ready. I hope it's ready till weakend :)
12:04:05 <Ammller> sounds nice, then I will include newest newwater to the pack...
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12:18:28 <BiA|pavel-css> Ammller: can i compile from my directory?
12:18:34 <BiA|pavel-css> and yeah i meant lunch ;)
12:20:25 <Ammller> BiA|pavel-css: I don't know compiling on windows well, thats why I use BOTTD, but you have now mingw or how is it called and should be able to compile with make like we do on linux
12:22:15 <BiA|pavel-css> i mean ... it use svn://svn.openttd.org/trunk ... can i use for example d:\nb_11339?
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12:26:50 <BiA|pavel-css> Ammller: i mean ... it use svn://svn.openttd.org/trunk ... can i use for example d:\nb_11339?
12:27:39 <Ammller> BiA|pavel-css: ask at the thread...
12:28:39 <dihedral> 14:20 < Ammller> BiA|pavel-css: I don't know compiling on windows well, thats why I use BOTTD, but you have now mingw or how is it called and should be able to compile with make like we do on linux
12:28:39 <BiA|pavel-css> " thats why I use BOTTD" so i thought he know
12:28:42 <Ammller> I use BOTTD, because I have no idea about windows compiling...
12:29:14 <Ammller> but you should now have the tools like I have, svn and make
12:29:33 <Ammller> so you can checkout an other source with svn checkout svn://svn.....
12:29:44 <Ammller> and you should be able to do make
12:32:47 <Ammller> there are People like XeryusTC or Phazorx, who are specialists in Windows compiling...
12:33:23 <BiA|pavel-css> good that, they r afk :/
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12:36:28 <dihedral> BiA|pavel-css: perhaps it is good that they are afk :-P
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12:37:50 <BiA|pavel-css> XeryusTC so u r the specialist? :)
12:38:02 <XeryusTC> not if you talk like that
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12:54:10 <BiA|pavel-css> XeryusTC do u understand compiling with BOTTD ... i mean patching, to patch with more patches and if failed sth, then how can i erpair it ... :-/
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12:57:06 <BiA|pavel-css> so you are on linux?
12:57:39 <BiA|pavel-css> with what are you compiling? cygwin?
12:59:57 <LeviathNL> how do you make an vehicle go nonstop to a station?
13:02:27 <LeviathNL> oh only trains have a non-stop order
13:08:43 <Rexxie> why would you set it on anything else?
13:08:52 <Rexxie> stop it from doing service checks?
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13:38:30 * Belugas picks up another mug of coffee
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13:42:08 <dihedral> have a nice question for you guys
13:42:50 <dihedral> in a doCommand packet, received on the server, for changing the company name, the value in command.h is 56
13:43:26 <dihedral> yet outputting the received value gives me a 1879769144
13:43:46 <dihedral> though other commands (e.g. change face) work fine
13:44:35 <BiA|pavel-css> hey dihedral :)
13:44:56 <BiA|pavel-css> so BOTTD compiled trunk ;)
13:45:07 <BiA|pavel-css> but i cant patch it anyway :(
13:45:37 <BiA|pavel-css> because, if somethink in patch failed, it continue compiling :(
13:46:43 <dihedral> BiA|pavel-css: i cannot help you with BOTTD stuff
13:46:48 <dihedral> i never build on windows
13:56:04 <Belugas> so, BiA|pavel-css, it would be up to you to fix the problem in the patch processing and make it work correctly then
13:59:54 <dihedral> does this work: case CMD_CHANGE_COMPANY_NAME|CMD_NETWORK_COMMAND:
14:04:21 <BiA|pavel-css> Belugas is anywhere aptch tutirial or sth? :/
14:05:11 <dihedral> Belugas: are you familiar with DoCommands?
14:06:42 <TrueBrain> [15:42] <dihedral> in a doCommand packet, received on the server, for changing the company name, the value in command.h is 56 <- 'value', very clear statement... still I have NO idea what you are talking about
14:07:08 <dihedral> do command 56 is the do command for CMD_CHANGE_COMPANY_NAME
14:07:25 <dihedral> or, the value of CMD_CHANGE....
14:07:28 <TrueBrain> why are you even trying to find the numbers? It doesn't really matter, does it? :)
14:07:48 <dihedral> i am trying to disable changing such data for wwottdgd
14:08:07 <dihedral> so 10 people in one company dont muddle around with name color face, etc for 36 hours
14:08:08 <TrueBrain> dihedral: just in the ChangeCompanyName, do a return CMD_ERROR
14:08:22 <TrueBrain> don't make it hard on yourself
14:08:28 <dihedral> i was hoping catch it before the command is cued
14:08:42 <TrueBrain> return CMD_ERROR at begin of command, and that is exactly what happens
14:08:42 <Belugas> BiA|pavel-css, it's not a matter of how patch works.... patch simply applies a patch. It's how to find WHY it did not patch, or better what are the errors. only then, you will be able to correct the code to make it correct. It means programming knowledge
14:08:51 <TrueBrain> the client can't do it, as it return an error
14:08:52 <dihedral> TrueBrain: so i am in DEF_SERVER_RECEIVE_COMMAND(PACKET_CLIENT_COMMAND)
14:08:57 <TrueBrain> and if someone bypasses it, the server stops it
14:08:57 <Belugas> dihedral, not at all, or very little
14:09:09 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: sorry to bother, but will you have time to do a v10 with landing fees today
14:09:30 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: I will do my best, but currently I have an argument with OODraw
14:10:30 <dihedral> TrueBrain: would it be easier if i made those buttons for a company 'dirty'?
14:10:40 <TrueBrain> dihedral: that too helps
14:10:40 <BiA|pavel-css> Belugas: if i know what @@ -218,7 +218,7 @@ or @@ -100,7 +100,7 @@ mean, then i could make my own patch file with correct rows and bottd will dont gimme any failed :/
14:10:51 <TrueBrain> but add 'return CMD_ERROR;' at line 221 in misc_cmd.cpp
14:10:57 <TrueBrain> and you won't have any name changing during the game
14:11:21 <TrueBrain> dihedral: second step is to make the button grey
14:11:43 <TrueBrain> dihedral: never fiddle with raw commands, it is ugly, most of the time stupid, and not needed :)
14:11:53 <TrueBrain> now who here can help me with OODraw :(
14:14:02 <Belugas> those numbers indicate the lines where the hunk in the diff starts
14:14:56 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: okay, I have like 15 minutes befor eI need to do some shopping, let me see if I can find where landing is done
14:17:13 <TrueBrain> k, Phazorx, how much for landing?
14:18:52 <dihedral> would it be possible to do landing on a 'days at airport' basis?
14:19:01 <dihedral> i was too tired to remember what we said yesterday :-D
14:19:07 <TrueBrain> dihedral: sigh, I hate to repeat myself: no
14:19:35 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: can it be fraction of running costs ?
14:19:45 <TrueBrain> would be unfair, I think
14:19:57 <TrueBrain> no, that is possible
14:20:09 <dihedral> what about last profit?
14:20:17 <Phazorx> dihedral: that aint fair for sure
14:20:25 <Phazorx> airports charge you based on cost, not income
14:20:28 <TrueBrain> I thought Phazorx ment that, that indeed is very unfair ;)
14:20:29 <dihedral> a good runing plane pays more
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14:20:54 <dihedral> and therefor should pay more
14:21:04 <TrueBrain> dihedral: very unfair :)
14:21:06 <Phazorx> you are thingking about goverment taxes
14:21:11 <Phazorx> which are based on income
14:21:12 <TrueBrain> if my plane takes 1 year to go from A to B, it pays less :p
14:21:18 <Phazorx> airport fees are based on cost ofn service
14:21:51 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: 8% of running coastearly
14:22:00 <Phazorx> cuz 10 would be too much :)
14:22:28 <dihedral> and if a plane services to gloabl arports?
14:22:52 <Phazorx> and it can only service at global airports
14:23:02 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: stopping is a problem right?
14:23:13 <BiA|pavel-css> sooo "@@ -'starting row','number of rows at start' +'starting row','number of rows after compile' @@" ???
14:23:14 <TrueBrain> lol, something is slightly wrong...
14:23:20 <TrueBrain> 70k for landing....
14:23:25 <TrueBrain> which is 10% of the running cost....
14:23:33 <dihedral> BiA|pavel-css: you dont write patches by hand
14:23:44 <dihedral> BiA|pavel-css: you change the code and use svn diff
14:23:47 <Phazorx> that doesnt sound right at all
14:23:47 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: that sounds wrong, and it is wrong :)
14:24:04 <Phazorx> i'm looking at A380 - 239k/y
14:24:10 <Phazorx> should be around 20k per landing
14:24:18 <Phazorx> that's most expansive to maintain
14:24:22 <dihedral> BiA|pavel-css: do you have tortoise
14:24:29 <glx> BiA|pavel-css: never modify a .diff/.patch by hand, unless you know what you do
14:24:40 <BiA|pavel-css> i know if what i have wrote is right
14:24:45 <dihedral> make patch and apply patch are the 2 options you want
14:24:50 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: actualy make it 5% :)
14:25:00 <Phazorx> cuz we have airmod to bump the costs
14:25:29 <BiA|pavel-css> anyone work with vs?
14:25:44 <Phazorx> BiA|pavel-css: most of us aer sane, hence no
14:25:57 <TrueBrain> lol, global company also has to pay :p
14:26:02 <TrueBrain> but gets the money too, so nothing happens :)
14:26:08 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: that'sfine :)
14:26:13 * dihedral envy's TB's amount patience
14:26:59 <TrueBrain> 1.5M to land a plane
14:27:24 <TrueBrain> v->GetRunningCost();
14:27:30 <TrueBrain> one might suspects that that returns the correct number
14:27:54 <TrueBrain> hmm, it is, per year...
14:28:21 <dihedral> how about a precentage of the income from the cargo of that airport when delivered
14:28:40 <dihedral> which would in fact emulate passangers paying the airport fee
14:28:47 <dihedral> which is a precentage of ticket
14:28:58 <TrueBrain> dihedral: which doesn't happen in real life
14:29:08 <dihedral> it's a fixed fee right?
14:29:16 <TrueBrain> yes, depending on airport
14:29:19 <TrueBrain> and your relation with it
14:29:19 <Phazorx> fix fee per plane type
14:29:22 <TrueBrain> and time of landing
14:29:41 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: you are sure about the 5%?
14:29:43 <Phazorx> cuz it is servicve+dispatching fees+fuel+staff
14:29:58 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: we have airmod that bump running costs
14:30:02 <TrueBrain> landing at 0700 is cheaper than landing at 2000 ;)
14:30:29 <TrueBrain> let me give a quick look at stopping..
14:30:39 <Phazorx> A380 will pay ~1mil running and 50k per landing
14:31:11 <dihedral> is that charge added to running costs?
14:31:22 <dihedral> or deducted from air income
14:31:29 <TrueBrain> to the yearly income of course
14:31:36 <TrueBrain> running cost cna't change
14:31:56 <dihedral> for the paying client..., in the finance window
14:32:36 <Phazorx> for day 2 would be nice to include extra stats for economy overview
14:32:48 <Phazorx> so one can see how much they pay for provided services
14:33:33 <Ammler> btw, is it hard to remove the "notbuildingairport" for other companies, would like to see that in the final wwottdgd IN we are making tonight
14:33:59 <Phazorx> Ammler: that defies the point then
14:34:16 <TrueBrain> it might be more useful if you guys agree for once on things :p
14:34:49 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: my understanding w3as that it would be all land at all then
14:35:00 <Phazorx> rather than global only
14:35:13 <dihedral> i thought clients will be allowed to have their own zone wide air service
14:35:13 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: your understanding of WHAT?
14:35:26 <TrueBrain> 3 people, 3 different ideas about one thing
14:35:33 <TrueBrain> while one person told me: only allow global to build airports
14:35:42 <TrueBrain> see, that is more clear, and leaves little room for interpertation :)
14:35:44 <Ammler> this airport thing is too less important
14:35:58 <Phazorx> Ammler: so leave it in hands of global
14:36:02 <Ammler> thats why we never discussed it clearly
14:36:18 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: my understanding was that if not only global builds airports they all become global
14:36:22 <Phazorx> and all can land at all
14:36:44 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: you told me that only Global should be able to build airports ;) And I have the logs to proof it! MWHAHAHAHA :)
14:37:02 <TrueBrain> anyway, what ever, airport thingies are done: stop can't be done, only in hangar
14:37:10 <Ammler> I guess, he asked you if that is possible
14:37:14 <TrueBrain> and fee is paid upon landing
14:37:24 <Ammler> not that you have to code it that way... :)
14:37:39 <TrueBrain> Ammler: sorry, my mistake, I will stop doing anything he asks if possible
14:37:45 <Ammler> your are coding too fast
14:38:20 <Ammler> bugfix or new features?
14:38:33 <TrueBrain> Ammler: did you read anything I said?
14:38:38 <TrueBrain> or you just start typing blindly?
14:39:07 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: thank you much
14:39:25 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: I have at top 30 minutes of time today, so if you need anything else, think it through clearly, and just ask ;)
14:39:47 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: we shall test i guess
14:39:48 <Ammler> does mean, everything you told is in teh code, ok...
14:39:54 <Phazorx> but i'm quite happy about how it works
14:40:04 <TrueBrain> and airport fee is nice
14:40:11 <TrueBrain> too bad we didn't test docks and busstations ;)
14:40:32 <TrueBrain> (remember, they are shared too!)
14:40:39 <Ammler> they are shared, no idea about fees
14:40:50 <TrueBrain> tram track most likely isn't shared
14:41:01 <Ammler> they are shared since they are in
14:41:05 <TrueBrain> I wonder which PF takes care of that ;)
14:41:19 <Phazorx> at least that's how it is set
14:41:23 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: but I only told it to ignore owner with rails :)
14:41:32 <TrueBrain> so I wonder if you can 'share' in trunk too :p
14:41:42 <Phazorx> well it wont be an issue
14:41:51 <TrueBrain> nah, but I was wondering :)
14:41:52 <Phazorx> since on that game busses/trams should never met
14:41:52 <Ammler> TrueBrain: tram tracks?
14:41:55 <TrueBrain> anyway, shopping time!!
14:42:54 <TrueBrain> oh, and dihedral, let me know if you can't get the changecompanyname done and stuff
14:46:59 <glx> tram tracks are shared in trunk
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15:07:39 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: still here?
15:07:45 <TrueBrain> Phazorx: I am now :)
15:07:50 <TrueBrain> glx: tnx, clear feedback :)
15:07:52 <Phazorx> i got a stupid request
15:08:04 <TrueBrain> then without doubt you get a stupid reply
15:08:07 <Phazorx> disable "plant trees of random type" button
15:08:40 <TrueBrain> ha, a typical: that I leave for the reader ;)
15:09:17 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: we will set the rules
15:09:24 <Phazorx> but i click that thing on autopilot
15:09:28 <Phazorx> so reading wont help much
15:09:34 <TrueBrain> no, I ment code-wise :)
15:10:19 <TrueBrain> you know, when learning to do something
15:10:28 <TrueBrain> they always leave those excursises?
15:10:32 <TrueBrain> for the reader to do?
15:14:06 <TrueBrain> hmm, I can't count to 16 :s
15:15:50 <Phazorx> is that one lince commented?
15:16:09 <Phazorx> i t6ihnk we have 3 versions of that patch already since each of me Ammler and dihedral did it :)
15:16:38 <TrueBrain> and if you have it already, why you asked? :p
15:16:41 <dihedral> i never touched the trees... yet :-)
15:17:06 <dihedral> we watched trees growing yesterday
15:17:13 <TrueBrain> this isn't tree growth
15:17:22 <TrueBrain> this is only random tree
15:18:18 <Ammler> but the problem is, if you have already trees, the grow then
15:18:23 <dihedral> smae trees = better compression
15:18:41 <TrueBrain> lol, bullshit, the compression works on byte level
15:18:50 <Ammler> and growing means also grow to the next tile, it seems..., irght?
15:18:56 <TrueBrain> so: same height, same type, that helps :)
15:19:25 <TrueBrain> no trees, that helps too
15:19:30 <TrueBrain> but okay, blabla :)
15:20:14 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: when you plant they are same everything
15:20:36 <Phazorx> when server plants they are random everything
15:20:39 <Phazorx> startring with localtion
15:20:57 <Phazorx> when i shaved the map from trrees it went from 2.5 to 750k
15:21:22 <Phazorx> it looks less nice of course but you can still plant
15:32:45 <Ammler> TrueBrain: when is last possible time, you can make the final wwottdgd build for us?
15:32:53 <Phazorx> TrueBrain: as i recall you have a significant other coming tonight, can we make some arrangement for official binaries?
15:33:36 <Phazorx> if that wont be too much to ask...
15:34:08 <dihedral> please not the questionmark :-)
15:34:11 <TrueBrain> gimme an url where the final patch will be for sure?
15:34:17 <TrueBrain> (I won't be able to access IRC :p)
15:34:53 <TrueBrain> I will start the binary around 20:00 tomorrow night
15:34:57 <Ammler> hmm, do we now include the GRF pack too?
15:35:08 <Phazorx> Ammler: yes if we have the,
15:35:15 <TrueBrain> and check again around 12:30 saturday
15:35:41 <dihedral> Phazorx: i said we would post it on the wiki page...
15:35:49 <TrueBrain> (btw, times are in CEST :))
15:35:56 <Phazorx> most likely that url will work
15:36:56 <Ammler> oh yeah, btw dihedral, you have posted it other way in your blog...
15:37:27 <Ammler> so the game starts at 14:30 CEST
15:37:40 <Ammler> or did we change that?
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15:42:22 <skidd13> Anyone in here who cares about the wiki?
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15:45:28 <skidd13> No one from the wiki admins here?
15:48:57 <Ammler> skidd13: isn't that opsolete since newindustries?
15:49:07 <Ammler> the newcargo thing I mean?
15:49:35 <skidd13> Nope I'm interested in the part of modifying the towns ;)
15:51:04 <Ammler> its something like a new cargo scheme
15:51:34 <Belugas> no, it's something like a new gameplay
15:52:14 <skidd13> But I miss the printing works in there ;)
15:52:36 * Belugas loves the community, village, township (and all) idea
15:53:29 <skidd13> :D The town size/economy stuff sounds realy interesting
15:53:59 <skidd13> So whats with the replacement of the graph?
15:54:01 <Belugas> like... waht can affect growth ...
15:55:27 <Belugas> ammler, where do you see in your link the effets on towns? Please, read and understand the whole concept before commentingf
15:55:31 <skidd13> or is it called flow chart?
15:56:06 <Belugas> does the same, isn't it?
15:56:28 <Phazorx> Ammler: get to the grf authoring :)
15:56:34 <Phazorx> and dont argue with devs :)
15:57:20 <skidd13> Belugas: yup, but mine fits a bit better in the layout and uses colors to differ the stuff better
15:57:52 <Belugas> agreed. but i would ask peter1138, if i were you.
15:57:52 <Ammler> so you only dislike the graph, sorry then...
15:58:36 <DorpsGek> skidd13: peter1138 was last seen in #openttd 5 weeks, 5 days, 1 hour, 7 minutes, and 31 seconds ago: <peter1138> _minime_, looks good to me
15:58:53 <Belugas> Ammler : Is an apple the same as an orange? no. That's the point
15:59:10 <Belugas> skidd13, i know, but i do know that his email address is still active ;)
16:04:24 * Belugas resumes his work on moreairports
16:04:41 <Ammler> skidd13: you are working ont that?
16:05:02 <Ammler> is that all possible with newgrf?
16:05:15 <skidd13> Ammler: what are you talking about?
16:06:18 <Ammler> that needs much codechange too
16:07:16 <skidd13> I'm thinking in what direction the development of OpenTTD could go. Nothing less or more.
16:07:36 <hylje> roadmaps have the general image
16:07:46 <hylje> then contributions and on-a-whim patches there and here
16:08:07 <Belugas> are roadmaps the work of devs?
16:08:38 <hylje> but i doubt that they're up for nothing either
16:09:17 <skidd13> hylje: sure. But there is a huge space between the raodmaps and to what OpenTTD could raise. ;)
16:09:27 <Belugas> let see... roadmap for 0.7 : only dev who contributed : peter1138
16:09:34 <Belugas> says it all, don't you think?
16:09:53 <Belugas> oh.. and Rubidium too, at the top
16:09:58 <Ammler> but this wiki page is not "just" a direction, it more..
16:10:03 <hylje> so its just the on-a-whim stuff from devs and user contributions
16:10:28 <Ammler> seems very detailed and specific..
16:10:52 <hylje> 's not a commercial project so its fairly fine
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17:24:11 <ln-> questa è una sera silenziosa.
17:24:42 <Wolf01> that's not a sentence to say in public
17:25:14 <Wolf01> ah sorry, i missed a word
17:25:36 <Wolf01> i meant "questa era silenziosa"
17:28:48 <Wolf01> uhm.. you run out of patches for trunk eh? three days - two commits :/
17:29:35 <Belugas> price of real life :(
17:30:35 <Wolf01> we inaugurated our new office today :D
17:36:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, i was also infected with real life...
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17:59:08 <Ammler> Belugas: I like to ask you something about Action0, but now the wikki of Pikkabird isn't reachable
17:59:35 <ln-> Wolf01: c'è pollo compatibile con con pizza?
18:00:07 <Ammler> but it is so, if you like to change general variables, Action0 Feature 08, you need to load the GRF before start?
18:01:31 <Wolf01> ln- that doesn't mean anything
18:01:47 <Ammler> (maybe someone else does know that too?)
18:02:48 <ln-> Wolf01: are you saying my italian skills are a little... not good?
18:02:53 <Belugas> load grf before start? why? the grf will work fine, as it is already the case...
18:03:16 <Belugas> it will be interpreted when you'll start a new game, for example
18:03:21 <Ammler> but you can't load the grf on a running game
18:03:31 <Ammler> well, you can, but it won't affect
18:03:36 <Belugas> that is not really wise to do...
18:04:13 <Ammler> To rise builing costs on a running game?
18:04:25 <ln-> Wolf01: is chicken compatible with pizza?
18:05:07 <Wolf01> so you wanted to say: "il pollo è compatibile con la pizza?"
18:05:48 <Belugas> technically, i think you can, but it's been a while, i cannot be sure.
18:05:52 <ln-> hmm, yes, i thought it could require definite articles.
18:05:54 <Belugas> just that it is not wise to do so
18:06:41 <Ammler> I'll try it with current trunk, maybe it has changed or I had it wrong in mind
18:10:53 *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY
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18:12:44 <Ammler> Belugas: yes, its same as with difficult settings
18:14:11 <Ammler> hmm, but you can change running costs in a running game?
18:15:16 <Belugas> easiest way to know: test it
18:16:08 <skidd13> TrueBrain: are you outa there?
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18:18:38 <Ammler> yep, I guess its a bug...
18:19:18 <Ammler> you can't change running costs on a running game over difficulty settings
18:19:51 <Ammler> I have runned a bus, he lost 120 in one month
18:22:03 *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01
18:26:14 <Belugas> prove me it is a bug... show me where it is written it should do so... do not mix personal wishes with system behaviour
18:26:34 <Belugas> or even better, give me a fix!
18:27:15 <Hendikins> Bjarni: Loving my railway job :P
18:27:26 <Belugas> if i remember correctly, you cannot change difficulty settings while game has started
18:29:32 <Ammler> Belugas: the fix would be, grey out running costs :)
18:29:45 <Ammler> like other switches of that window
18:30:26 <Ammler> I know it now, but its not clear...
18:31:09 <Ammler> Cost of construction i.e. is "greyed" out...
18:32:23 <Ammler> I just liked to be sure, that it is so, not that I am doing something wrong..., If you tell, its meant to be so, its fine for me.
18:33:15 * Belugas will look at it tonight
18:34:22 <Ammler> Its possible to change it with converting to scn and load that...
18:35:05 <Ammler> at least Phazorx told me, did not test that self.
18:36:46 <Phazorx> it is possible to rename sav to scn and load it in enditp
18:36:57 <Phazorx> it does maintain most things that we care about
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18:39:07 <Bjarni> <Hendikins> Bjarni: Loving my railway job :P <-- that's great
18:39:20 <Bjarni> nobody tried to kill you yet :D
18:40:01 <Bjarni> he risk meeting passengers
18:40:19 <Bjarni> and with the precision of the trains these days...
18:40:21 <Phazorx> Ammler: is fountain thing really working?
18:40:53 <hylje> ive noticed the other day the timetable signs getting firmware upgrades
18:40:56 <Ammler> no idea, didn't test them
18:41:11 <Ammler> like to hold them as surprise for myself :)
18:42:00 <Phazorx> i wonder what does it replace as it is visible in ttrs
18:42:10 <Phazorx> perhaps it is time based?
18:42:25 <Ammler> hmm, maybe you need default houses too
18:42:29 <Bjarni> hylje: nice... we have some signs that looks like they don't have firmware (due to age)... those are funny when they fuck up
18:42:54 <Bjarni> it's a set of prewritten signs that they can switch between
18:43:31 <hylje> i like those flappy signs
18:43:33 <Bjarni> if they go out of sync they can display that the next train goes to a station and will not stop between A and B where A and B aren't on the line to the end station
18:43:42 <Bjarni> and A and B aren't on the same line either
18:44:06 <Bjarni> <hylje> flapflapflapflapflap <-- yeah... something like that
18:44:41 <Bjarni> come to think about it I think they actually updated the inside of those signs
18:44:44 <hylje> amusing out-of-sync stuff would be "Train to A (does not sotp at A)
18:45:43 <Bjarni> the destination of a train will always be the end of a line and the non-stop sign does not contain any end of line stations
18:46:21 <hylje> i thought it could be like here where local-area rails may have two alternating train lines going in them
18:46:32 <hylje> with the other stopping more often and terminating earlier oto
18:46:42 <Bjarni> I like this one: it said 8 minutes until next train.. the train arrived 3 minutes later and it counted down in a linear scale so it just had a multiplier on the timescale
18:46:49 <Bjarni> and it did that to all the trains
18:47:32 <Bjarni> I didn't get any good explanation to why it did that though... it just did
18:47:35 <mikl_> Bjarni: a bit too realistic, isn't it :)
18:47:37 <hylje> i havent seen stuff fuck up
18:48:03 <mikl_> oh, I miss Copenhagen :)
18:48:04 <Bjarni> I once saw that the screen put "cancelled" on the wrong train
18:48:10 <Sacro> i love the flapflapflap train signs
18:48:21 <Bjarni> but I think that was a human input error
18:48:21 * Sacro pulls some semaphore levers
18:48:40 <hylje> the station where i go through pretty often has a screwy local are timetable sign
18:48:58 <hylje> it sometimes fails to update the pixels
18:49:12 <Wolf01> i think that newindustries make the game really hard to play, there isn't the classic replacement of industries where industries were generated during gameplay.. with newindustries they close only :/ (i don't mean that the patch is bugged or doesn't work, maybe it is so, but i think that the grf sets aren't so much balanced)
18:50:20 <Sacro> can i send 2 trains together
18:50:24 <Sacro> or will it upset the next signalbox
18:50:34 <Wolf01> oh, and i think i found a bug, now in the map appeared an oil rig.. which should be replaced by fishing grounds
18:51:05 <Sacro> raised the signal rather than switching the points
18:51:15 <fjb> Fishing grounds are labeled oil as rigs.
18:51:15 <Belugas> it is just a limitation
18:51:52 <Belugas> Fishing Grounds are NOT labeled as Oil Rigs
18:52:06 <Belugas> it is the STATION that is still annoted as oil rig
18:52:20 <Belugas> the station that is linked to the industry
18:52:30 <fjb> Oh, sorry, that's what I tried to say.
18:53:47 <fjb> Bjarni: maybe a signal for shunting.
18:55:45 <Bjarni> it is, but that's not why it has that white thingie on it
18:55:58 <Bjarni> normally the shunting signals don't have that
18:56:22 <Sacro> oh dear... screwed the trains up
18:56:40 <fjb> Hm, for better visibility? You can see smething like that around some traffic lights in germany.,
18:57:14 <fjb> Sacro: What happened? How many are dead? :-)
18:57:26 <Sacro> fjb: none, damned interlocking
18:57:54 <Bjarni> the issue is... they placed the signal like they usually do (on the ground) and a train driver passed it while he looked into the air where he usually see regular signals so he passed it at danger, then they moved it up and a guy who were used to look for shunting signals on the ground passed it
18:58:03 <Bjarni> now it's in the middle and it's clearly marked
18:58:23 <Bjarni> for some reason the normal signals works everywhere else but not at this particular spot :P
18:58:43 <fjb> Could be the direction of the sun.
19:00:49 <Bjarni> somehow it's a tricky place because the next row of signals are in the air even though they can be used as shunting signals
19:01:19 <fjb> I did a bad thing and added a new tramset to a running game. Now the running costs of the trams are very high. Is there a chance to set them to a normal level?
19:02:12 <fjb> Bjarni: Somethings just don't work. It is relly complicated how the eyes an brain interact to generate a picture.
19:02:46 <Bjarni> the only real difference is the people
19:03:03 <Bjarni> I recall the station to be more or less empty when I was there
19:03:05 <fjb> Brianetta: I would not trust that bridge. It reminds me of Indiana Junes.
19:03:05 <hylje> i suppose the trains get there routinely
19:03:48 <Bjarni> they had a "bridge" like that in Sweden last year
19:04:00 <Brianetta> That's the forum thread
19:04:06 <Bjarni> a train passed it and reported the track as "impossible to pass" even though it just did
19:04:24 <fjb> Brianetta: I hope she wears underwear. :-)
19:04:27 <Brianetta> Bjarni: It happened to the Tyne and Wear Metro last week
19:04:34 <Brianetta> A mine collapsed, leaving just track
19:05:12 <Bjarni> actually it happened in Denmark this year, but not that extreme
19:05:36 <Bjarni> it also happened to some vintage railroad near Wales this year
19:05:41 <Bjarni> and some railroad in Texas
19:05:59 * Bjarni wonders what he just deleted with a typo
19:06:00 <hylje> Brianetta: the people in that site are silly!
19:06:12 <Brianetta> hylje: We certainly are.
19:06:44 <Bjarni> the list of directories is now shorter and I saw the animation of one of them go, but I really wonder what it was
19:07:22 <Bjarni> well, OpenTTD is still there so I will survive
19:08:20 <Bjarni> in fact I never used it
19:14:06 <Belugas> fjb : open up the vehicle window
19:14:06 <Belugas> that's all you need to do to follow up the vehicle...
19:14:33 <fjb> Belugas: That'S great, thank you.
19:15:50 <fjb> Now I can delete my question in the forim.
19:15:51 <Belugas> don't thank me, thansk stevenh ;)
19:16:44 <fjb> Belugas: Ok, I have another problem with OpenTTD. I will find some thing for you.
19:17:20 <Bjarni> you don't have to search for stuff to take our time
19:17:29 <Bjarni> we are pretty good at finding stuff like that ourselves :P
19:19:14 <Phazorx> do TTRS fountains require some conditions for appearing?
19:19:18 <fjb> Bjarni: I'm always eager to help. :-)
19:21:41 <Belugas> fjb, don't rush, take your time and don't forget to search for answers yourself on forums and google ;)
19:21:41 <Belugas> Phazorx, i have no idea
19:21:41 <fjb> Is there a way to adjust the running cost of a vehicle set in a running game?
19:21:41 <BiA|pavel-css> Belugas: can i setup somewhere that, VS will show me number of row?
19:21:41 <Belugas> the hell if i know what you are talking about
19:21:41 <fjb> Belugas: I usually search for the answers first. But I misread something there.
19:21:52 <BiA|pavel-css> Belugas i need that, Visual Studio will show me numbers of rows ...
19:22:50 <Belugas> ho... the number of the line you are at...
19:23:05 <fjb> You should not center the view on a plane that curves over an airport. Where is the paper bag?
19:23:39 <BiA|pavel-css> so ... i must click :(
19:23:43 <Belugas> i don't remember where it is, but i know there is a settingfor that BiA|pavel-css. search in the options, or in the gutter setting...
19:23:52 <Belugas> or use another editor than VS's one
19:24:25 <BiA|pavel-css> i dont have any other ... only notepad ... but he dont understand "enter"
19:24:45 <Maedhros> well there's one i've never heard before...
19:32:04 <Belugas> or notepad2 or notepad++ (googling for address)
19:32:43 <hylje> i do gui programming in vim
19:33:12 <Maedhros> i do all programming in vim
19:33:30 <Maedhros> and now i'm writing my thesis in it too ;)
19:33:53 <Maedhros> well, latex, strictly speaking
19:34:20 <BiA|pavel-css> oh, i should try Zend than
19:34:41 <Belugas> yahoo : "visual studio show line numbers"
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19:40:47 <Belugas> Eddi|zuHause3 : Can you repost the screenshot in english, this time, please?
19:40:47 <Phazorx> Maedhros: got a second?
19:40:47 <Maedhros> Phazorx: that depends on what you're about to ask me ;)
19:40:47 <Phazorx> Maedhros: TTRS related question
19:40:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> Belugas: i said what's on it in the text, do you really need more?
19:41:06 <Phazorx> we are trying to use it with 0 0 0 0, 1st 0 disabled default building... we have fountain replacement, which is default building, that gets disabled if ttrs is used with 1st param of 0
19:41:16 <Belugas> no, i guess it wold be fine
19:41:23 <Phazorx> can something be done on grf level to make that grf still appear?
19:41:32 <Phazorx> but w/o rest of original buildings
19:41:40 <Maedhros> Phazorx: you mean you've replaced the fountain graphics, presumably with an action A
19:42:06 <Maedhros> then no. just define a new building type with the fountain graphics
19:42:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> "not enough cash"... grmbl
19:42:54 <Phazorx> err... i might need more quidance than that
19:43:07 <Phazorx> particualar action perhaps so i can look at spec?
19:43:33 <Belugas> action 00, 01, 02, 03, 08
19:43:37 <Maedhros> umm, property 8, that is
19:43:52 <Belugas> 01,02,03 if ou define your onw gfx
19:44:04 <Phazorx> there is a sprite we want to use
19:44:05 <Belugas> otherwise, what Maedhros said
19:44:15 <Maedhros> Phazorx: this way is actually easier than editing ttrs3, trust me ;)
19:44:35 <Phazorx> i just dont do any grf work
19:44:42 <Phazorx> so i have to pass it along to someone else :)
19:44:44 <AntB> anybody want to tell me how to define it as a new sprite then?
19:45:04 <Maedhros> AntB: we just did :p
19:45:19 <Phazorx> thgergo, tune in too plz
19:45:20 <Belugas> why don't you take the opportunity to start doing grf? there is always a good time to start
19:45:48 <Phazorx> Belugas: i tihnk antb just followed same line and he is already way ahead
19:46:07 <Phazorx> and in mean time i can try to add some sanity to 30Kb of patches we have to deal with now
19:46:53 <AntB> in all honesty, i haven't a clue about half the NFO file for my party square thing
19:46:58 <Phazorx> Belugas: and it looks complex and interesting
19:47:22 <Phazorx> so i'd rather get acustomed to what it is and what it can do before actualy doing soemthing
19:47:35 <Phazorx> thgergo: you got the gist of it i hope :)
19:47:47 <thgergo> well, ill try to get a proper grf for it
19:49:04 <AntB> what order do i need to put the actions in?
19:49:17 <Maedhros> 08, 00, 01, 02, 03, preferably
19:49:33 <fjb> Why does everybody make that short train stations? I have been told my 11 tiles long stations are unrealistic monster. :-(
19:49:47 <Phazorx> can town zone be changed too ?
19:50:10 <Maedhros> (if you mean which town zone the fountain appears in)
19:50:11 <Phazorx> AntB: set it to be in burbs then plz - we'll have more of it
19:50:34 <AntB> well we wouldn't be able to see it in the middle of sky scrapers :P
19:50:52 <Phazorx> AntB: by defualt it will try to be in most downtown
19:51:20 * AntB settles in for many hours of trying to figure out NFO code
19:51:39 <Phazorx> ia it really that bad?
19:51:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> did i ever mention i love the new foundations?
19:52:30 <AntB> theres not enough examples and lists on the wiki for my liking
19:52:48 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause3: I haven't heard it from you, but then again, I'm missing quite a lot of what's being said here ;)
19:53:02 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: Me too! And it looks like your dream about rivers may come true.
19:53:16 <Phazorx> 0..4 1,2,4,8,10 which town zone(s) the building can be built in << that should be 16 not 10 i presume ?
19:53:48 <Maedhros> Phazorx: nope, that hexadecimal
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19:59:13 <Phazorx> Maedhros: relevant question
19:59:33 <Phazorx> setting ttrs 1st param to 1 and then moving date back - can it contribute to strane behavior
20:00:30 <Maedhros> possibly, but to be honest i have no idea
20:02:22 <AntB> do i need to use a00 p07 or a00 p08 does anybody know?
20:03:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> and once again i meet the limits of presignals...
20:03:04 <Rubidium> but somebody will know
20:03:17 <Phazorx> AntB: Maedhros were mentioned A8
20:03:53 <AntB> there isn't A8 for the property
20:04:27 <AntB> stuff it, play/headache time :D
20:08:03 <fjb> Why do the road / railroad crossings stop the traffic that late?
20:08:32 <AntB> no idea but one of many pennies has just dropped with me
20:08:59 <Maedhros> it's completely untested, but it should give you something to go on
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20:10:36 <AntB> umm... :) thats just confusing to me
20:11:53 <AntB> do i use a new psuedo sprite for each property i change?
20:12:08 <Maedhros> you can, but you don't need to
20:12:56 <AntB> does the ID number matter? or can that be anything?
20:13:48 <Maedhros> it can be anything, since it's local to this grf
20:14:01 <Maedhros> it'll get translated by openttd into something it can use
20:14:21 <AntB> phew :D sorry about all the questions btw, but I gotta start somewhere :D
20:14:55 <Maedhros> that's fine - it took me a long time to work out how to start writing grfs :)
20:15:08 <Maedhros> ...and that was after i'd added a fair amount of newgrf support to openttd!
20:15:35 <Belugas> big difference between following specs and writing gfs :D
20:16:33 <AntB> at a guess, i don't need property 8 (subsitute building type)
20:16:46 <Maedhros> yeah, that's the one property you *do* need
20:17:18 <Belugas> all the newhouses sytem is based on copying properties of an old house
20:17:57 <Belugas> if yu want to make it so that the "source" house will be replaced by yours, yo set prop 09 for that purpose
20:18:19 <Belugas> otherwise, you'll have both houses available, the copy and the source
20:18:34 <Belugas> and as a bonus, it is the same system with newindustries
20:18:42 <Maedhros> although in this case ttrs3 will have already disabled the source
20:18:46 <Belugas> see, newgrf ARE easy!
20:19:05 <Belugas> true... was talking in general :)
20:19:08 <AntB> thats good if i ever go for industries, and Belugas... yea...
20:20:31 <AntB> i dont even know what i'm subsituting tbh
20:21:50 <Maedhros> if you've got the source code, there's a landscape.html file in the docs directory - that'll tell you about the existing house ids
20:22:06 <Maedhros> there's one on the net somewhere too, but i can't remember where atm
20:24:30 <dihedral> AntB: you could simply replace the church :-P
20:24:41 <AntB> church is only 1 per town
20:25:03 <Wolf01> i'm getting multiple "new vehicle" news for the same vehicles
20:27:19 <Maedhros> are you sure there's only one vehicle type? i seem to remember one set using 3 identical maglevs - one for each cargo
20:27:40 <ln-> Bjarni: what are you going to do to ensure that your photo will be in the history books of the 2100's?
20:28:02 <Wolf01> these are the last 2, in the list i can see only one maglev of this type and the messages were at least 5
20:29:07 <Wolf01> at least, the first 2 might be the other 2 types, but the last 3 have the same picture
20:29:33 <Phazorx> how's tunnel price calculated?
20:29:41 <dihedral> uh Bjarni: i noticed that starting ./openttd -n <host> muddles up the picture...
20:31:42 <Maedhros> Phazorx: for every tile, it costs _price.build_tunnel + (however much has accumulated already / 8)
20:32:09 <Phazorx> Maedhros: only length
20:32:21 <Phazorx> no efffect on height ?
20:35:47 <fjb> Is the format of the save file documented anywhere?
20:36:39 <Maedhros> saveload.{h,cpp} may well be your best bet
20:37:01 <dihedral> on a mac - as one can see
20:37:36 <fjb> glx: Why did I know that answer? :-)
20:37:43 <Maedhros> dihedral: what happens if you start it with -d drv=9 ?
20:38:06 <dihedral> it works as long as i dont use -n <host>
20:39:15 <AntB> what years do i specify for any?
20:39:39 <dihedral> Maedhros: unknown debug level 'drv=9'
20:39:44 <dihedral> game menu is the same
20:39:55 <dihedral> but in game everything is fine, once connected to the server
20:40:00 <Maedhros> AntB: 10 - 150 (decimal)
20:40:33 <AntB> guessing that wants to be in HEX
20:41:06 <glx> fjb: search for _chunk_handlers
20:41:49 <Maedhros> AntB: 96 0A, actually - you have to think in little endian now ;)
20:42:44 <glx> fjb: and "static const SaveLoad" for detail of chunks
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20:43:30 <Maedhros> dihedral: try -d driver=9 instead
20:44:46 <dihedral> only the GM_MENU is muddled in that way then
20:44:58 <dihedral> as soon as i am connected the graphics are fine
20:46:08 <AntB> What values do i need to use for 3/8 pax/food acceptance?
20:46:28 <fjb> glx: I'm already reading...
20:46:55 <AntB> i don't know how to do 8ths in hex :)
20:47:31 <Maedhros> you don't need to - just put 3 :)
20:48:56 <glx> should be a <0 value for food :)
20:49:18 <Maedhros> yeah, FD should do it
20:49:50 <AntB> hmm... had an idea if i can get this done in time :P
20:52:27 <glx> anyway you can force cargo types with prop 1E
20:52:57 <Phazorx> are TTDp base costs different from OTTD?
20:53:21 <Phazorx> <AntB> want food not goods :D < ??
20:53:48 <AntB> for the party square phazor. unless you want goodie bags instead of food
20:55:49 <AntB> which number do i need to build in suburbs
20:56:08 <Phazorx> AntB: there are no food on temperate map
20:56:23 <Phazorx> so your square would be requiring something we can not provide
20:56:33 <glx> Phazorx: you can have food in temperate now
20:56:50 <Phazorx> glx: we do not with the curernt industry set we are planint to use it with
20:57:10 <Maedhros> time for me to disappear
20:57:13 <Phazorx> AntB: perhaps then you want to code it for all 3 climates and with a param for switching between food and goods ?
20:58:22 <Phazorx> once again: are TTDp base costs different from OTTD?
20:58:54 <Phazorx> hmm.. is ration between gbp and eur 1:2 ?
20:59:27 <DaleStan> If they are, it's probably a bug, and should be reported as such.
20:59:38 <Phazorx> in reality it is 15p/30e
21:00:10 <Ammler> Phazorx: you have 3 different cost levels
21:00:18 <Phazorx> that would amke sense
21:00:24 <Phazorx> what are the factors?
21:01:02 <AntB> glx: will property 13 not cover it?
21:01:57 <Phazorx> Ammler: sometihng like 0.75, 1, 1.5 ?
21:02:24 <AntB> which value do i need? the only place i don't really want it building is downtown
21:05:14 <Ammler> Phazorx: seems more like 075,1,1.1
21:05:21 <glx> AntB: 1, 2, 4, 8, 10 (1=further suburb, 10=center of town)
21:05:38 <glx> you can add values to mix zones
21:06:14 <AntB> so anywhere but center would be dec15?
21:07:00 <Phazorx> AntB: i'd suggect 7 tho :)
21:08:07 <Phazorx> so anywhere but downtown and city
21:08:18 <Phazorx> that's my not typing it right
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21:09:05 <AntB> you want it to contribute to town population phazor?
21:09:44 <Bjarni> <Sacro> Bjarni: simsig? <-- I'm working
21:09:49 <Bjarni> I have a deadline tomorrow
21:11:27 <Phazorx> AntB: i might be translating that one too literally but eventualy yes :o)
21:11:54 <Phazorx> not sure if delayed effect of paries is possible with grf structure :)
21:12:26 <Phazorx> AntB: make it same as church i think?
21:13:00 <Phazorx> parties a re generaly more popular
21:13:36 <Phazorx> of cource that isnt sensation black/white
21:13:39 <Phazorx> but at least soemthing :)
21:14:06 <BiA|pavel-css> after 3days of nightmare i can patch and compile ottd for myself :P
21:14:21 <Phazorx> BiA|pavel-css: with more than one patch?
21:14:46 <AntB> i'd better up the pax acceptance as well
21:15:02 <BiA|pavel-css> yeah .. BuildOTTD
21:15:57 <Bjarni> <dihedral> uh Bjarni: i noticed that starting ./openttd -n <host> muddles up the picture... <-- post a bug report... I don't have time for this now
21:16:14 <Bjarni> <ln-> Bjarni: what are you going to do to ensure that your photo will be in the history books of the 2100's? <-- I will write the books :P
21:16:46 <BiA|pavel-css> books like "free paper to fire" ? :P
21:17:07 <Bjarni> paper isn't good fuel :/
21:17:24 <BiA|pavel-css> but its good at starting fires ;)
21:17:26 <Bjarni> we have coal for at least 300 years... why not use it as it's way better?
21:17:43 <BiA|pavel-css> because, you cant write to coal? :P
21:18:04 <Phazorx> BiA|pavel-css: most people these days can only type
21:18:07 <Bjarni> whenever you get near it everything will turn black
21:18:36 <Bjarni> that would be writing with coal, not on it...
21:18:56 <Bjarni> you write on stone then
21:19:24 <BiA|pavel-css> so, you will write/type with coal on paper? :o)
21:19:48 <Bjarni> I just said that paper is inefficient fuel
21:20:05 <Bjarni> I didn't say that I would write something to burn
21:20:09 <Phazorx> usnig coal as part of batteries in laptops, as main ingridien of plastics, as part of capacitors and PCBs
21:20:13 <Bjarni> too many people do that
21:20:30 <Bjarni> they are called journalists
21:20:30 <BiA|pavel-css> soo what your books iwll be about?
21:20:53 <Bjarni> commercial steam train operation in the 21th century
21:21:18 <Bjarni> with a followup called "prospects for commercial steam train operation in the 22th century"
21:21:31 <Phazorx> Bjarni: as in steam engine model
21:21:51 <Phazorx> i mean the design of steam enghine
21:22:05 <Phazorx> steam used as working body concept
21:23:57 <Bjarni> they aren't very busy though
21:24:03 <Bjarni> but they do have clients
21:24:29 <De_Ghosty> coal is bad for enviormen
21:24:49 <Phazorx> coal is perfect for environemnt
21:25:09 <BiA|pavel-css> well, its hard to do steam with electrical? :)
21:25:12 <De_Ghosty> coal is full of bad stuff in it
21:25:23 <Phazorx> De_Ghosty: you get carbon dioxide and water
21:25:27 <BiA|pavel-css> and earth will run out of coal soon ^^
21:25:38 <De_Ghosty> burning coal creat acid rain
21:26:02 <Bjarni> <De_Ghosty> burning coal creat acid rain <-- filter out the sulfur to avoid serious acid issues
21:26:02 <De_Ghosty> why you think gov is pushing for nuke plant instead of coal fire plant
21:26:07 <AntB> then we'll have more coal come 3500 :P
21:26:19 <Phazorx> De_Ghosty: nuke has more yeild
21:26:20 <De_Ghosty> scrubber don't remove 100%
21:26:42 <Phazorx> but the are not pushing fit for environment reasons i can assuere you that :)
21:26:50 <Bjarni> <BiA|pavel-css> and earth will run out of coal soon ^^ <-- I just said that we have coal for at least 300 years
21:26:54 <De_Ghosty> i think it's cleaner
21:26:59 <De_Ghosty> there is plenty of coal...
21:27:04 <De_Ghosty> do we want to burn em?
21:27:07 <Phazorx> De_Ghosty: you should go to chernobyl then
21:27:22 <Phazorx> for a week, till you get 3rd eye and gills
21:27:32 <De_Ghosty> i'll get prostate cancer
21:27:32 <Bjarni> say hi to the 3 residents for me
21:27:38 <BiA|pavel-css> nuke plant have so low efficienci
21:27:48 <BiA|pavel-css> fussion power ftw
21:27:49 <ln-> Bjarni: what are you going to do to ensure that your photo will be in the history books of the 2100's?
21:27:50 <Bjarni> I don't know if you know them. They are called alpha, beta and gamma
21:27:55 <Phazorx> steam engine is very unefficient as well
21:28:01 <De_Ghosty> hey the nuke plant in japan survived a magnetude 6 earthquake without leak
21:28:05 <De_Ghosty> we have come a long way
21:28:18 <AntB> ghost: with UK govs record, you wanna risk a nuke plant?
21:28:25 <Phazorx> De_Ghosty: it's usualy humans pushing wrong buttons that are most threat to environent
21:28:25 <Bjarni> Kashiwazaki leaked even though they claimed otherwise at first
21:28:38 <Phazorx> not these with pencils designing stuff to withstand natural disasters
21:28:38 <De_Ghosty> i don't trust the brits
21:28:40 <BiA|pavel-css> nukes sux ... we should research better fussion power plants .... they already exist but we cant get from them maximum :P
21:28:42 <De_Ghosty> they went with bush
21:28:57 <De_Ghosty> fussion is possible now
21:29:05 <De_Ghosty> but it require more energy then we can extract..
21:29:10 <BiA|pavel-css> in gb, there is fussion power plant
21:29:19 <BiA|pavel-css> De_Ghosty not true now
21:29:24 <Bjarni> they are building a bigger one in France
21:29:34 <AntB> just so you know ghost, the so called UK democrocy isn't imo
21:29:34 <Bjarni> also there is a reactor in Germany
21:29:36 <De_Ghosty> yea and it produce negative 5 million mega watt right?
21:29:50 <BiA|pavel-css> now its about what it eat it produce ...
21:29:55 <Bjarni> I don't know about power output
21:30:13 <Phazorx> for these who say fussion is not possibel i reccomend looking at sun :)
21:30:18 <BiA|pavel-css> i know, i have red it
21:30:22 <De_Ghosty> power output for fusion is horrid right now
21:30:34 <Phazorx> De_Ghosty: look outside
21:30:47 <Phazorx> that horrid output been warming up the rock for passed 4.5B eyars
21:30:59 <De_Ghosty> pfft we can do fission since the 50's
21:31:10 <Phazorx> that's fusion not fission
21:31:13 <De_Ghosty> we need not explosive force
21:31:17 <AntB> i say more wind and solar plants
21:31:25 <BiA|pavel-css> solar plants ... noooo
21:31:31 <De_Ghosty> H bomb is a fission bomb
21:31:44 <De_Ghosty> fusion is hard to control and maintain
21:31:49 <BiA|pavel-css> they dont produce energy in life-time to reproduce them
21:32:22 <Bjarni> btw you are talking about modern high tech nuclear plants... you should compare it with modern high tech coal power plants.... comparing modern nuclear with 40 year old coal power plants will not give a valid picture
21:32:22 <Ailure> reminds me about alpha centauri
21:32:22 <De_Ghosty> to generate power we need a constant and stable supply
21:32:26 <Ailure> where the most powerful bombs
21:32:34 <AntB> i think i've got my action 00 finished :D
21:32:46 <BiA|pavel-css> solar is only good where u cant use anything else
21:32:50 <Ailure> while the weakest are just classic nukes
21:33:05 <Bjarni> modern coal powerplants are actually able to catch harmful stuff in the smoke and they can run on high efficiency
21:33:13 <Phazorx> BiA|pavel-css: it is pretty good in space
21:33:22 <Ailure> solar is a powerful source of energy, we just hadn't figured out a effective way of doing it
21:33:31 <Phazorx> sopviet stations as well as modern ones run on nothing but solar power for ages
21:33:33 <Ailure> technially, you can say that coal plants is solar energy :)
21:33:36 <Ailure> just delayed solar energy
21:33:39 <Bjarni> solar is awesome in space because there is no atmosphere to block the energy
21:33:56 <BiA|pavel-css> Ailure same as fussion we just hadn't figured out a effective way of doing it
21:34:01 <Ailure> there's been proposals to catch solar energy in space
21:34:02 <AntB> going to sim city: microwave plants!
21:34:07 <Ailure> and then send it down as microwave energy
21:34:11 <De_Ghosty> out atmosphere eat alot of uv
21:34:14 <Phazorx> Bjarni: we traveled quite a bit from subject
21:34:23 <AntB> just hope the satalite doesn't miss
21:34:25 <Bjarni> you guys goes off topic
21:34:25 <BiA|pavel-css> it will smash everything on earth :P
21:34:36 <De_Ghosty> just who ever is around it ll
21:34:38 <Phazorx> but about steam engines - steam as body for energy storage was deemed as very inefficient on concepotual elvel
21:34:42 <Ailure> it will more likely warm up other stuff slightly
21:34:51 <Ailure> it won't be like the simcity 2000 disaster
21:35:03 <BiA|pavel-css> better to try to transport energy from plant via microwaves :D
21:35:04 <Ailure> Simcity 2000 did have a disaster related to it heh
21:35:10 <Ailure> rather boring one though
21:35:16 <Ailure> just a random stream of fire
21:35:20 <Ailure> next to the microwave plant
21:35:40 <De_Ghosty> what we really need is some awsome new breakthrough
21:36:15 <Bjarni> so the Americans wants to put up energy collectors in space and beam the energy down to Earth in order to prevent global warming.... prevent a warmup by adding external energy...
21:36:17 <Ailure> talking about power plants
21:36:33 <Ailure> I thought on implementing nuclear energy chain for TTD
21:36:37 <BiA|pavel-css> OT (:D) hahah i rly know now, i compiled another ottd patched ;)
21:36:39 <AntB> personally i think microwave is a bad idea
21:36:57 <De_Ghosty> microwave is kinda..
21:36:58 <AntB> look at the one in your kitchen
21:37:02 <AntB> now shove the world in there
21:37:04 <Bjarni> we don't know what will happen to living tissue
21:37:15 <De_Ghosty> microwave is safe...
21:37:25 <De_Ghosty> but we never try bridging it over such a long distance
21:37:28 <Ailure> microwave is not the only way to transport energy down to earth
21:37:29 <AntB> look at how muck metal is in the world :P
21:37:32 <Bjarni> <De_Ghosty> microwave is safe... <-- if you are properly shielded, then yes
21:37:33 <Ailure> it's just one of th eproposed ways
21:37:43 <De_Ghosty> mircrowave just heat molecure
21:37:56 <De_Ghosty> it doesn't cause mutation
21:37:56 <Bjarni> ok, then microwave isn't safe if you are properly shielded
21:37:59 <De_Ghosty> u'd just get a burn
21:38:10 <BiA|pavel-css> i think if they will make microwaves ... i will move to other planet ^^
21:38:20 <AntB> use solar panels in space to charge massive battries and bring them down to earth every 5 years taking the old ones back up :P
21:38:21 <De_Ghosty> you don't get openttd
21:38:33 <Bjarni> because I will move too
21:38:37 <De_Ghosty> batteries are so inefficent
21:38:39 <Ailure> we are bombarded by natural mcirowave radiation
21:38:43 <Ailure> just in small quantiaties
21:38:56 <AntB> ghost: at least they kinda safe :D
21:39:12 <De_Ghosty> hey if you can store that much energy in a place
21:39:18 <BiA|pavel-css> water plants .... hover sams or how its called is cool
21:39:25 <De_Ghosty> risk is poportional to energy density
21:39:28 <Ailure> the radiation is easily higher
21:39:32 <Ailure> especially solar radiation
21:39:35 <AntB> hydro plants! build a load of them :D
21:39:40 <Bjarni> <De_Ghosty> batteries? <-- no, I will build coal powered steam engines to start an industrial revolution on the planet so we can have all the luxury goods we want to
21:39:41 <Ailure> due to the lack of atmopshere
21:39:43 <De_Ghosty> dam is bad for enviormen
21:39:58 <De_Ghosty> it require flooding of alot of land
21:40:02 <De_Ghosty> to build up require pressure
21:40:06 <Ailure> talking about coal powered engines and insutrial revolution
21:40:11 <Ailure> it honestly reminds me about my simearth games
21:40:14 <BiA|pavel-css> so wind plants ;)
21:40:21 <Ailure> where I make a polluting civilization as possible on mars
21:40:27 <Ailure> to warm up a otherwise cool planet
21:40:40 <Bjarni> wind plants works better if the air pressure is really high. If it's close to 0....
21:40:59 <BiA|pavel-css> with this global warming ... more hurricanes ... more wind to wind plant s:P
21:41:01 <AntB> some wind plants shut off if they start spinning too fast
21:41:09 <Ailure> wind plants aren't too effecgtive on mars
21:41:16 <AntB> prevents damage apparently
21:41:23 <BiA|pavel-css> i dont know how much wind is on mars
21:41:29 <Ailure> mars is windy but apparenlty the air pressure is lower too
21:41:39 <BiA|pavel-css> but jupiter!! theres alot of wint
21:42:14 <BiA|pavel-css> or we could get energy somehow from black holes :P
21:42:28 <Ailure> there's actually theories on how
21:42:32 <BiA|pavel-css> if it will not eat me :D
21:42:36 <Ailure> but don't expect that to happen
21:43:25 <Bjarni> <AntB> some wind plants shut off if they start spinning too fast <-- actually they will not spin too fast. The rotors will spin at a constant speed (like 19-22 RPM). They will stick to this speed even if the wind speed increases and if the wind is too strong, then they disconnect the generator electrically (not mechanically) and applies mechanical brakes to completely prevent it from moving
21:43:28 <BiA|pavel-css> age of ice will be here in couple of years and after that ... ppl will start stuing space more ;)
21:43:41 <Bjarni> it would break if it were just left to spin on it's own
21:46:09 <De_Ghosty> no the new wind turbins have auto break
21:46:15 <De_Ghosty> they won't damange that easily
21:47:36 <Bjarni> well... they do stop automatically
21:48:02 <BiA|pavel-css> if u press stop buttom :P
21:48:10 <De_Ghosty> there is a magenet break or something
21:48:12 <Bjarni> also they have the ability to turn the rotors so they aren't in direct line of the wind and then they will not absorb as much energy
21:48:31 <Bjarni> they stop during extreme conditions
21:48:47 <De_Ghosty> maybe for a hurrican
21:49:12 <Bjarni> I'm not talking about a regular storm, but really extreme conditions
21:49:32 <BiA|pavel-css> asteriod crash on earth?
21:50:23 <BiA|pavel-css> soo, u will pick with u a tank with water to run it :o)
21:50:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> all steam engines carry a water tank
21:52:33 <De_Ghosty> you guys making no sense lol
21:53:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> the concept is really simple...
21:53:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> fire+water = steam
21:53:33 <AntB> fire = pyromanic on the loose!
21:53:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> do not confuse steam with smoke
21:53:55 <Bjarni> you do it in a controlled environment
21:53:59 <Bjarni> this is called a firebox
21:54:58 <Bjarni> there is a sideeffect on steam locomotives... the human body is not built to have 1200 °C flames in front of it and a -20°C wind on the back
21:55:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> in germany you say "Vorne schwitzt man, und hinten klappert man mit den Zähnen."
21:56:04 <AntB> somebody want to help with with Action 2?
21:56:05 <Bjarni> notice the temperature of the flames... incinerators usually works with only 1000°C
21:56:43 <Bjarni> AntB: pick a female nick and go to a random channel and ask the very same question
21:57:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> preferably #lesbians ;)
21:57:26 <Bjarni> you will be overrun by guys right away
21:57:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> but don't tell Sacro
21:57:45 <AntB> not a situation i want to end up in Bjani
21:58:19 <TrueBrain> I feel like giving some kicks...
21:58:45 <TrueBrain> @kick Eddi|zuHause3 your request, my command
21:58:45 *** Eddi|zuHause3 was kicked by DorpsGek (your request, my command)
21:58:47 *** Eddi|zuHause3 has joined #openttd
21:58:48 *** Sacro was kicked by Bjarni (just carrying out the will of TrueBrain)
21:58:56 <TrueBrain> @kick Bjarni so you have to go too
21:58:56 *** Bjarni was kicked by DorpsGek (so you have to go too)
21:58:56 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Bjarni
21:59:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, i can come up with a better one ;)
21:59:08 <De_Ghosty> sooooo eddi is a sm guy huh
21:59:40 <Bjarni> Sacro: it's ok to come back now
22:00:21 <Bjarni> well we can always go to #lesbians to pick him up
22:00:36 <AntB> Bjarni: thats just wrong!
22:00:50 <BiA|pavel-css> YouTube link == Ban?
22:01:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, but apparently i'm too late :p
22:01:49 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3 posted a link to a lesbian movie of furry pussies o_O
22:02:59 <AntB> back to my question (now rephrased because of dirty minded individuals): Will somebody help me with GRF Action02?
22:03:30 * AntB bands his head on the nearest wall
22:04:15 <Bjarni> AntB just said that he bangs right now
22:04:26 <Bjarni> is it with right or left?
22:04:55 <Bjarni> but I'm not into SM :(
22:05:21 <BiA|pavel-css> am i missiong sth?
22:05:43 <BiA|pavel-css> what the hell u r talking about :D
22:06:12 <Bjarni> are you claiming that I have a dirty mind?
22:06:35 <BiA|pavel-css> no, hes an admin :D
22:06:56 <AntB> i /would/ claim that you have the dirtiest mind i know, but you haven't met the people i work with at the pub
22:06:56 <BiA|pavel-css> how can u wash ur mind? :o)
22:07:20 <AntB> BiA: sponge in one ear and out the other
22:07:30 <Bjarni> I could always try those mindwash people, but I don't think I would like that
22:08:18 * AntB goes back to the wiki in an attempt to save some of his sanity
22:08:27 <Bjarni> sometimes I wonder... if you get amnesia then you can play your games all over again and it will be like the first time
22:09:01 <Bjarni> what has M8 to do with this???
22:13:05 <fjb> Will a company using almost only planes right from the start of the game always be the richest with the highest score? Or is there any other concept to stand up against it?
22:13:52 <Phazorx> fjb: that cncept will fail in #wwottdgd game for sure
22:13:53 * AntB needs help with Action02
22:14:22 <Phazorx> and in most #openttdcoop games it will gaill to because of airmod we use now
22:15:36 <fjb> What mod is that? And will it fail in a plain nightly build, too?
22:17:02 <De_Ghosty> aircraft make most money
22:17:08 <De_Ghosty> but not much cargo delivary
22:17:55 <MarkSlap> 7326 crates of goods \o/
22:18:20 <MarkSlap> From a single sawmill
22:19:00 <fjb> Does much cargo delivery count more for the game score?
22:19:11 *** Frostregen_ has joined #openttd
22:19:51 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen
22:20:02 <De_Ghosty> i think money count most
22:20:07 <fjb> The most limiting factor for planes seam to be the small airports that you have in the early years of the game.
22:21:01 * AntB pokes anyone with any knowledge of GRF Action02
22:23:11 <AntB> which num-ents do i need for a party square thing?
22:23:50 <fjb> Hm, maybe something like passenger (or also freight) destinations would help to balance the game. The passengers would not take a plane if there is no other vehicle that catches them up after landing to move them further to their destination.
22:24:41 <AntB> in my GRF when i figure Action2 out :P
22:26:48 <fjb> How is that action dressed? :-)
22:28:54 <AntB> so far i've got 02 07 02
22:30:09 *** Progman has joined #openttd
22:33:38 *** Diabolic-Angel has quit IRC
22:34:44 *** Digitalfox has joined #openttd
22:36:05 * AntB just fills in 00 for the missing bits in action 2
22:37:52 * AntB does the same again for action 3 :(
22:40:55 *** Digitalfox has joined #openttd
22:43:50 <Phazorx> AntB: having fun yet ?
22:44:01 <AntB> Well i'm testing the GRF now
22:44:21 <AntB> hopefully, 02 and 03 aren't that importent :D
22:45:44 <Digitalfox> I can't acess any java site without crashes
22:46:06 <AntB> Java has been a bit dodgy...
22:47:03 <Digitalfox> AntB: Yeah, but it sucks, since it kills all my firefox windows, and even chatzilla :(
22:47:15 <Digitalfox> It stops responding
22:48:25 <Digitalfox> well, maybe, but still there are a lot of sites that use it..
22:51:55 <Digitalfox> well i just updated to the last 1.6.0 b3, i'm hoping it will help or it will just crash again..
22:52:18 <AntB> I dont use java sites unless i can help it anyway
22:52:41 <AntB> the only time i really come across java is that annoying water effect >:(
22:55:22 <Digitalfox> And it crashes.. Damn why can't there be just one or two programming languages for creating sites that are easy to work with and easy to deal with...........
23:00:11 <AntB> lol, you wanna start counting languages for sites? :P
23:24:09 <fjb> Strange, when I load the Dutchtrams grf right after creating an new game the trams have a much highter running cost then when I load that grf before creating a new game.
23:24:52 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: glx * r11341 /trunk/src/ (newgrf.cpp newgrf_callbacks.h): -Codechange: add missing callback ID enums, add stub for house property 20 and reorder unimplemented action 0 properties
23:26:04 <fjb> AntB: what is konkregate?
23:26:28 <fjb> Inflation? I don't think so. I never unpaused the game after creating it.
23:26:49 * fjb doesn't have a flash player. :-)
23:31:31 <fjb> Adobe, in it's endless wisdom, has choosen not to support my computer.
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23:39:21 <fjb> Why do people have to chaet in a game like this that is more than easy to play with the default settings?
23:42:36 <fjb> Why don't they just watch the AI? That is even more easier then playing them selfes.
23:43:07 <Belugas> because cheating allows for easier debugging
23:44:07 <glx> no need to cheat for money when debugging ;)
23:44:41 <fjb> It's ok for debugging. I see the sense in that. But many people seam to use it in ordinary game play.
23:45:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: egladil * r11342 /trunk/src/ (os/macosx/splash.cpp video/cocoa_v.mm):
23:45:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: [OSX] The cocoa driver incorrectly assumed that the blitter always was
23:45:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: 8bpp. Now both 8bpp and 32bpp blitters can be used. The driver will check the
23:45:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: blitter screen depth. In fullscreen it will select a proper video mode for this
23:45:17 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: depth, and in windowed mode it will simply skip doing fake 8bpp.
23:46:11 <AntB> Do you know anything about Action02?
23:47:02 <glx> be more specific, action 2 can be used for a lot of things
23:47:32 <AntB> Using it for a "house" which accepts pax and food and produces pax
23:48:10 <Belugas> [19:46] <+glx> no need to cheat for money when debugging ;) <--- shortcut? i was not aware...
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23:50:01 * AntB was reading the wrong page
23:50:47 <glx> you were looking VarAction2Houses ?
23:51:30 <glx> that is mostly used for callbacks
23:51:37 <AntB> that explains it then :)
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23:54:17 <Phazorx> glx: things that affect base values of things, in case of loaded scn should reinitialize?
23:56:05 <Belugas> Phazorx, a scenario brings his own values at start
23:56:17 <Belugas> savegame just continues where it left
23:56:26 <Belugas> i don't get our question
23:56:33 <Phazorx> Belugas: how about scn convertted from a save with grfs that modify these costs ?
23:56:58 <glx> it will use modified costs I think
23:57:07 <Phazorx> and what do i do itf it does not?
23:57:59 * Belugas thinks Phazorx should look for it himself and find out why
23:58:10 <Phazorx> Belugas: i have no clue
23:58:24 <Phazorx> but i can provide -d 9 log of loaded save
23:58:42 <Ammller> Belugas: its the thing I have mentioned this evening already
23:58:46 <Phazorx> along with most crucial grfs
23:59:06 <Phazorx> Ammller: but i am sure i seen it work today once
23:59:38 * Phazorx is going to convert savs to scns few times now
continue to next day ⏵